where does Dirk rank among all time greatest PFs?

[TheMarkMadsen]

I know your agenda.. But I'll be fine with it if you can give me a good argument

what's my agenda? how does anything Dirk affect anything Kobe or Laker related?

Dude is a fringe top 20 player all time, Duncan & KG were clearly better, Dirk has 0 all defensive team selections..

0

it's hard to build around a guy like Dirk, a 7 footer who loves to play like he's a damn shooting guard and has no toughness inside. Cuban spent a decade surrounding Dirk with incredible talent and yet he still get's a pass

I'd love to see how many people would sit here and tell me Lebron/Kobe had no help if their teammate left them and became a b2b MVP in the process while eliminating Lebron/Kobe's team from the playoffs the very next year.

KG & Duncan are an absolute lock imo, Dirk could never touch KG's defense and toughness, and the scoring differential isn't enough to make up for it either

[TheMarkMadsen]

i love how this clown has a Dirk avatar and is acting like he's unbiased in this discussion

[TheMarkMadsen]

KG: 12x all nba defense (9x first team)

4x rebounding champion

2008 DPOY



what are Dirk's defensive accomplishments?

[ArbitraryWater]

Huh? Dirk is top 20 but you have McHale ahead of him? Where do you have McHale, bruh?

Tell me more about this incredible talent... Where was it from 2005-2013?

Okay, you can have KG ahead of him.. But dont act like its a blowout, either. The playoff performances between the 2 is actually in Dirk's favor, comfortably.

Edit: Why are you focusing on Defense? We already know KG has the upper hand there.

And they both average the same RPG in the Playoffs, lol.

[TheMarkMadsen]

Huh? Dirk is top 20 but you have McHale ahead of him? Where do you have McHale, bruh?

Tell me more about this incredible talent... Where was it from 2005-2013?

Okay, you can have KG ahead of him.. But dont act like its a blowout, either. The playoff performances between the 2 is actually in Dirk's favor, comfortably.

Edit: Why are you focusing on Defense? We already know KG has the upper hand there.

And they both average the same RPG in the Playoffs, lol.

The difference on defense is too large between KG and Dirk

one is arguably the 2nd best two way player of the last 25 years, the other was a defensive liability for majority of his career.

[RicksPlace]

The difference on defense is too large between KG and Dirk

one is arguably the 2nd best two way player of the last 25 years, the other was a defensive liability for majority of his career.

Still all that defensive awards meant nothing when they they meet in the playoffs. Don't get me wrong, KG is one of my favorite players ever, but sometimes even I overrate his defense. Also, Dirk is still going strong and is still the best shooter in the league at age 36. That counts for something.

[TheMarkMadsen]

Still all that defensive awards meant nothing when they they meet in the playoffs. Don't get me wrong, KG is one of my favorite players ever, but sometimes even I overrate his defense. Also, Dirk is still going strong and is still the best shooter in the league at age 36. That counts for something.

Did Curry die?

[DMAVS41]

The difference on defense is too large between KG and Dirk

one is arguably the 2nd best two way player of the last 25 years, the other was a defensive liability for majority of his career.

Kobe doesn't play power forward.

As for the OP...after Duncan...it can go in any order.

Malone, Barkley, Pettit, Dirk, Garnett...really don't care the order a ton. For me it goes something like;

1. Duncan
2. Pettit
3. Dirk
4. KG
5. Malone
6. Barkley
7. McHale

But again...any order is fine.

Clowns...like the above...acting like there is a large gap between KG and Dirk is just silly. In no way could one objectively look at KG and Dirk and think that one was considerably a better basketball player than the other.

[TheMarkMadsen]

[/B]

Kobe doesn't play power forward.

As for the OP...after Duncan...it can go in any order.

Malone, Barkley, Pettit, Dirk, Garnett...really don't care the order a ton. For me it goes something like;

1. Duncan
2. Pettit
3. Dirk
4. KG
5. Malone
6. Barkley
7. McHale

But again...any order is fine.

Clowns...like the above...acting like there is a large gap between KG and Dirk is just silly. In no way could one objectively look at KG and Dirk and think that one was considerably a better basketball player than the other.

what aspect of basketball was Dirk better at than KG

3pt shooting? OK, what else?

Literally the only thing Dirk does better than KG is score an extra 2 1/2 points per game, and that's with KG's last 2 years in Boston and his time in Brooklyn included.

KG is more versatile, a better defender, better playmaker, better passer, plays with more intensity, isn't soft, more efficient and all around a better player please tell me when Dirk could ever dream of averaging 24/14/5/2/2 for an entire season?

KG has years where he averaged 6 assist per game with 22 points and 14 rebounds plus 2 blocks, Dirk never got close to this type of all around dominance.

not to mention KG was an absolute beast on the offensive boards, which Dirk never was, his career offensive rebounds per game are worse than some guards
Dirk can shoot the 3 better, that's about it to be honest

[ArbitraryWater]

what aspect of basketball was Dirk better at than KG

3pt shooting? OK, what else?

Literally the only thing Dirk does better than KG is score an extra 2 1/2 points per game, and that's with KG's last 2 years in Boston and his time in Brooklyn included.

KG is more versatile, a better defender, better playmaker, better passer, plays with more intensity, isn't soft, more efficient and all around a better player please tell me when Dirk could ever dream of averaging 24/14/5/2/2 for an entire season?

KG has years where he averaged 6 assist per game with 22 points and 14 rebounds plus 2 blocks, Dirk never got close to this type of all around dominance.

Dirk can shoot the 3 better, that's about it to be honest

Do a year-for-year comparison between the 2 and tell me its not close...

Mine:

2000-2004: KG
2005-2007: Dirk
2008: KG
2009-2015: Dirk

[RicksPlace]

Did Curry die?

No, he is still alive, but imho Dirk is a better open shooter by a small margin. Also, the way he makes his teammates better just because of his presence and mismatches is very underrated. Curry is unbelievable, though.

[SupermanOnSteroids]

Curry's probably the better shooter at this stage of Dirk's career, but Curry doesn't cause all the mismatches and open floor spaces that Dirk does as a PF.

[TheMarkMadsen]

No, he is still alive, but imho Dirk is a better open shooter by a small margin. Also, the way he makes his teammates better just because of his presence and mismatches is very underrated. Curry is unbelievable, though.

Curry took double the amount of 3's last season per game than Dirk and still shot a higher %



not gonna compare 2pt FG% with a pg and a pf.

[pastis]

you know marfvcksen, just one thing.

the fact that you minimalize dirks game to his shooting shows me that you have absolutly no clue about dirk and his game. dirs post game is/ was one of the best.
you can read everywhere how versitile dirks play was and is, in how many ways he can score, how entire defense are focused on hm, creating space for others etc.

but well, saying dirk is fringe top 20 player...but for you kobe is top10?

kobe is never top 10, by far never. one charity mvp. meangless, overrated, by his own coach destroyed all-def selections. without shaq a beta. without super stacked team with gasol, artest, bynum, odom and goat coach he wins nothing, truly nothing.

same with garnett. garnett stopped playing when playoffs started. i give a **** about you 14 reb 22 ppg in a regular season.

dirk is way better tha grnett ever was.

[DMAVS41]

what aspect of basketball was Dirk better at than KG

3pt shooting? OK, what else?

Literally the only thing Dirk does better than KG is score an extra 2 1/2 points per game, and that's with KG's last 2 years in Boston and his time in Brooklyn included.

KG is more versatile, a better defender, better playmaker, better passer, plays with more intensity, isn't soft, more efficient and all around a better player please tell me when Dirk could ever dream of averaging 24/14/5/2/2 for an entire season?

KG has years where he averaged 6 assist per game with 22 points and 14 rebounds plus 2 blocks, Dirk never got close to this type of all around dominance.

Dirk can shoot the 3 better, that's about it to be honest

doesn't work like that mate. can't break the game down like that thinking you just tally up skillsets or something.

dirk's mere presence on offense is more valuable than anything skillwise KG provides to be honest.

we could go back and forth for hours. with me saying similar things like...KG could never score 28 ppg in a championship playoff run and have a 61% TS and the most clutch playoff run since early 90's MJ.

basketball is a great game because there are so many ways to play. and some aspects, when mastered, trump all around play.

you see assists, but how many scoring chances does Dirk create on his pick and pop alone? I mean...did you ever really watch Dirk play in his prime...hell, even now? Take a look...our guards get wide open lanes to the basket because other teams are afraid to leave Dirk 25 feet away from the basket without the ball.

and could you provide some evidence that Dirk has been a defensive liability the majority of his career? I'll give you his early years up to about 02, but really don't see any evidence past that....and that is with Dirk being surrounded by poor defenders and playing nellie ball as well.