Havlicek vs Pippen

[greatest-ever]

Whos higher on your all time list?

[GreggPopazit]

I don't think I can accurately evaluate Havlicek. My guess is Pippen had better defense though.

[Pushxx]

Havlicek no question.

[T_L_P]

I don't think I can accurately evaluate Havlicek. My guess is Pippen had better defense though.

Your guess? That's basically fact.

[WillC]

Hondo was a great defender though.

[Roundball_Rock]

I don't think I can accurately evaluate Havlicek. My guess is Pippen had better defense though.

They are basically the same player. Havlicek was the 70's version of Pippen. Great defender, great all-around player, playmaker as a SF, winner of numerous championships, etc.

[oarabbus]

Lol really?

I'll take the guy with 8 rings and the FMVP. Too easy.

[pauk]

Havlicek...

Dude is 8 of 8, by X of X in Finals logic he is GOAT..... screw Pippen, how bout Hondo vs Jordan? :)
In 99% of those Finals he was the leading scorer / best offensive player, while Bill Russell covered him defensively (even tho Havlicek was a great defender aswell) he completely took care of the offense for them, has an FMVP aswell (just got in time barely in 1969 when that award started)....

[greatest-ever]

Lol really?

I'll take the guy with 8 rings and the FMVP. Too easy.

So by your ring counting logic, Hondo>Most of the guys in the top 10.

Id take Hondo too but your logic is weak. And they are close for what its worth.

[bizil]

Gotta be Hondo! GOAT wise as well as peak. As stated before, he was the precursor to Pippen in many ways at the SF. Later on Pippen added Dr. J type size and athletic ability to the equation. But when it comes to the TOTAL PACKAGE at the SF on both sides on the rock, Bron is the only SF I would take over Hondo.

[CavaliersFTW]

Resume wise - Havlicek.

Who's the better player? Flip a coin.

[T_L_P]

Gotta be Hondo! GOAT wise as well as peak. As stated before, he was the precursor to Pippen in many ways at the SF. Later on Pippen added Dr. J type size and athletic ability to the equation. But when it comes to the TOTAL PACKAGE at the SF on both sides on the rock, Bron is the only SF I would take over Hondo.

[bizil]

When it comes to Pip, I've said it before and I've said it again. He was an alpha dog gene away from being the arguably the GOAT SF. And from being a top 10-15 GOAT. He was too skilled, too accomplished, and too revolutionary not for it to happen. Guys like Baylor, Barkley, and Malone are rated ahead of Pip on most GOAT lists WITHOUT even winning a ring.

So Pip is stuck with the perception that he was a great player BUT not a great scorer/killer. The problem with that is u have guys like a Hondo, MJ, Magic, Bird, Bron, West, Wade, etc. who were great all around players AND alpha dogs in one.

So those kind of guys will ALWAYS take precedence over Scottie. To all Pip fans out there, Im not shitting on him. I'm just stating he was DAMN CLOSE to being arguably the GOAT SF IF he showed a bit more brilliance scoring wise. He has more rings than Bird and Bron COMBINED!! So surely if he was seen on that level, he would be rated AHEAD OF BOTH on a GOAT list...

[bizil]

When it comes to offense and defense as a package, Bron is the ONLY SF who has done it better than Hondo. Overall at SF, Im taking Bird or Bron peak wise and GOAT wise. But in terms of two way shit, give me Bron and Hondo! Pip wasn't an alpha dog. Bird wasn't a great individual defender.

[T_L_P]

When it comes to offense and defense as a package, Bron is the ONLY SF who has done it better than Hondo. Overall at SF, Im taking Bird or Bron peak wise and GOAT wise. But in terms of two way shit, give me Bron and Hondo! Pip wasn't an alpha dog. Bird wasn't a great individual defender.

So you're saying in terms of two-way play Hondo is the second best SF? I can get behind that (though I don't necessarily agree).

But are you saying you'd draft Hondo over Bird? That's what it sounded like you were saying. That was I inserted the .