I finally get it James Harden haters want refs to intentionally not call fouls

[UK2K]

I've seen both of them play rather than watching one and watching the box scores of the other.

If you had seen both players play the distinction would be clear.

I have watched them both play. I watched the Thunder choke down the stretch.

But again, you're basing off purely your opinion. Well my opinion is Harden should get 50 free throws a night, cause he earns them.

So let's go round and round and argue over who takes it to the rack harder...

Harden draws fouls. That's his game. It's no different than when I slow down on a fast break to let someone run into me as I shoot my lay up. Is it dirty? No. Is it a foul? Yes. Is it clever? I think so, cause 3 points> 2 points right?

If you're in a bad defensive position, I will make you foul me. Its just the way it is.

Same way in the NFL when receivers stop on a dime to get the cornerbacks to hit them. Pass interference. Is that a dirty play? No. Is it clever? I think so. Free yards is free yards right?

[He Strong]

So now that statistically I show you Westbrook shoots more fouls on less drives, now the argument has moved to 'Westbrook earns his', which is in no way quantifiable. That is purely your opinion.

Keep moving the goal posts.

I never moved the argument, you did. I have only argued that it is a matter of getting the calls right. You are the one who made it about number of free throws per shot attempt.

[24-Inch_Chrome]

I have watched them both play. I watched the Thunder choke down the stretch.

But again, you're basing off purely your opinion. Well my opinion is Harden should get 50 free throws a night, cause he earns them.

So let's go round and round and argue over who takes it to the rack harder...

Choking down the stretch has what to do with the level of contact Westbrook takes?

Your opinion is wrong.

Westbrook flies by defenders and gets hit hard going to the rim, Harden rungs alongside the defender and flails both his arms at the slightest hint of contact.

[Milbuck]

I could swear that he posted that Kentucky was better than a few NBA teams

[Im so nba'd out]

ImSoPlayedOut getting straight MURKED in his own thread.

Time for a new alt breh!

please dont try to talk like us you're not black and it looks so awkward



you dont have enough piff to talk like us little guy

[UK2K]

I never moved the argument, you did. I have only argued that it is a matter of getting the calls right. You are the one who made it about number of free throws per shot attempt.

You said Harden gets 6-8 undeserved free throws per game.

So youre implying that the guy with the fourth most drives in the entire NBA should probably only get 2-4 free throws per game.

I pointed out that Westbrook shoots 10% more free throws per 36 on less drives. Then you argue he earns them.

You moved the argument to an unquantifiable argument and now were bitching about differing opinions.

[UK2K]

Choking down the stretch has what to do with the level of contact Westbrook takes?

Your opinion is wrong.

Westbrook flies by defenders and gets hit hard going to the rim, Harden rungs alongside the defender and flails both his arms at the slightest hint of contact.

Nothing. I'm just telling you I watched their last few games. Almost all of them over the last two weeks.

Westbrook goes all out at the rim. I agree with that.

But I don't agree that Harden gets fouls he doesn't deserve, because 90% of the time, he is fouled. It may not be hard or pretty, but it is a foul.

Just like the little rip through jump shooters use to get fouled on their shots, its a foul. I don't like it, but a foul is a foul. I don't agree with a lot of block/charge calls either (offensive players have such an advantage) but its called like it's called. Per the rule book, its a block so, OK.

[He Strong]

You said Harden gets 6-8 undeserved free throws per game.

So youre implying that the guy with the fourth most drives in the entire NBA should probably only get 2-4 free throws per game.

I pointed out that Westbrook shoots 10% more free throws per 36 on less drives. Then you argue he earns them.

You moved the argument to an unquantifiable argument and now were bitching about differing opinions.

My very first post in this thread:

I don't mind the legit foul calls, but he gets roughly 4-6 undeserved free throws per game.

You randomly bring up Westbrook as if his # of free throws is relevant to whether Harden's fouls are legit or not. That is you changing the topic, not me. Also, you changed the # I said from 4-6 to 6-8. Stop completely changing what I said to start a straw man argument.

[Im so nba'd out]

Just seen a video where steven a smith is hating on harden for getting fouls .You hating azz fakkits really want the refs to rig the game and not give him calls.i can see if you fakkits would say everyone should get calls like him but no you just want him to not get calls.fu[COLOR="Black"]c[/COLOR]king haters

[MiseryCityTexas]

Just seen a video where steven a smith is hating on harden for getting fouls .You hating azz fakkits really want the refs to rig the game and not give him calls.i can see if you fakkits would say everyone should get calls like him but no you just want him to not get calls.fu[COLOR="Black"]c[/COLOR]king haters

Seriously everyone would be on Wades nuts when he drew fouls from the refs. People are biased as hell.

[Phenith]

After getting a chance to watch his game more closely in the playoffs, I can understand where the hate comes from... he does the same thing Lou Williams does for the Raptors. He lunges forward and into the defender, and instead of protecting the ball, he holds it out and tries to get his arms into the defender to "draw contact". It's pretty cheesy, but if he were on "your" team... you would love it (at least I love it when Lou does it to his defender and they are all like 'WTF!', lol).
This is also what leads to his high TO totals... when he drives and extends his arms with the ball leaving it way out there to be slapped at. Many times the ball gets slapped away clean and Harden's body language makes it look like a foul. In reality, his TO totals and those of other players that use that move are probably a little lower than they should be as they get a foul call on some player where it would be a legit TO.

A lot of it has to do with body language and Harden, amongst others have come close to mastering it.

Hate all you want, but these players are just taking advantage of the rules as they are currently.

*NOTE* - I am ignoring phantom calls because realistically all the superstars get these calls so it's a mute point.

[Yoshi]

Only for him.


He is so effective that they (his haters) think the only way he can play bad is if the refs go out of their way to not give him calls.


This is lebron/durant level hate right here where they basically want the rules changed just to stop him even kobe didnt get this type of hate


how great is our James!

He just gets the benefit of doubt that other players don't get. They need to call it evenly.

LeBron's issues are a bit of the opposite. His teams are given more benefit on defense, and he can play more physical without getting calls against him.

[UK2K]

He just gets the benefit of doubt that other players don't get. They need to call it evenly.

LeBron's issues are a bit of the opposite. His teams are given more benefit on defense, and he can play more physical without getting calls against him.

No he's just really good at drawing fouls.

Rarely do I see a foul called in his favor, when it wasn't a foul.

I did see a foul in game 2 with LAC that the ref probably could have let go (I would) but 9 times out of 10, its a clear foul.

As Uncle Drew would say, 'don't reach young blood'.

The art of good man defense is gone. Nobody slides their feet anymore. Players now play with their hands. That's their fault, not Hardens.

[Im so nba'd out]

After getting a chance to watch his game more closely in the playoffs, I can understand where the hate comes from... he does the same thing Lou Williams does for the Raptors. He lunges forward and into the defender, and instead of protecting the ball, he holds it out and tries to get his arms into the defender to "draw contact". It's pretty cheesy, but if he were on "your" team... you would love it (at least I love it when Lou does it to his defender and they are all like 'WTF!', lol).
This is also what leads to his high TO totals... when he drives and extends his arms with the ball leaving it way out there to be slapped at. Many times the ball gets slapped away clean and Harden's body language makes it look like a foul. In reality, his TO totals and those of other players that use that move are probably a little lower than they should be as they get a foul call on some player where it would be a legit TO.

A lot of it has to do with body language and Harden, amongst others have come close to mastering it.

Hate all you want, but these players are just taking advantage of the rules as they are currently.

*NOTE* - I am ignoring phantom calls because realistically all the superstars get these calls so it's a mute point.

Sounds like the haters should be mad @ the ref for calling fouls based on body language.

[Phenith]

Sounds like the haters should be mad @ the ref for calling fouls based on body language.

I agree, I even called it cheesy... but I'm sure the refs could start calling flopping now and again and that would make some happy and others not. It's like block/charge, except never gets called a charge.

The best call on the questionable ones is "no call", but "superstars" get the benefit of the doubt a lot.