The greatest "respond to losses" championship runs ever...

[BlueandGold]

It's at least arguable as a stat... which I hate using to make my point compared to raw game film but losses do suck and as a competitor of course everyone is going to be trying harder after a loss.

[GrapeApe]

Did I say that he does? I'm just pointing out the obvious contradiction of Kareem compared to other players

its funny because most people here are falling for the usual bullshit with Kareem that they try to discount when talking about Kobe (ring count with no context and scoring totals)

Nobody here watched Kareem play, they just rank him based off rings and scoring totals.. the same shit that you guys giving Kobe fans hell for bringing up.. even though Kobe's last 3 titles >>>> Kareeem's as far as impact and performance.. yet it doesn't matter here because "RANZ & SCORING TOTALS"

Kareem misses the playoffs and wins MVP.. but nobody on ISH cares, they just list off his accolades with no context..

"Kobe had Shaq".. Ok.. Kareem had Oscar and Magic

That'd be like Kobe playing with Shaq and Duncan...

you guys fall into the same trap that you constantly berate Kobe fans for doing.. no actual context with career totals and ring count.. yet since nobody ever watched Kareem play and everybody hates Kobe nobody cares to actually look into the context..

just because some old farts who grew up in the 70's and 80's want to hold on to the thought that the best player during their childhood is the undisputed GOAT or 2nd GOAT doesn't make it fact..

if Kobe missed the playoffs and won MVP wouldn't that be constantly ridiculed? If Kobe averaged 20. 19 and 14 ppg during his last 3 championship runs do you think anybody would really care about those rings?

If Kobe scored 4pts in game 7 of the NBA finals and won wouldn't that be constantly ridiculed


Kareem gets the biggest double standard I've ever seen when compared to current GOATS like Kobe and Lebron

it's f[COLOR="Black"]uc[/COLOR]king laughable really

Again, you make some great points. The part about the "old farts" may be true, I'd wager that HOF basketball minds such as Phil Jackson, Pat Riley, Pop, etc...would also contend that Kareem is at worst a top 3 player all time. We as fans tend to have a very flawed and inconsistent way of analyzing players, which is part of your point. In fact, if you asked those coaches to discuss the GOAT player rankings, their criteria and views would likely be wildly different from that of fans. I don't think they would care about who played with who, who won titles with who, or how much help a player had. That stuff is mostly nonsense really.

Anyway, I apolgize to OP for contrubuting to the derailing interesting thread.

[Magic 32]

Shaquille O'Neal 2000 (8 Games, 6-2 record)

26.3 ppg, 15.0 rpg, 2.8 apg, 52.1 fg%



Best performances...

Game 5 vs Kings: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ljHfXm_OlxE
Game 4 vs Pacers: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ljHfXm_OlxE
Game 6 vs Pacers: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HzIZ6YtJzto

[Magic 32]

Slightly surprised by Shaq.

Expected his 2000 numbers to be astronomical.

[SouBeachTalents]

If not record wise, statistically LeBron in 2012 deserves mention

32/11/5 on 50%

[Magic 32]

Tim Duncan 2003 (8 Games, 7-1 record)

25.8 ppg, 13.9 rpg, 4.8 apg, 3.1 bpg, 51.1 fg%



Best performances...

Game 4 vs Lakers: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RagMsVeyfLk
Game 2 vs Mavs: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QSa5HiPeQz0
Game 5 vs Nets: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TrPaEqpA81U

[LAZERUSS]

Chamberlain in '67.

4-0

25.0 ppg, 28.3 rpg, 9.0 apg, .627 FG%.

Oh, and he held his opposing centers (Dierking, Russell, and Thurmond) to a collective .340 FG% in those four games.

[Magic 32]

Chamberlain in '67.

4-0

25.0 ppg, 28.3 rpg, 9.0 apg, .627 FG%.

At least 5 games for this list.

Just to avoid 1 game elevating the whole bunch (see Shaq in 2002)

[Magic 32]

This one is difficult...

Hakeem Olajuwon 1995 (7 Games, 5-2 record)

31.6 ppg, 10.0 rpg, 3.4 apg, 2.3 bpg, 53.1 fg%

Hakeem Olajuwon 1994 (8 Games, 6-2 record)

27.0 ppg, 12.9 rpg, 3.8 apg, 4.0 bpg, 49.5 fg%

I went with 1995. Both amazing.

[LAZERUSS]

At least 5 games for this list.

Just to avoid 1 game elevating the whole bunch (see Shaq in 2002)

For the record, how about Wilt in his team's four losses in the '67 post-season?

26.8 ppg, 23.5 rpg, 6.0 apg, and on a .558 FG%. He was almost as dominant in those losses, as he was in his wins.

[Magic 32]

For the record, how about Wilt in his team's four losses in the '67 post-season?

26.8 ppg, 23.5 rpg, 6.0 apg, and on a .558 FG%. He was almost as dominant in those losses, as he was in his wins.

Sure.

But I still think "response" games are valid as a subject.

[LAZERUSS]

At least 5 games for this list.

Just to avoid 1 game elevating the whole bunch (see Shaq in 2002)

Not really fair to players who were so dominant that their opposing teams were annihilated.

For instance, in Alcindor's (Kareem) title run in '71...

His team went 12-2 in that post-season. In his only two "response" games, he played 39 and 43 minutes in games in which his team won by 50 and 23 points. In those two games, he averaged 27 ppg, 18.5 rpg, and on a .657 FG%. BTW, those two games were against Thurmond and Wilt.

Hell, Moses in his '83 playoff run only had one opportunity for a response, and he responded with a 28 pt, 17 reb, 4 blk, 12-18 FG/FGA (.667), and 4-4 FT/FTA game, and on a .700 TS%.

And why is the cut-off five games? Again, Wilt's '67 run came with a 4-0 record, and with a staggering stat-line of 25.0 ppg, 28.3 rpg, 9.0 apg, and on a .627 FG% (all while holding his opposing centers, two of which are in the HOF, to a collective .340 FG%.)

[Magic 32]

Not really fair to players who were so dominant that their opposing teams were annihilated.

For instance, in Alcindor's (Kareem) title run in '71...

His team went 12-2 in that post-season. In his only two "response" games, he played 39 and 43 minutes in games in which his team won by 50 and 23 points. In those two games, he averaged 27 ppg, 18.5 rpg, and on a .657 FG%. BTW, those two games were against Thurmond and Wilt.

Hell, Moses in his '83 playoff run only had one opportunity for a response, and he responded with a 28 pt, 17 reb, 4 blk, 12-18 FG/FGA (.667), and 4-4 FT/FTA game, and on a .700 TS%.

And why is the cut-off five games? Again, Wilt's '67 run came with a 4-0 record, and with a staggering stat-line of 25.0 ppg, 28.3 rpg, 9.0 apg, and on a .627 FG% (all while holding his opposing centers, two of which are in the HOF, to a collective .340 FG%.)

Why the cut-off?

I looked at MJ's 2 games from 1991 and Shaq's 4 games from 2002 and decided to go with a larger sample. I could say 7 games and still keep the current list.

I think that more losses shows that the performances were needed (that the opponents were competitive).

[LAZERUSS]

Why the cut-off?

I looked at MJ's 2 games from 1991 and Shaq's 4 games from 2002 and decided to go with a larger sample. I could say 7 games and still keep the current list.

I think that more losses shows that the performances were needed (that the opponents were competitive).

Kareem gets screwed in '80 then, as well.

4-0.

34.8 ppg, 13.8 rpg, .529 FG%, .829 FT%.

[Magic 32]

Lebron fans can decide which one should be included (winning vs stats once again)

2013 (7 games, 7-0 record)

26.4 ppg, 7.7 rpg, 6.3 apg, 2.1 spg, 49.3 fg%

2012 (7 games, 4-3 record)

32.4 ppg, 10.7 rpg, 4.9 apg, 1.4 spg, 50.9 fg%