Will this be the first year LeBron doesn't lead his team in scoring?

[guy]

Are you seriously trying to throw shade on averaging a triple double?

No not really, if anything I'm giving credit to how great he's been before this season. I would throw shade if he's specifically holding back his scoring and actively trying to average a TD.

[guy]

I'm glad that you're having a rational debate with me about this, but honestly, if you really believe 27/7/7 is better than 20/10/10, then you're pretty dull and I'm not really interested in debating it.

I'm dull yet you're just enamored by the visual appeal of 20/10/10. Okay.

Is 20/10/10 really that much better then 21/9/7, 20/10/7, 22/9/6, or 19/9.5/9.5? Cause those have happened before and no one really cares and no one would say they are even close to as good as most of Lebron's best seasons.

[guy]

Yes it does. As the leader of a team, your main goal is to get your team to perform at their peak every night. Doing extra things or even laying back a little to help your team succeed is much more valuable than scoring more just because it looks better to you on a stat sheet.

20/10/10 vs 27/7/7 doesn't mean you're doing extra things, it means you're doing less in some categories and more in others and it's the same vice versa.

The leadership standpoint is true. But that doesn't make it statistically more impressive. Jordan held back some aspects of his game for Pippen to flourish, Duncan did the same for Parker/Ginobili, etc. It was good leadership and the right thing to do, but that doesn't mean there production those years were more impressive.

[moongaze]

Kyrie got to the line a lot more than usual against the rockets. 8-8. It resulted in the highest scoring game of the season for him. If he can average between 6-8 free throws a game hell be even more of a nightmare to stop. Going back to the start of the playoffs to the first four games of the season(25 games total) Kyrie is shooting over 45 percent from three. That's a solid percentage for over a quarter of a season worth of games. This season, it looks like he refined his shot even more.

[moongaze]

Position is irrelevant. Even if you want to go by some "points responsible" type metric the difference is minimal and the flawed logic there is that the guy making the assist would deserve 100% of the credit for each assist, when they shouldn't especially with 3s which is probably the most difficult shot to make that would also achieve an assist.

I agree about assists. Points scored is 100 percent the individuals doing. Assists as a stat isn't as significant to me because it's dependant on the person you passed it to making the shot. Some assists are more the passers doing others are the person making a basic pass to a guy that happened to make the shot. I put more significance on rebounding numbers than assists. Averaging 10 a game is impressive. If lbj can keep that up along with a high assist to turnover ratio along with 20 points I'd call it a great season for him.

[SamuraiSWISH]

I think his career trajectory, especially playing along side Kyrie Irving, he'll take a deliberate back seat in that regard but try to provide elsewhere in other departments.

Particularly facilitating as he's more of a point guard than Kyrie himself. A much better facilitator.

I see 24 / 8 / 8 for the season. With a continuing trend going forward of LeBron being a low, less than 25 ppg scorer.

[imdaman99]

Kyrie is the best scorer on the team anyway. He is the craftiest. That doesn't mean he's the best player, far from it. Lebron is still miles ahead in that, because he can pace the team and act as a facilitator, which we haven't really seen from Kyrie. I don't see Lebron dropping to #3 on the team in scoring behind Love though

[Dragonyeuw]

When Bron come into the league, I think more people expected Magic Johnson type numbers( what he was posting in his MVP years, maybe not quite as many assists, but approaching double digits) than being a 27-30ppg scorer in his prime. I think he prefers the facilitator role moreso than having to be dependent upon for high scoring, and asides from Wade in 2011, Kyrie represents the first teammate he's had where he can really pick his scoring spots and the team is all the better for it. After last years finals, I had a strong suspicion that Kyrie would assume a larger scoring role, while Lebron plays the facilitator. It's still early in the year though, so I expect both Lebron and Kyrie will be in 23-25 ppg range.

[Smoke117]

When Bron come into the league, I think more people expected Magic Johnson type numbers( what he was posting in his MVP years, maybe not quite as many assists, but approaching double digits) than being a 27-30ppg scorer in his prime. I think he prefers the facilitator role moreso than having to be dependent upon for high scoring, and asides from Wade in 2011, Kyrie represents the first teammate he's had where he can really pick his scoring spots and the team is all the better for it. After last years finals, I had a strong suspicion that Kyrie would assume a larger scoring role, while Lebron plays the facilitator.

2012 Wade > Kyrie as a scorer. If Wade was playing with this older Lebron who had nothing to prove anymore that would be more readily apparent. He still wanted to be the man and the leading scorer then though so Wade had take a step back...that and his knee was starting to bug him.

[Dragonyeuw]

2012 Wade > Kyrie as a scorer. If Wade was playing with this older Lebron who had nothing to prove anymore that would be more readily apparent. He still wanted to be the man and the leading scorer then though so Wade had take a step back...that and his knee was starting to bug him.

I first had 2011 and 2012 Wade before removing the '2012' from the post. You may be right, but basically otherwise he's never had a player alongside him that gives him the luxury to coast on offense over a season. I still expect his numbers to be 27+ in the playoffs though...

[Father Prime]

Kyrie will average 24ppg+ and Lebron will average below that.

[Prometheus]

I agree about assists. Points scored is 100 percent the individuals doing. Assists as a stat isn't as significant to me because it's dependant on the person you passed it to making the shot. Some assists are more the passers doing others are the person making a basic pass to a guy that happened to make the shot. I put more significance on rebounding numbers than assists. Averaging 10 a game is impressive. If lbj can keep that up along with a high assist to turnover ratio along with 20 points I'd call it a great season for him.

So if i am the roll guy for kyrie, and he gets me the ball on a wide open cut for an easy uncontested dunk, you really mean to tell me that i am more responsible for those two points than he was? If he draws a double team and gets me an easy short jumper, thats 100% me and he isnt kinda responsible too?

[Prometheus]

I'm dull yet you're just enamored by the visual appeal of 20/10/10. Okay.

Is 20/10/10 really that much better then 21/9/7, 20/10/7, 22/9/6, or 19/9.5/9.5? Cause those have happened before and no one really cares and no one would say they are even close to as good as most of Lebron's best seasons.

The visual appeal means nothing. I would just as quickly take 20/10r/9a over 27/7/6. The rebounds is just a bonus for me btw. Like i would take a guy who gets 20 pts and 10 dimes over 27 and 7 even if they were identical rebounders. I think the value of the assists does more for the team than raw numbers convey

[Fire Colangelo]

2012 Wade > Kyrie as a scorer. If Wade was playing with this older Lebron who had nothing to prove anymore that would be more readily apparent. He still wanted to be the man and the leading scorer then though so Wade had take a step back...that and his knee was starting to bug him.

I would say that 2012 Wade was a better better than Kyrie, but I would argue that Kyrie is a better scorer. I'd also argue that Kyrie's skill set makes him a better fit with LeBron.

[Fire Colangelo]

The visual appeal means nothing. I would just as quickly take 20/10r/9a over 27/7/6. The rebounds is just a bonus for me btw. Like i would take a guy who gets 20 pts and 10 dimes over 27 and 7 even if they were identical rebounders. I think the value of the assists does more for the team than raw numbers convey

So 09 Chris Paul > 13' LeBron?