MJ is GOAT

[3ball]

I dare anyone to offer reasons to the contrary

[FKAri]

1-9 =)

[bullettooth]

1-9 =)

3/9

8pts

Holder of the #1 and #2 greatest margin of loss in NBA finals history

Your balding idol is a glorified loser.

[TheCorporation]

1-9

Less points than Bron

Less rings than Russell

Cant shoot

Average defense

[GimmeThat]

And the United States have had communist like years of leadership while outside a time of war

incest like relationships are not considered as offer to the contrary

[TheCorporation]

Number of seasons where Mike made it out of 1st round w/o Scottie = 0


Number of seasons where Scottie made it out of 1st round w/o Mike = 2 (1994, 2000)

Wow is this true? 3ball?

[Wally450]

OP is a troll who doesn't even watch basketball.

[TheCorporation]

OP is a troll who doesn't even watch basketball.

True.

One Last dagger for OP:

Jordan lost with an all star teammate (1990, 1995)

LeBron won without an all star (2016)

[Manny98]

10 reasons why he's not GOAT



1. Played in a weak era (expansion draft watered-down the talent in the league Bird said so himself)

2. Team only had a 2 win drop off without him proving his impact isn't GOAT

3. Poor 3 point shooter

4. Poor longevity

5. 1-9

6. Weakest finals competition of anyone in the top 10

7. Losing record to the majority of his rivals ( Zeke,Bird,Keem)

8. Missed the playoffs in his 14th and 15th seasons

9. He's not the GOAT of anything

GOAT scorer - KD
GOAT defender - Pippen
GOAT passer - Magic
GOAT winner - Russell
GOAT all around - LeBron

10. Losing to this guy in a 1 v 1

[3ball]

1-9 > missing playoffs

Less points than Bron just like Bird has less points than Reggie Miller

Less rings than Russell and Horry too - but only MJ has all-time levels of rings/stats/accolades

Cant shoot except anytime he tried

Average defense except when magic, drexler, miller, starks, majerle, hawkins all shoot
40% against him

Fixed

[SpaceJam2]

10 reasons why he's not GOAT



1. Played in a weak era (expansion draft watered-down the talent in the league Bird said so himself)

2. Team only had a 2 win drop off without him proving his impact isn't GOAT

3. Poor 3 point shooter

4. Poor longevity

5. 1-9

6. Weakest finals competition of anyone in the top 10

7. Losing record to the majority of his rivals ( Zeke,Bird,Keem)

8. Missed the playoffs in his 14th and 15th seasons

9. He's not the GOAT of anything

GOAT scorer - KD
GOAT defender - Pippen
GOAT passer - Magic
GOAT winner - Russell
GOAT all around - LeBron

10. Losing to this guy in a 1 v 1

No need for me to pile on.

Its over

[3ball]

The bulls won 55 in 1994 without him

The same roster that three-peated in 1993 only won 47 games in 1989, and would've missed the 45-win playoff cut without MJ.. In other words, MJ started with a lottery cast of unproductive young players

1994 simply proved that the Bulls developed their system exceptionally well, so that it became a 6x unbeatable champion with MJ, and 2nd round without.

Btw, the Bulls' triangle needed scoring champion production from the #1 option to win a ring - it never won without it.. So only MJ would do because only MJ won a ring and the scoring title in the same year (6 times), along with Kareem/Shaq once each in their peak seasons of 71' and 00'.. These were the only skillsets goat enough to fit scoring champion amounts into a championship/winning framework

Pippen was the best 2nd option

Pippen was only good for 3 years alongside MJ - 1991-1993 - he sucked every other year and was bad in MOST big series:

1988 PLAYOFFS:[COLOR="White"].[/COLOR] 10.0 on 46.5%
1989 PLAYOFFS:[COLOR="White"].[/COLOR] 13.1 on 46.2% (9.7 on 40.4% in ecf)

1990 ECF[COLOR="White"].[/COLOR] vs[COLOR="White"].[/COLOR] DET:[COLOR="White"].[/COLOR] 16.6 on 42.8% (2 pts, 1-10 in game 7)

1992 ECSF vs NYN:[COLOR="White"].[/COLOR] 16.0 on 40.2%

1994 ECSF vs NYN:[COLOR="White"].[/COLOR] 21.7 on 40.5% (worst-ever 1st option w/ goat choke)

1995 ECSF vs ORL:[COLOR="White"].[/COLOR] 19.0 on 40.9%

1996 ECSF vs NYN:[COLOR="White"].[/COLOR] 15.6 on 33.0%
1996 FINAL vs SEA:[COLOR="White"].[/COLOR] 15.7 on 34.3%

1997 RD 1 vs WAS:[COLOR="White"].[/COLOR] 16.7 on 38.3%
1997 ECF[COLOR="White"].[/COLOR] vs. MIA:[COLOR="White"].[/COLOR] 16.8 on 41.7%

1998 ECF[COLOR="White"]S[/COLOR] vs[COLOR="White"]N[/COLOR] IND:[COLOR="White"].[/COLOR] 16.6 on 39.2%
1998 FINAL vs UTA:[COLOR="White"].[/COLOR] 15.7 on 41.0%

[COLOR="Navy"]Pippen's stats in 96-98 Playoffs - 17 on 40%[/COLOR]

And despite his best years, the 91-93' Bulls still had weaker on-paper talent than their Finals opponents and numerous other opponents because they got murdered at the #3-12 spots

This is common knowledge

Furthermore, any player with 3+ rings had a better 2nd option for 3 Finals or more - i.e. lebron (11-13' and many would argue 16' as well)

But MJ won 3 rings without the best 2nd option from 96-98' - Pippen averaged 17 on 40.8% for the 96-98' playoffs, while old Rodman averaged 4/8 in the 97' playoffs and wasn't the starter in 98' playoffs.

MJ played weak teams and/or in a weak era

It's a common fact that parity (even playing field) makes it harder to win, not easier

The 90's jazz, sonics, lakers, rockets and suns were all Finals teams - they had to beat each other (fellow Finals teams) to make the Finals.. Otoh, today's conferences each have 1 super-team that has an auto-pass to the Finals (heat/spurs and cavs/warriors)

Whereas everything had to fall perfectly to make the Finals in the 90's West - 4-5 teams took turns having their monumental year and losing to MJ in the Finals.. but the peak of these teams was every bit as high as the spurs/warriors' peak - any of those teams could've beaten the Warriors/Spurs, just like Houston showed last year or the clippers showed this year

6/6 isn't a good argument

MJ is goat because only MJ has all-time levels of rings, stats, and accolades

So Finals record isn't even necessary

However, it's a true symbol of goatness because it's a result OF goatness.. only the goat can be 6/6.. 6/6 is a function of the unbeatable teams that resulted when MJ successfully fit GOAT scoring and clutch into an equal-opportunity system
.

[superduper]

10 reasons why he's not GOAT



1. Played in a weak conference (weakest conference the history of the game has ever seen). Proof:



2. LOTTERY TEAM only had a +2 in wins WITH LeGOAT from the previous season WITHOUT LeGOAT proving his impact isn't GOAT.

3. Garbage 3 point shooter

4. Padded longevity stats

5. Missed playoffs entirely first 2 seasons

6. Weakest first 3 rounds competition of anyone in the top 10

7. Losing record to the majority of his rivals (Duncan, Kawhi, Durant, Curry, Terry, Diaw, Barea)

8. Missed the playoffs after he activated playoff mode

9. He's not the GOAT of anything

GOAT scorer - MJ
GOAT defender - Payton
GOAT passer - Magic
GOAT winner - Russell
GOAT all around - MJ

10. Losing to this guy in a 1 v 1

[k0kakw0rld]

Kareem is GOAT

- Most points scored in the entire league (record)
- 6 rings
- 2 fmvps
- 6 mvps (NBA record)
- ROY
- 11x all def team
- 19x all star
- Greatest college player ever

GREATEST BASKETBALL PLAYER EVER.
Sir Alcindor we are not worthy.

[3ball]