Scottie Pippen won 55 games with Horrace Grant as a #2 option

[TheCorporation]

Horrace Grant. In 1994.

Grant did 14.8 ppg

How many other teams won 55 games with your #2 doing under 15ppg? Pippen's impact is incredible.

[jstern]

I read an article about how they were projected to win around 48 games, but they were on a mission without Jordan.

Having said that, it shows how great Jordan's off the ball style is, that actually allows for a team to develop. If Jordan was playing the Lebron ball system to a t in 1993, then they were not going to win anything near 48 or 55 games in 1994.

[SouBeachTalents]

Malone won over 60+ games b2b years with a 15 ppg 2nd option

Duncan won 60 games & the title in '03 with a 15 ppg 2nd option

[iamgine]

36 years old Karl Malone did it.

[HoopsNY]

Hakeem won 58 games with 14 ppg second option.

Sixers won 56 games with Iverson's second leading scorer at 12 ppg.

2005 Mavs won 58 games with the second option averaging 15.7 ppg

Rick Barry led his team to a championship with just 48 wins averaging 30 ppg and the next leading scorer averaging 14.

Dominique Wilkins led the '86-'87 Hawks to 57 wins with a 2nd option averaging 16 ppg.

Karl Malone in 2000 did it. His next best averaged about 14 ppg.

2010-11 Dirk led a 60 win team with the second option averaging 15.8 ppg

Portland won 59 games in 1999-00 with the second option winning 14.9 ppg.

This has happened a lot or something close to it.

[Roundball_Rock]

Yup, and they were 51-21 when he actually played, so nearly a 60 win team when he did.

I read an article about how they were projected to win around 48 games, but they were on a mission without Jordan.

They were projected to miss the playoffs by most. After all, they lost the GOAT at the last minute and replaced him with nothing.

I don't think the 55 wins with Grant are what stick out. It's that they lost a player of MJ's caliber, got nothing for him (usually teams can sign a free agent or the player leaves in a trade), and still remained contenders.

[Overdrive]

Wade nearly won the finals with a 17 ppg 2nd option.

[Roundball_Rock]

This has happened a lot or something close to it.

Sure but look at teams when Russell, Wilt, Shaq (twice), Magic, Bird, Jordan, LeBron (thrice) left their teams in or near their primes. All were contenders with those players; only one was without that player and MJ stacked the deck against the team by retiring so late.

[97 bulls]

Sure but look at teams when Russell, Wilt, Shaq (twice), Magic, Bird, Jordan, LeBron (thrice) left their teams in or near their primes. All were contenders with those players; only one was without that player and MJ stacked the deck against the team by retiring so late.

Right. And just to add on to the latter of your statement, the other teams actually replaced the players mentioned with some viable, solid players. Not a perennial CBA player like the Bulls did.

[LostCause]

Right. And just to add on to the latter of your statement, the other teams actually replaced the players mentioned with some viable, solid players. Not a perennial CBA player like the Bulls did.

You mean Toni Kukoc, Steve Kerr, Bill Wennington and Pete Myers?

[guy]

I read an article about how they were projected to win around 48 games, but they were on a mission without Jordan.

Having said that, it shows how great Jordan's off the ball style is, that actually allows for a team to develop. If Jordan was playing the Lebron ball system to a t in 1993, then they were not going to win anything near 48 or 55 games in 1994.

Which is ironic, because somehow this is used as an argument against Jordan and for Lebron when it should be the other way around.

[97 bulls]

You mean Toni Kukoc, Steve Kerr, Bill Wennington and Pete Myers?

Kerr took Paxsons role. Wennington replaced the role of Scott Williams or Stacey King.

Kukoc was a rookie but fine. So what? The Bulls replaced PRIME Michael Jordan with a perennial CBA player and a rookie 2nd round draft pick that couldn't even speak the language when he first arrived. Really?

[AlternativeAcc.]

94 was the beginning of the downfall for Jordan

- Responsible for Dads death
- Quits basketball
- Team dominates without him
- Tries baseball, is horrifically bad at it
- Gets humiliated out of baseball
- Comes back in 95 only to choke miserably in the 2nd round
- 96 finals gets outplayed by Kemp, Payton, and Rodman
- 97 and 98 has by far the most stacked teams just like his whole career, plays 9ppg 2nd option Hornecek in the finals back 2 back
- Quits again after 98
- Comes back in 2003, one of the worst players in basketball, charity case, lottery team
- Goes onto become the worst GM/Owner in the history of professional sports


Let me know if I missed anything.


Space Jam was his peak, and even that will be tainted once Space Jam 2 comes out

[97 bulls]

Hakeem won 58 games with 14 ppg second option.

Sixers won 56 games with Iverson's second leading scorer at 12 ppg.

2005 Mavs won 58 games with the second option averaging 15.7 ppg

Rick Barry led his team to a championship with just 48 wins averaging 30 ppg and the next leading scorer averaging 14.

Dominique Wilkins led the '86-'87 Hawks to 57 wins with a 2nd option averaging 16 ppg.

Karl Malone in 2000 did it. His next best averaged about 14 ppg.

2010-11 Dirk led a 60 win team with the second option averaging 15.8 ppg

Portland won 59 games in 1999-00 with the second option winning 14.9 ppg.

This has happened a lot or something close to it.

Notice the teams mentioned are led by guys that many feel Pippen has no business being compared to. Hmm.

[Overdrive]

Kerr took Paxsons role. Wennington replaced the role of Scott Williams or Stacey King.

Kukoc was a rookie but fine. So what? The Bulls replaced PRIME Michael Jordan with a perennial CBA player and a rookie 2nd round draft pick that couldn't even speak the language when he first arrived. Really?

Kukoc was a rookie just like Luka was. Both seasoned pros. Not saying Toni is on Doncic' level.

Sure but look at teams when Russell, Wilt, Shaq (twice), Magic, Bird, Jordan, LeBron (thrice) left their teams in or near their primes. All were contenders with those players; only one was without that player and MJ stacked the deck against the team by retiring so late.

The Bulls were as much contenders as the 97 Magic were. The Bulls were a good team without MJ, but no way they win.