Why 1980 Kareem playoff run is overrated

[Roundball_Rock]

Good points. The other thing is even the people who still have KAJ #2 or #3 all-time don't realize how great KAJ was in the 80's. They seem to think he was old and a minor contributor. The reality is he was old but a major contributor for most of the decade.

I did a thread on this weeks ago but if we only looked at KAJ's 80's resume, 80's KAJ would still be top 30-35 all-time. http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/sho...m-Abdul-Jabbar

Accolades: 1 MVP, 6 all-NBA (4 first, 2 second), 5 top five MVP finishes, 3 all-D (two first), FMVP (robbed in 80’), 10 all-star selections.
Stats: 21/8/3 with 2 blocks in both the season and the playoffs.
Team results: 5 rings, 8 finals, 9 WCF.

For some perspective, compare his accomplishments in the worst half of his career with the career total accomplishments of other players.

Players with 6 all-NBA selections: Curry, Kidd, Harden, Elvin Hayes, Frazier, Mikan, Carmelo
Players with 4 all-NBA first teams: Dirk, Havlicek, Robinson, Garnett, Moses, Chris Paul, Frazier, Sharman, Davies, Zaslofsky
Players with 10 all-star selections: Allen, Carmelo, Arizin, Drexler, Durant, Greer, Kidd, C. Paul, Pierce, Robinson, Stockton
Players with 1 MVP: Kobe, Shaq, Hakeem, Durant, Harden, Westbrook, Dirk, Garnett, Iverson, Barkley, Robinson, Dr. J, Walton, Oscar, Reed, Cousy. This is an incomplete list but covers most of them.

16,246 points over the decade.

His MVP finishes from 1980-1986 were: 1st, 3rd, 10th, 10th, 4th, 4th, 5th.

So he had five top 5 MVP finishes in the 80's, including a 1st. As a comparison, Hakeem had six top 5 MVP finishes and one 1st place finish in his 18 year career.

In the NBA finals he went: 33/14/3, 18/8/4, 24/8/3, 27/8/4, 26/9/5, 22/7/1, 13/4/1, 13/5/2. These lines don't mention his blocks, such as 5 BPG in 80'.

So he kept producing at a high level in the finals until his age 41 and 42 finals.
If you simply average the averages they are 22/8/3. For some perspective, the finals career average for other big men are K. Malone 20/10/3, KG 17/9/3, McHale 18/7/1, Reed 20/10/3, Cowens 22/13/4, Parish 15/8/1, Dirk 24/10/3.

[RRR3]

As long as they know that Kawhi is better then Kareem. Kawhi didn't need a teammate who more then triples his assist % like Kareem always had with Oscar/Magic.

Better than Kareem

[Lakers Legend#32]

Magic as a 19 year-old was the Man on the '80 team.

[StrongLurk]

Kareem is a mount rushmore player along with Wilt, MJ and Lebron.

Show some respect.

[TheCorporation]

Kareem is a mount rushmore player along with Wilt, MJ and Lebron.

Show some respect.

75% right. I can't put Wilt in there with those three behemoths. He didn't win enough and didn't have elite level consistency either.

Conference wins/Finals appearances:

Kareem = 10
LeBron = 9 (could be 10 if they close out nuggets)
Jordan = 6
Wilt = 6

Okay, so Wilt is on the lower end for top 10 players but look at his competition

Magic = 9
Kobe = 7
Duncan = 6
Shaq = 6
Bird = 5

[TheCorporation]

Magic didn't need Kareem to anchor #1 offenses, 63 win teams, and make it to the finals. When raptors do that, you can let me know. That's my point, has nothing to do with old Kareem besides he was carried to his final two rings. Lakers replaced Kareem with Divac and were still #1 offense! All Kareem had to do was be better then Vlade Divac to win a title. Magic took Divac to 3 wins away from a title. Magic also eliminated Drexler's blazers when Kareem was at his retirement home. Sorry but Lakers have way more success without Kareem then Raptors have proven without Kawhi. Magic is a top 5 GOAT and Lowry is like top 100 on a good day, I don't know what you want me to tell you.

So then you admit swapping Jordan for Pete Myers shows that Bulls didn't need Jordan? Thanks for the confirmation

Kareem > Jordan

Top 5 goes like this

1. LeBron
2. Kareem
3. Russell
4. Jordan
5. Magic/Shaq *take your pick*

[houston]

#Cherrypicking.

The missing the playoffs stuff is BS. They missed the playoffs because they went 3-14 (not 17-5) without him. That is his fault? He improved that 14 win pace to 44 wins. Kawhi could only dream of raising a team that much. The next case the Lakers, a roster gutted to acquire Kareem (whereas Kawhi goes only from stacked team to stacked team), had a top 4 record in the WC but missed the playoffs under a rule then that said only the top two teams in each division could make it.

Let's cherry pick Kawhi. We can't have free reign on KAJ but it is "scum" and "hate" to do the same exact thing to Kawhi:

Cherry Picking Kawhi

*Drafted to a 61 win team (1 seed) but failed to win until 2014.
*Wins a FMVP as a role player in 14', for the same reasons and same numbers as Iggy did the next year.
*Not an all-star until his 5th season.
*15/11 with 0.9 APG in the 13' finals. Decent numbers, except the embarrassing assist total--but KAJ would get roasted if he ever went 15/11.
*Bounced in the first round as defending champions. Kawhi outplayed by Duncan, Griffin, and Paul.
*Loses with a 67 win team in the second round. Durant crushes Kawhi in their match up. Kawhi outplayed by Durant, Westbrook, and Aldridge.
*Spurs' internal analytic (per Colin Cowherd) shows the team isn't any better with Kawhi.
*Kawhi quits on the Spurs altogether in 2018. Spurs lose in the 1st round as a healthy Kawhi sits at home.
*Kawhi traded to another 1 seed and they win due to injury luck--but their performance without Kawhi was the same as with him. Their win pace was slightly higher without him, in fact.
*Kawhi demands the Clippers add an all-NBA 1st team player to a team that already had Williams, Harrell because all he knows is stacked teams his entire career (afraid of the challenge?). The Clippers wind up with a worse record than the team that "lost" the great Kawhi and made no major additions to the roster.

This is a joke comparison when one guy has 6 MVP's and the other guy is a 4-time all-star.

Please add what happen in the playoffs with Kawhi this year lolol

[72-10]

can't forget Kareem's (an ATG) legendary performance in the 1983 playoffs - had incredible production on offense considering the wear on his knees, shot the ball well, and defended well racking up some blocked shots records that still stand today, only real weakness was in rebounding where he jousted with other greats of the game with more girth like Artis Gilmore and Moses Malone and lost the rebound battle in the paint