Jordan won 6 rings in a weak 22-27 team league, half were expansion.

[HoopsNY]

Stockton was never a MVP candidate. That he was never a MVP candidate is used against him by people like Bill Simmons because he is the only top 40 all-time player to never be. He got a few 4th or 5th place votes in some years, like a lot of players do. Here is his "highest" finish:

1988-89 1st 2nd 3rd 4th 5th Tot

[22May89] (10) (7) (5) (3) (1) Pts

Magic Johnson (LAL) ..... 42.5 664.5
Michael Jordan (CHI) .... 27.5 598.8
Karl Malone (UTA) ....... 5 362
Patrick Ewing (NYK) ..... 8 200
Hakeem Olajuwon (HOU) ... 2 179.3
Charles Barkley (PHI) ... 0 94.3
John Stockton (UTA) ..... 0 28
Kevin Johnson (PHO) ..... 0 22
Tom Chambers (PHO) ...... 0 20
Mark Price (CLE) ........ 0 18

Same with 90% the other players Chewbacca referenced. 9th place in MVP is not being a MVP candidate. Let's hone in on 96':

1995-96 1st 2nd 3rd 4th 5th Tot

[20May96] (10) (7) (5) (3) (1) Pts

Michael Jordan (CHI) .... 109 3 0 1 0 1114
David Robinson (SAN) .... 0 54 29 14 9 574
Anfernee Hardaway (ORL) . 2 21 23 19 21 360
Hakeem Olajuwon (HOU) ... 1 1 9 18 20 238
Scottie Pippen (CHI) .... 0 11 18 14 17 226
Gary Payton (SEA) ....... 0 7 0 13 10 98
Karl Malone (UTA) ....... 1 0 8 7 14 85
Shawn Kemp (SEA) ........ 0 3 6 7 1 73
Grant Hill (DET) ........ 0 2 5 5 9 63
Shaquille O'Neal (ORL) .. 0 2 4 7 8 63
John Stockton (UTA) ..... 0 1 1 0 0 12
Charles Barkley (PHO) ... 0 0 0 2 2 8
Earvin Johnson (LAL) .... 0 0 0 1 5 8
Alonzo Mourning (MIA) ... 0 0 1 0 1 6
Dennis Rodman (CHI) ..... 0 0 0 1 1 4
Terrell Brandon (CLE) ... 0 0 0 1 0 3
Mitch Richmond (SAC) .... 0 0 0 1 0 3

This is what I mean, you love creating your own parameters but never allow anyone else to create theirs. Furthermore, you're lying or being deceitful again.

Stockton 1990: One 3rd place vote
Stockton 1991: One 3rd place vote (though finished 12th overall)
Stockton 1995: One 1st place vote, two 2nd place votes, one 3rd place vote
Stockton 1996: One 2nd place vote, one 3rd place vote (though finished 11th overall)
Stockton 1998: One 3rd place vote (though finishing 13th)

So two years he's top ten with multiple votes in the top 3 categories. Does this make him a bonafide candidate in comparison to the elite players like MJ, Hakeem, Robinson, Shaq, and Malone? Certainly not. But the same goes for Pippen.

In addition, you already mentioned Shaq and Penny. In 1998, Payton finished 3rd overall and Baker got three 3rd place votes. Guess that doesn't count, either? How about Duncan and Robinson?

In 1996, Payton got seven 2nd place votes and Kemp had three 2nd place and six 3rd place votes. Guess that doesn't count, either, right?

In 1995, both Stockton and Malone received 1st and 2nd place votes. Let's disqualify that too because it doesn't fit TheFakeBullsFan's criteria.

In 1992, both Mullin and Hardaway received 2nd and 3rd place votes. Yup, let's disqualify that as well.

Being 9th doesn't qualify. Great. Now how many times did Pippen finish in the top 5? Just once. But we're supposed to hinge the entire argument on that? Amazing. And notice you can set that limitation, but no one else can set theirs.

You can't win with you, not because it's about winning, but because you create your own criteria that in some cases works against you. When others on this forum point it out, you switch parameters and then disqualify the previous argument, without actually addressing it.

[Roundball_Rock]

How many MVP candidates were there in 2020? 2019? 2018? We know the answers. There are 2-3 legitimate MVP candidates each season. You will get 12-15 people who actually receive votes because each voter has to list 5 players and the 4th and especially 5th place votes will scatter (their beloved Kyrie has gotten 0 of these votes in his career BTW). When the media or fans discuss the MVP race, they don't discuss the 14 people who ultimately get votes. They talk about the 2-3 people with an actual case for winning the award.

Using the logic put forward here, DeRozan, Lowry, Draymond Green, and Dennis Rodman were all "MVP candidates." That isn't convenient for the agenda, doe. The very same poster touting 9th place MVP finishes was just days ago saying a player who finished top 10 in half a season was poor "help." So 9th over 82 games is awesome while finishing 10th in half a season is poor "help."

[HoopsNY]

How many MVP candidates were there in 2020? 2019? 2018? We know the answers. There are 2-3 legitimate MVP candidates each season. You will get 12-15 people who actually receive votes because each voter has to list 5 players and the 4th and especially 5th place votes will scatter (their beloved Kyrie has gotten 0 of these votes in his career BTW). When the media or fans discuss the MVP race, they don't discuss the 14 people who ultimately get votes. They talk about the 2-3 people with an actual case for winning the award.

Using the logic put forward here, DeRozan, Lowry, Draymond Green, and Dennis Rodman were all "MVP candidates." That isn't convenient for the agenda, doe. The very same poster touting 9th place MVP finishes was just days ago saying a player who finished top 10 in half a season was poor "help." So 9th over 82 games is awesome while finishing 10th in half a season is poor "help."

You can't win with you, not because it's about winning, but because you create your own criteria that in some cases works against you. When others on this forum point it out, you switch parameters and then disqualify the previous argument, without actually addressing it.

^^^

Good job mischaracterizing what I said Pippen's 1998 finals. Nothing unusual. Lemme know when you're finished misinterpreting and mischaracterizing what everyone says.

[MadDog]

Stockton 1990: One 3rd place vote
Stockton 1991: One 3rd place vote (though finished 12th overall)
Stockton 1995: One 1st place vote, two 2nd place votes, one 3rd place vote
Stockton 1998: One 3rd place vote (though finishing 13th)

All of this with Karl Malone, who finished ~top 3-4 from 1990-1991. Top 3 in 1995 and #2 overall in 1998. Wow! No wonder that duo is considered one of the best. They just happened to be playing in a league dripping with talent.

[HoopsNY]

All of this with Karl Malone, who finished ~top 3-4 from 1990-1991. Top 3 in 1995 and #2 overall in 1998. Wow! No wonder that duo is considered one of the best. They just happened to be playing in a league dripping with talent.

My point was to show TheFakeBullsFan that his original claim was not correct. He tried to say that the Bulls had two MVP candidates (didn't qualify this statement) every year.

The reality is that they didn't. Pippen finished 5th in 1996 and that was it. The rest of the years they played together, he got 0 first place votes in some years and in others got maybe 1. The same for 2nd place votes.

There was maybe one or two years where he received a first place vote, but TheFakeBullsFan wants to act like Pippen was up there with MJ, Malone, Hakeem, Robinson, Shaq, Ewing, Clyde, etc while he played alongside MJ.

When you address this, he jumps to a new argument about Stockton not getting any 1st-3rd place votes. Then that gets disproven. He then doesn't concede to it, instead jumps back to his original claim, this time qualifying what HE thinks is an MVP candidate and what that means for having a the only team with 2 guys that are.

The arguments keep changing. On top of it all, he'll accuse you of hating Pippen and lying about him for things that others on this forum say with regularity. It's unbelievable really.

[JBSptfn]

1991 had Magic, Worthy and Divac

Worthy was hurt during that series. And, I don't think that Divac is a HOF player.

[Roundball_Rock]

Worthy was hurt during that series. And, I don't think that Divac is a HOF player.

Divac made it through international play. In the NBA he was a 1x all-star, an all-star selection he received a decade later. They are desperate, though, so you can see why they are pointing to him. Any guesses what they will say if Kukoc makes the HOF?

At any rate, from 1992-1998 they always had more HOF in the finals and ECF.

1992: Bulls 2, Cavs 0
1992: Bulls 2, Blazers 1
1993: Bulls 2, Knicks 1
1993: Bulls 2, Suns 1
1996: Bulls 3, Magic 1
1996: Bulls 3, Sonics 1
1997: Bulls 4, Heat 1
1997: Bulls 4, Jazz 2
1998: Bulls 3, Pacers 2
1998: Bulls 3, Jazz 2

Parish shouldn't count for the Bulls in 97' but neither should Mullin for the 98' Pacers when he was their 5th best player.

Here is another way to parse it, top 3 in MVP players:

1992: Bulls 2, Cavs 0
1992: Bulls 2, Blazers 1
1993: Bulls 2, Knicks 0
1993: Bulls 2, Suns 1
1996: Bulls 2, Magic 2
1996: Bulls 2, Sonics 1
1997: Bulls 2, Heat 1
1997: Bulls 2, Jazz 1
1998: Bulls 2, Pacers 0
1998: Bulls 2, Jazz 1