Would LeBron be out of the top 3 if he had lost 5 straight finals from 2014 to 2018

[coastalmarker99]

How would your viewpoint of Lebron legacy and all-time ranking change if from 2014 to 2018 Lebron had lost 5 straight finals with both the Cavs and Heat despite playing great in all of those finals series he now would have lost.






Let's just say that the Warriors pull off a tight victory in game 7 in 2016 as Barnes plays better in that game and Durant still joins them that same offseason. And things also still play out as they did in real life as they did from 2017 to 2018.

Lebron now would have lost 5 straight NBA finals from 2014 to 2018 which would have been the NBA record for most finals lost in a row by a player surpassing West's three straight from 1968 to 1970.

[8Ball]

Still the greatest player of all time.

[SouBeachTalents]

The fixation on Finals losses makes absolutely no sense to me. I mean, I get it if you're the Buffalo Bills, if you make it 4 straight times and never win once, then I can see how it becomes notable. But LeBron had already won b2b by 2014, the notion that a player could make 5 straight Finals. play well in all of them and have that be more of a negative than losing 5 straight years in the first 3 rounds makes absolutely no sense. It's legitimately fcking stupid

[Smoke117]

No, not really. Teams LOSE series, not a single player. The Spurs were just better in 2014 especially with Wade being a shadow of what he once was, The Cavs were all injured in 2015, and then in 2017 and 2018 the Warriors had basically stacked the deck so there wasn't much anyone could do against that team. (well besides the Rockets who would have beat them in 2018 if The Point God didn't get injured. Cavs would have lost to those Rockets, too, though.)

[coastalmarker99]

The fixation on Finals losses makes absolutely no sense. I mean, I get it if you're the Buffalo Bills, if you make it 4 straight times and never win once, then I can see how it becomes notable. But LeBron had already won b2b by 2014, the notion that a player could make 5 straight Finals. play well in all of them and have that be more of a negative than losing 5 straight years in the first 3 rounds makes absolutely no sense. It's legitimately fcking stupid

I agree with your logic but the general public and media don't see it that way and as a result, It would be almost impossible to argue LeBron being the goat with a 3 and 7 record in the finals. and without his greatest achievement not occurring in 2016 despite the fact that he would have won with the Lakers in 2020.



Remember that Wilt gets roasted for not winning titles from 1968 to 1970 imagine that with Lebron in the modern era if he had lost 5 straight finals the media and fans would have roasted the hell of him during those years.

[8Ball]

Correct.

Teams win championships.

GOAT ranking are individual base.

LeBron will have 17 All-NBA selections.

No other player in history can match 17 all nba selections.

[Micku]

I don't think he would have the goat talks as he does now.

It's not really about the ring count from the narrative prospective with the media. I mean it does count, but with 2016 it was the narrative and his performance.

Without 2016, I don't think Shannon and Nick Wright would have as much weight with the argument. Still weight because he got there and played great.

It's probably isn't fair tho. But I think that's the way it is. Other great stars suffer for it too. Karl Malone. Barkley. Those 2002 Kings with C-Webb.

[coastalmarker99]

No, not really. Teams LOSE series, not a single player. The Spurs were just better in 2014 especially with Wade being a shadow of what he once was, The Cavs were all injured in 2015, and then in 2017 and 2018 the Warriors had basically stacked the deck so there wasn't much anyone could do against that team. (well besides the Rockets who would have beat them in 2018 if The Point God didn't get injured. Cavs would have lost to those Rockets, too, though.)

I agree with you that if the Point God doesn't get hurt the Rockets win the West over the stacked Warriors that year and then go on to beat the Cavs in the finals in 5 or 6 games. Giving paul his first ring and maybe finals Mvp which would greatly affect how people view him nowadays

[SouBeachTalents]

I agree with your logic but the general public and media don't see it that way and as a result, It would be almost impossible to argue LeBron being the goat with a 3 and 7 record in the finals. and without his greatest achievement not occurring in 2016 despite the fact that he would have won with the Lakers in 2020.



Remember that Wilt gets roasted for not winning titles from 1968 to 1970 imagine that with Lebron in the modern era if he had lost 5 straight finals the media and fans would have roasted the hell of him during those years.

Just to further emphasize how retarded it is, let's compare a hypothetical of LeBron losing in the 2016 Finals to other ATG's

2014-18 LeBron: Would've averaged something like 33/9/9 in 5 straight Finals
1986-90 Jordan: Didn't make a single Final
1975-79 Kareem: Missed the playoffs twice and didn't make a single Final
1995-99 Shaq: Made one Final and got swept 4 times
2008-12 Duncan: Didn't make a single Final and lost to an 8 seed
1988-92 Hakeem: Didn't win a single playoff series
2003-07 Kobe: Made one Final (where he was atrocious) missed the playoffs and lost in the first round b2b years

And keep in mind with the exception of Jordan & Kareem individually all those guys played much worse than LeBron did in the years in question. I don't even dispute that fans and media would criticize LeBron the most for that, but looking at the above it shows that most fans and people in the media are fcking retarded

[kawhileonard2]

Still the greatest player of all time.

Not when you losing to Dwight Howard with HCA and getting bronze medals.

[warriorfan]

Made the Finals in a weak East. Hawks, Pacers, Trash Bros. “Making the Finals” every year sounds great but if you look at the rest of the East it puts it more in perspective.

[Smoke117]

Made the Finals in a weak East. Hawks, Pacers, Trash Bros. “Making the Finals” every year sounds great but if you look at the rest of the East it puts it more in perspective.

And yet Curry choked away the title to the Cavs in 2016.





Crack head scum.

[light]

No.

Due to injuries to both Irving and Love, there is no penalty for losing in 2015.

LeBron wasn't even expected to make the Finals in 2018 after Kyrie left and I.T. flopped so the public doesn't penalize him for that season either (the fact that he even made it to the finals that year is considered a major achievement on its own.)

Even if LeBron lost in 2016 it would've been against the 73-9 Warriors and the public would not have penalized him for that either. The Warriors were not expected to lose to anyone. The fact that LeBron won is still hard to believe, which are major bonus points.

The public is also aware of the circumstances of 2014 and 2017 i.e. the end of Dwayne Wade and KD joining the 73-win Warriors, so losing in the finals in those situations against absolutely loaded teams in those seasons isn't penalized either.

So nothing would've changed.

[FireDavidKahn]

But he didn't

[Axe]

They'll still have him as the best player to have lost many finals if that's the case