Take AD off lakers and KD of nets who wins?

[Bronbron23]

no, you actually couldn't. the 01 lakers were ranked similar to brooklyn and won a title. scraping bottom of the barrel here, but it was done more recent.

https://www.basketball-reference.com.../LAL/2001.html

a lot of defense is effort based, so you're wrong there too.

Not a great example dude. It just highlights my point if anything. That lakers team had one of the worst defenses in the reg season but they had one of the best in the post season. Opponent's scored an average of 90 points against the lakers that post season. That was 3rd best overall. Nets won't be able to do this. It's not just an issue of effoet with them like 01 lakers. They Just flat out can't defend. They got rid of there best defenders.

[mehyaM24]

Not a great example dude. It just highlights my point if anything. That lakers team had one of the worst defenses in the reg season but they had one of the best in the post season. Opponent's scored an average of 90 points against the lakers that post season. That was 3rd best overall. Nets won't be able to do this. It's not just an issue of effoet with them like 01 lakers. They Just flat out can't defend. They got rid of there best defenders.

we aren't in the playoffs yet so your "point" is tbd. in other words irrelevant right now. going by what WE KNOW so far though? the last team to win a title with BAD rs defense were the 01 lakers. last to win with a BAD offense played before the merger. the model i gave is more consistent.

[Bronbron23]

we aren't in the playoffs yet so your "point" is tbd. in other words irrelevant right now. going by what WE KNOW so far though? the last team to win a title with BAD rs defense were the 01 lakers. last to win with a BAD offense played before the merger. the model i gave is more consistent.

Yeah It is until it isn't and sometimes you just have to use common sense. Nets don't have the defenders to pick it up defensively like the lakers did so it's an easy call to say they won't. There's literally zero chance harden, kyrie achillies kd, and beyond prime Aldridge and blake or jordan are gonna lock teams down. On the flip side lakers definitely have the offensive pieces to pick it up offensively. Plus bron has historically coasted in the reg season and then goes nuclear in the post season so it's a pretty safe bet to say they'll pick it up come playoffs.

See Yall are to offensive driven. I get it's a different day and defense isn't what it used to be but it's not as bad deep in the playoffs where refs let way more go. Shit just look at the 18 warriors. Rockets almost beat them with their defense. In the 3 games they won they held warriors to an average of 97 points. Lakers will do the same to the nets. Nets are gonna have some off shooting days. That's the main difference. Lakers can be off offensively and still win with their defense. Nets can't do that. If they aint hitting ain't no way there winning. Again time will tell. Smart money will be on lakers though. I know mine will.

[KirbyPls]

KD has been relatively meaningless to the Nets' success this season, and Brooklyn remains the biggest favorite since the 2017 Warriors, regardless of KD's presence on the court.

That's your answer.

[mehyaM24]

Yeah It is until it isn't and sometimes you just have to use common sense. Nets don't have the defenders to pick it up defensively like the lakers did so it's an easy call to say they won't. There's literally zero chance harden, kyrie achillies kd, and beyond prime Aldridge and blake or jordan are gonna lock teams down. On the flip side lakers definitely have the offensive pieces to pick it up offensively. Plus bron has historically coasted in the reg season and then goes nuclear in the post season so it's a pretty safe bet to say they'll pick it up come playoffs.

See Yall are to offensive driven. I get it's a different day and defense isn't what it used to be but it's not as bad deep in the playoffs where refs let way more go. Shit just look at the 18 warriors. Rockets almost beat them with their defense. In the 3 games they won they held warriors to an average of 97 points. Lakers will do the same to the nets. Nets are gonna have some off shooting days. That's the main difference. Lakers can be off offensively and still win with their defense. Nets can't do that. If they aint hitting ain't no way there winning. Again time will tell. Smart money will be on lakers though. I know mine will.

durant is a funny mention. before the stretch of games he sat, he was playing as good pre achilles. we also know that in gsw he was a VERY good defender. jordan has shown he can play defense too. ditto with harden whose made big strides over the last few years. to claim "theres literally zero chance" either pick it up on defense is simply ignorant. baseless too. again most defense is effort based compared to offense - which is mainly skill dependent. the lakers lack shooters and dont magically get better under your "without" ad scenario.

offense is what drives the league now. historically though teams with a BAD offense dont ring.

[Manny98]

Lakers just don't have the offensive firepower to hang with the Nets over a seven game series

[TheCorporation]

Le Goat

[Axe]

It's always kong who will take over

[StrongLurk]

Lol what OP? Nets will obviously win still.

I can't believe you are actually focusing on defense in the 2021 version of the NBA.

Spacing/Shooting > Defense.

[Bronbron23]

durant is a funny mention. before the stretch of games he sat, he was playing as good pre achilles. we also know that in gsw he was a VERY good defender. jordan has shown he can play defense too. ditto with harden whose made big strides over the last few years. to claim "theres literally zero chance" either pick it up on defense is simply ignorant. baseless too. again most defense is effort based compared to offense - which is mainly skill dependent. the lakers lack shooters and dont magically get better under your "without" ad scenario.

offense is what drives the league now. historically though teams with a BAD offense dont ring.

Well i'm basing the kd point on him not being healthy and consistently available. If he's healthy it's obviously a different story. As far a his defense is concerned he's great when he's healthy and available but again i question if that will be the case. As far as harden and jordan well jordan is clearly a shell of himself on both ends. I don't know what your talking about there. Harden has shown flashes of above average defense but it hasn't been consistent. Again i don't see an historically lazy defender, a washed up defender and an injured one being much of a threat defensively come playoffs but i can't hate u for dreaming.

And great defense isn't just effort related. Yeah it obviously plays a part but so does natural talent like anticipation and reaction time. There are lots of guys who try hard defensively but just aren't good. Steph is a good example.

Plus kyrie and harden up until this point haven't taken defense all that serious so not sure why they'll all of a sudden start now. All things considered it's a pretty safe bet to say they'll still be trash defensively once playoffs come.

[Full Court]

ya good point. the clips are the real sleeper imo. one of few elite teams with a top 10 offense and defense (#1 in ortg). long as they don't face that 7 foot michelin man over in denver, they can definitely go the distance. wouldn't bet on them, but it wouldn't surprise me either.

The Clippers aren't the only dark horse this year. I think the Sixers and the Jazz also have a very real chance at the title. Maybe even the Suns.

[mehyaM24]

The Clippers aren't the only dark horse this year. I think the Sixers and the Jazz also have a very real chance at the title. Maybe even the Suns.

probably not, but their #1 offense certainly doesn't hurt them.

[mehyaM24]

Lol what OP? Nets will obviously win still.

I can't believe you are actually focusing on defense in the 2021 version of the NBA.

Spacing/Shooting > Defense.

ya strange take. defense obviously matters, but he missed the 2021 boat.

Well i'm basing the kd point on him not being healthy and consistently available. If he's healthy it's obviously a different story. As far a his defense is concerned he's great when he's healthy and available but again i question if that will be the case. As far as harden and jordan well jordan is clearly a shell of himself on both ends. I don't know what your talking about there. Harden has shown flashes of above average defense but it hasn't been consistent. Again i don't see an historically lazy defender, a washed up defender and an injured one being much of a threat defensively come playoffs but i can't hate u for dreaming.

And great defense isn't just effort related. Yeah it obviously plays a part but so does natural talent like anticipation and reaction time. There are lots of guys who try hard defensively but just aren't good. Steph is a good example.

Plus kyrie and harden up until this point haven't taken defense all that serious so not sure why they'll all of a sudden start now. All things considered it's a pretty safe bet to say they'll still be trash defensively once playoffs come.

durant is already healthy though. right now he's playing back into game shape, but will be at full strength soon enough. closer to the playoffs, there is no reason to think he wont rev it up defensively. everything simply trends toward that direction. same with harden who you should know by now plays better defense. the mark on him was different in the past, but he's clearly progressed. with deandre ya he is past his prime but can still play defense in a limited role. did it not too long ago so why you think he cant now is a mystery.

you also misread my bit on team defense. i didn't say it was ALL effort. what i said is it'll come down more to "effort" than offense will. brooklyn is just more likely to play better defense than la gets better at shooting. you been playing too many video games, but someone whose actually hooped knows this shit is common sense. '

with everything accounted for, brooklyn is still the vegas favorite. betting against them is like throwing your money away.

[aj1987]

The Lakers without AD had more help in 2019 than they'd have without him today, and they couldn't even make the playoffs. Meanwhile Harden alone is a 50 win season... Add kyrie and you get a contender. So you're comparing lotto to contender here.

During his 2018 MVP season, the Rockets were 6-4 in the 10 games that Harden missed. That's a 49 win pace WITHOUT Harden.

Meanwhile, the Lakers were 9-18 in the 27 games LeBron missed in the 2019 season. That's a 27 win games without LeBron.

That young core with another #1 seed and a "generational" player in Zion are struggling to get over .500.

[ArbitraryWater]

Well the Lakers cause of LeBron...

but take LeBron and KD out and the Nets crush them.

Get it, OP?