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  1. #1
    I go HAM TheCorporation's Avatar
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    Default MJ had 16 all nba/all defensive teammate selections. LBJ only had 7. LeAmazing



    LeBron turned 7 selections into 4 rings/FMVPs = 57.1% rate
    Jordan turned 16 selections into 6 rings/FMVPs = 37.5% rate

    LeBron wins again bois

  2. #2
    Local High School Star theman93's Avatar
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    Default Re: MJ had 16 all nba/all defensive teammate selections. LBJ only had 7. LeAmazing

    I thought all Lebron needed to win was a ball? Are you saying he needed more help?

  3. #3
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    Default Re: MJ had 16 all nba/all defensive teammate selections. LBJ only had 7. LeAmazing

    .
    Top Tier Dominant Series or Playoff Runs by Lebron's teammates

    * Wade 2011 Playoffs and Finals (led Lebron in scoring)
    * Kyrie 2016 Playoffs and Finals (equal-scoring partner with Lebron)
    * Kyrie 2017 Playoffs and Finals (26 and 29 ppg in PO/Finals)
    * AD 2020 Playoffs and Finals (led league in playoff scoring)




    Top Tier Dominant Series or Playoff Runs by Jordan's teammates





    Lebron needed 2 all-star teammates to win rings, or he needed a teammate to outproduce him (AD), while Jordan didn't need anything - Pippen's stats were defensive role player caliber, but his resume got inflated by the winning spotlight and association with MJ, just like Kobe got a few extra all-defense for the same reason (winning spotlight and association with MJ)

    Ultimately, everyone in history needed an equal-scoring partner in the playoffs for at least half their rings, while Jordan led his sidekick in every SERIES by at least 10 ppg - so there's no comparison - Jordan stands alone in carrying teams - he won 6 chips with a team of defensive role players that NEVER DOMINATED OFFENSIVELY

    Teammate scoring matters because equal-scoring teammates attract equal defensive attention, so only MJ faced "1-man team" defensive attention for his entire career, (thus giving maximum integrity to his stats and rings).. Kenny Smith talks about MJ being the only 1-man show here.

    Accordingly, rings with 2nd options are greater than rings with 1b's and Jordan has far more rings with true 2nd options than anyone else in history - that's his irrefutable goat argument.

  4. #4
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    Default Re: MJ had 16 all nba/all defensive teammate selections. LBJ only had 7. LeAmazing

    lebron sure does make other players worse. thanks for proving it once and for all OP


    wade should be 8, bosh should be 4. kyrie should be 3, Davis should be 4..

    lecancer?

  5. #5
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    Default Re: MJ had 16 all nba/all defensive teammate selections. LBJ only had 7. LeAmazing

    Quote Originally Posted by TheCorporation View Post


    LeBron turned 7 selections into 4 rings/FMVPs = 57.1% rate
    Jordan turned 16 selections into 6 rings/FMVPs = 37.5% rate

    LeBron wins again bois
    Lebron had Ben Wallace who also was DPOY 4x, as well as Dwight Howard who was DPOY 3x. Also had Shaw who won league and finals mvp

  6. #6
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    Default Re: MJ had 16 all nba/all defensive teammate selections. LBJ only had 7. LeAmazing

    Quote Originally Posted by TheCorporation View Post


    LeBron turned 7 selections into 4 rings/FMVPs = 57.1% rate
    Jordan turned 16 selections into 6 rings/FMVPs = 37.5% rate

    LeBron wins again bois


    Pippen got all-nba despite lower BPM, PER and WS/48 than Kyrie, AD, or Wade, so the winning spotlight and association with MJ inflated Pip, while Lebron's teammates were lowered by losing and association with a team-hopper/choker.

  7. #7
    NBA Legend Hey Yo's Avatar
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    Default Re: MJ had 16 all nba/all defensive teammate selections. LBJ only had 7. LeAmazing

    MJ reduced his teammates PPG by making them concentrate on defense while he took 30fga a game.

  8. #8
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    Default Re: MJ had 16 all nba/all defensive teammate selections. LBJ only had 7. LeAmazing

    Quote Originally Posted by Hey Yo View Post
    MJ reduced his teammates PPG by making them concentrate on defense while he took 30fga a game.

    The 95' Bulls were 34-31 and borderline playoffs, yet poor Pippen could only average 22 ppg, just like 94'... That was his peak capability without Mike (22.0 and 5.6 apg), which was below his peak raw production with Mike (21.0 and 7.0 apg).

    Ultimately, when Mike came back in 1995, everyone took a 1-2 point haircut across the board and played to 90% capacity alongside him - it was an equitable reduction across the board because Mike's game fit with everyone (on-ball and off-ball), so he didn't crater certain player types like Lebron's skill restriction to ball-dominance does.

    Isn't that amazing?.. So guys like Bosh and Love would still be stars alongside Mike, just like other 3rd options before them (Klay, Worthy or Parish were still stars that could take over and dominate stretches when needed)

  9. #9
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    Default Re: MJ had 16 all nba/all defensive teammate selections. LBJ only had 7. LeAmazing

    Quote Originally Posted by 3ba11 View Post
    The 95' Bulls were 34-31 and borderline playoffs, yet poor Pippen could only average 22 ppg, just like 94'... That was his peak capability without Mike (22.0 and 5.6 apg), which was below his peak raw production with Mike (21.0 and 7.0 apg).

    Ultimately, when Mike came back in 1995, everyone took a 1-2 point haircut across the board and played to 90% capacity alongside him - it was an equitable reduction across the board because Mike's game fit with everyone (on-ball and off-ball), so he didn't crater certain player types like Lebron's skill restriction to ball-dominance does.

    Isn't that amazing?.. So guys like Bosh and Love would still be stars alongside Mike, just like other 3rd options before them (Klay, Worthy or Parish were still stars that could take over and dominate stretches when needed)


  10. #10
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    Default Re: MJ had 16 all nba/all defensive teammate selections. LBJ only had 7. LeAmazing

    That chart was made by an absolute mongrel. LeBron has teamhopped repeatedly, which means 1.) he never stayed long enough with an All-NBA teammate and 2.) he's had more All-League teammates, in total. Pippen played sidekick to Jordan for 10 years straight. Give or take. Wade? LeBron jumped ship after 4 years. Wanted fresh new blood.

    If OP included all their selections, we'd see LeBron's had the help of the entire league.

  11. #11
    NBA Legend FKAri's Avatar
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    Default Re: MJ had 16 all nba/all defensive teammate selections. LBJ only had 7. LeAmazing

    Quote Originally Posted by theman93 View Post
    I thought all Lebron needed to win was a ball? Are you saying he needed more help?
    I don't think he needs a ball either.
    Quote Originally Posted by MadDog View Post
    That chart was made by an absolute mongrel. LeBron has teamhopped repeatedly, which means 1.) he never stayed long enough with an All-NBA teammate and 2.) he's had more All-League teammates, in total. Pippen played sidekick to Jordan for 10 years straight. Give or take. Wade? LeBron jumped ship after 4 years. Wanted fresh new blood.

    If OP included all their selections, we'd see LeBron's had the help of the entire league.
    Lebron provides the help. Goes to lottery teams around the country and gets them a chip. Once they've got their shit together he moves on. It's like Gordon Ramsey in Kitchen Nightmares or those makeover shows. Helps you out of a jam then pats you on a shoulder and rides off. GOAT shit.

  12. #12
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    Default Re: MJ had 16 all nba/all defensive teammate selections. LBJ only had 7. LeAmazing

    Quote Originally Posted by FKAri View Post
    I don't think he needs a ball either.


    Lebron provides the help. Goes to lottery teams around the country and gets them a chip. Once they've got their shit together he moves on. It's like Gordon Ramsey in Kitchen Nightmares or those makeover shows. Helps you out of a jam then pats you on a shoulder and rides off. GOAT shit.
    Good point. LeBron was key in aiding Dallas to a title. Should've been FMVP tbh

  13. #13
    Good college starter ELITEpower23's Avatar
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    Default Re: MJ had 16 all nba/all defensive teammate selections. LBJ only had 7. LeAmazing

    Quote Originally Posted by TheCorporation View Post


    LeBron turned 7 selections into 4 rings/FMVPs = 57.1% rate
    Jordan turned 16 selections into 6 rings/FMVPs = 37.5% rate

    LeBron wins again bois
    There he goes again! Corp got his haters onna leash, not even 1 post to refute it. Must be facts :confusedsheug:

  14. #14
    Local High School Star Full Court's Avatar
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    Default Re: MJ had 16 all nba/all defensive teammate selections. LBJ only had 7. LeAmazing

    Quote Originally Posted by Hey Yo View Post
    MJ reduced his teammates PPG by making them concentrate on defense while he took 30fga a game.
    Seeing how the Bulls three-peated TWICE, apparently that system worked pretty well.

  15. #15
    I go HAM TheCorporation's Avatar
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    Default Re: MJ had 16 all nba/all defensive teammate selections. LBJ only had 7. LeAmazing

    Crazy to think MJ had almost three times (16 vs 7) the amount of help and still scored 2,000 less points


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