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  1. #16
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    Default Re: Another commentator saying Pippen was on Jordan's level in 96.

    Quote Originally Posted by sdot_thadon View Post
    Only because you're an Unga bunga caveman that only values scoring in a game with so many ways to contribute....

    And of course in the grand scheme of things we know Pippen is not on MJ's level. But that's a snapshot of time in the 90s where maybe he was. 2nd 3peat Mj wasn't nearly as untouchable or unapproachable as 1st 3peat Mjs was, he was just a more experienced and smarter player by then. Still was my favorite version of Mj although he wasn't nearly the best version.
    Pippen averaged less apg than Jordan for their Finals career, playoff career or regular season career, and Pippen never won DPOY, while getting less DPOY votes every year than Jordan.. So it makes no difference if we include passing and defense - Pippen couldn't get more than 7 apg and was never DPOY.

    And MJ was still scoring champ for the 2nd three-peat and led all the advanced categories, while Pippen averaged 17 on 41% and was horrible.

    So you're just delusional about Pippen.. Jordan literally doubled this bums playoff scoring average and assisted 30% more often

  2. #17
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    Default Re: Another commentator saying Pippen was on Jordan's level in 96.

    Quote Originally Posted by 3ba11 View Post
    What's the argument for Lillard over Kyrie or KJ?

    They both dominated the league MVP in 90' and 16, while also making the Finals and multiple conference finals

    That destroys Lillard

    So you guys are all just wrong.. it happens all the time with today's media - they're wrong about literally everything

    Again, anyone in the top 75 has a seminal performance like 06' Wade, 11' Dirk, 21' Giannis or 16' Kyrie... what does Pippen have?...

    Pippen is the only notable sidekick in the 90's that 1) never dominated and 2) never led the team (carried in every series)

    Every other notable 90's sidekick peaked above Pippen's 22/5 (dominated) and routinely led their team in many series (not always carried like Pippen)

    Lakers guy ran

  3. #18
    truth serum sdot_thadon's Avatar
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    Default Re: Another commentator saying Pippen was on Jordan's level in 96.

    Quote Originally Posted by 3ba11 View Post
    Pippen averaged less apg than Jordan for their Finals career, playoff career or regular season career, and Pippen never won DPOY, while getting less DPOY votes every year than Jordan.. So it makes no difference if we include passing and defense - Pippen couldn't get more than 7 apg and was never DPOY.

    And MJ was still scoring champ for the 2nd three-peat and led all the advanced categories, while Pippen averaged 17 on 41% and was horrible.

    So you're just delusional about Pippen.. Jordan literally doubled this bums playoff scoring average and assisted 30% more often
    Scoring, scoring , scoring. With that you literally reduce MJ's legacy to that of a gunner, making him appear far more inferior than he actually was. Mj fam definitely needs a better field rep than you. I have no clue how you manage to make someone so great seem so shit consistently.

  4. #19
    NBA Legend and Hall of Famer 1987_Lakers's Avatar
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    Default Re: Another commentator saying Pippen was on Jordan's level in 96.

    Quote Originally Posted by 3ba11 View Post
    What's the argument for Lillard over Kyrie or KJ?
    Lillard has actually led his teams to nice playoff runs in his career, including a WCF in 2019, also helps that he has been fairly healthy most of his career and I'm not even a big fan of him.

    Kyrie on the other hand is injury prone and his time in Boston as the number 1 option backfired big time, his team actually played better without him, it's well known what a bad leader he is.

  5. #20
    Very good NBA starter Round Mound's Avatar
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    Default Re: Another commentator saying Pippen was on Jordan's level in 96.

    Pippen was not in the same level as MJ. Nobody was. Pippen though, was a Top 10 Player in the 90's.

  6. #21
    NBA Legend and Hall of Famer Manny98's Avatar
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    Default Re: Another commentator saying Pippen was on Jordan's level in 96.

    Pippen wasn't as good as Jordan, not even close

    But that's ok because he's still one of the greatest sidekicks ever

    Let's not overrate Pippen

  7. #22
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    Default Re: Another commentator saying Pippen was on Jordan's level in 96.

    Quote Originally Posted by 3ba11 View Post

    Again, anyone in the top 75 has a seminal performance like 06' Wade, 11' Dirk, 21' Giannis or 16' Kyrie... what does Pippen have?...
    2 of the 4 you listed are in your top 10. And I have a feeling the other two aren't far behind.

    What's this "top 75" talk

    It's like saying "any of the top 25 quarterbacks of all time like Peyton Manning and Drew Brees have done.."

  8. #23
    Dunking on everybody in the park expansionera's Avatar
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    Default Re: Another commentator saying Pippen was on Jordan's level in 96.

    Quote Originally Posted by Manny98 View Post
    Pippen wasn't as good as Jordan, not even close

    But that's ok because he's still one of the greatest sidekicks ever

    Let's not overrate Pippen
    The fact Jordan needed an MVP caliber sidekick to escape the first round suggest to me Jordan isn’t quite as dominate as the media likes for us to remember him

  9. #24
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    Default Re: Another commentator saying Pippen was on Jordan's level in 96.

    Quote Originally Posted by Manny98 View Post
    Pippen wasn't as good as Jordan, not even close

    But that's ok because he's still one of the greatest sidekicks ever

    Let's not overrate Pippen
    OP has a weird fixation with putting Pippen on Jordan's level. Despite Jordan engulfing Pippen in: scoring, efficiency, advanced stats and impact. Pippen was great in the 96 regular-season, sure, but averaged just 17/9/6 on 36% shooting in the playoffs. Great defense although putrid scoring and efficiency. MJ carried the scoring load while playing all-time defense.

    Generally speaking, Chicago was a well oiled machine.

  10. #25
    NBA Superstar 97 bulls's Avatar
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    Default Re: Another commentator saying Pippen was on Jordan's level in 96.

    Quote Originally Posted by MadDog View Post
    OP has a weird fixation with putting Pippen on Jordan's level. Despite Jordan engulfing Pippen in: scoring, efficiency, advanced stats and impact. Pippen was great in the 96 regular-season, sure, but averaged just 17/9/6 on 36% shooting in the playoffs. Great defense although putrid scoring and efficiency. MJ carried the scoring load while playing all-time defense.

    Generally speaking, Chicago was a well oiled machine.
    The argument can be made that Pippen was on Jordan's level as far as importance to the team's success (which is all that matters really). But I also stated that MJ is the GOAT, and that Pippen at that time was a top 5 player.

    The point of me sending the video was to show how Pippen was perceived at that time as opposed to this revisionist history that Pippen was a bum being carried by Michael Jordan.

    But as usual, many so-called basketball fans like the one I'm responding to that are casual followers can only rely on stats to make an unintelligent analysis.

  11. #26
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    Default Re: Another commentator saying Pippen was on Jordan's level in 96.

    No an "argument" cannot be made. Jordan's impact metrics literally annihilate Pippen's. What Jordan brought to the team was simply harder to replace. Suggesting otherwise is just laughable.

  12. #27
    NBA Superstar 97 bulls's Avatar
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    Default Re: Another commentator saying Pippen was on Jordan's level in 96.

    Quote Originally Posted by MadDog View Post
    No, an argument cannot be made. Jordan's impact metrics literally annihilate Pippen's. What Jordan brought to the team was simply harder to replace. Suggesting otherwise is just laughable.
    Well, the facts (IE wins) tell a different story. Pippen wasn't a stats guy. He did what he needed to do to win. Jordan was a stats guy. Doesn't mean Jordan Isn't the GOAT, but Pippen is a great player. And was equally important ti the Bulls success.

  13. #28
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    Default Re: Another commentator saying Pippen was on Jordan's level in 96.

    Doesn't surprise me. This opinion was pretty common throughout the 90s, when people were actually witnessing the impact of The Great Scott Pippen real-time.
    Must've been the fact that the 1993-94 Bulls lost only two games less than their previous season with Jordan and then lost because one of the most bullshitty calls ever in the playoffs.

  14. #29
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    Default Re: Another commentator saying Pippen was on Jordan's level in 96.

    Quote Originally Posted by 97 bulls View Post
    Well, the facts (IE wins) tell a different story. Pippen wasn't a stats guy. He did what he needed to do to win. Jordan was a stats guy. Doesn't mean Jordan Isn't the GOAT, but Pippen is a great player. And was equally important ti the Bulls success.
    They actually don't though. In 98, Jordan's win percentage without Pippen was better than the win % Pippen's Bulls had in 94. Using team stats to credit one individual is asinine anyway - but as usual you're wrong. Compared to Pippen's defense and extra rebounds and assists, Jordan's offense coupled with his defense brought more to the table.

    In the playoffs and finals, the gap only widened. Having Jordan who could get you a bucket anytime in the half-court (unlike Pippen who shot miserably during the second 3-peat), or when the game is on the line, is what's premium here. It makes sense too, because Jordan's REAL +/- (isolated impact to the team) dwarfed Pippen's.

    MJ was the man in Chicago. And his effect on the game was irreplaceable. Move on and accept it, fanboy.

  15. #30
    The Puppeteer FireDavidKahn's Avatar
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    Default Re: Another commentator saying Pippen was on Jordan's level in 96.

    Quote Originally Posted by 3ba11 View Post
    Pippen was never reported on back then

    Literally

    No one paid attention to him because they knew he wasn't going to dominate

    I haven't watched the clip btw. I don't worry about exceptions that prove the rule
    Madonna paid attention to Scottie "Tree Trunk" Pippen.

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