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  1. #1
    Titles are overrated Kblaze8855's Avatar
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    Default Draymond discusses Melo vs KD as scorers.




    Melo is one of those people who will always be more respected by basketball players than fans who determine how good people are by a formula. Dray, Kobe, KD, and a lot of the “student of the game” types always seem to be over the top in the respect for his skill set. The tough shot, well rounded, clutch one on one types like he and Kobe tend to shoot worse from the field which limits stat based fan appreciation at times but actual basketball players seem to love them.

    That said…I thiiiiiink I might remember Draymond saying KD was the goat scorer but I’m not gonna flatly say he did till I look into it.

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    Titles are overrated Kblaze8855's Avatar
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    Default Re: Draymond discusses Melo vs KD as scorers.


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    NBA Superstar FultzNationRISE's Avatar
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    Default Re: Draymond discusses Melo vs KD as scorers.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kblaze8855 View Post



    Melo is one of those people who will always be more respected by basketball players than fans who determine how good people are by a formula. Dray, Kobe, KD, and a lot of the “student of the game” types always seem to be over the top in the respect for his skill set. The tough shot, well rounded, clutch one on one types like he and Kobe tend to shoot worse from the field which limits stat based fan appreciation at times but actual basketball players seem to love them.

    That said…I thiiiiiink I might remember Draymond saying KD was the goat scorer but I’m not gonna flatly say he did till I look into it.
    Sure, from an individual defender’s perspective if a guy shoots 42% on 25 shots, it means he still embarrassed you plenty of times.

    In the larger team-vs-team context, assuming most of those shots arent threes, it’s not really that productive compared to better shots other guys could have taken.

    Dray is a proud defender, and Kobe/Durant were proud scorers. Ofc theyll pump up Melo bc it makes themselves look better when they stop him (Dray) or have similar performances (Kobe and KD).

    But if youre not invested that way it’s clear to see the limited value of a guy who’s only skillset is volume isos on mediocre efficiency.

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    Titles are overrated Kblaze8855's Avatar
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    Default Re: Draymond discusses Melo vs KD as scorers.

    None of that such and such points on whatever shooting is what basketball players mean when they talk scoring. That’s what people who have no other way to judge it talk. The people in question talk about strength, touch, footwork, agility, balance, range and making them think and work hard. KD had a story on how Melo just left him confused. He was too strong to play one way and too quick to play another but still had touch. They are talking about the act of defending someone not whatever numbers result. I’ve never heard any of them use how many points he scored to make the case. That’s a fan thing.

    Kinda like Reggie or a Steph. People don’t talk about whatever they scored so much as how hard having to guard them is. Difference there being Steph was hard to cover and scores 30 and Reggie was hard to cover and scored 18. Still worn out chasing them though.

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    Youngest MVP PeroAntic's Avatar
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    Default Re: Draymond discusses Melo vs KD as scorers.

    Game knows game, but statnerds will always whine about efficiency even though before the analytics era players were winning championships without focusing on their field goal percentages.

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    NBA Legend FKAri's Avatar
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    Default Re: Draymond discusses Melo vs KD as scorers.

    Quote Originally Posted by PeroAntic View Post
    Game knows game, but statnerds will always whine about efficiency even though before the analytics era players were winning championships without focusing on their field goal percentages.
    People were winning wars with bows and arrows at one point too. Doesn't mean it'd work today. It's not just for funsies that every team in the league is using analytics. Don't need to be an NBA player or a statnerd to know that Carmelo was a great scorer. Especially how his scoring was more resilient vs physical defenses.

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    Titles are overrated Kblaze8855's Avatar
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    Default Re: Draymond discusses Melo vs KD as scorers.

    . It's not just for funsies that every team in the league is using analytics.

    Every team in the league sends scouts to watch people play. That isn’t an argument either way. They’re billion dollar organizations. They all have someone doing everything. I bet a couple have witch doctors throwing chicken bones.

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    NBA Superstar FultzNationRISE's Avatar
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    Default Re: Draymond discusses Melo vs KD as scorers.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kblaze8855 View Post
    None of that such and such points on whatever shooting is what basketball players mean when they talk scoring. That’s what people who have no other way to judge it talk. The people in question talk about strength, touch, footwork, agility, balance, range and making them think and work hard. KD had a story on how Melo just left him confused. He was too strong to play one way and too quick to play another but still had touch. They are talking about the act of defending someone not whatever numbers result. I’ve never heard any of them use how many points he scored to make the case. That’s a fan thing.

    Kinda like Reggie or a Steph. People don’t talk about whatever they scored so much as how hard having to guard them is. Difference there being Steph was hard to cover and scores 30 and Reggie was hard to cover and scored 18. Still worn out chasing them though.
    No doubt. Im just saying, where they rank guys vs where fans rank guys clearly is based on different values, not different evaluations of a common priority. Players are generally judging by how hard it is to stop a guy 1 on 1. Fans care more about whether the guy helps you win or not.

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    Titles are overrated Kblaze8855's Avatar
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    Default Re: Draymond discusses Melo vs KD as scorers.

    I suspect playing with Wade and Anthony Davis types instead of aging AI and 40 minutes of Amare makes him “help you win” a lot more. But fans rarely care why anything happens just that it did or did not.

  10. #10
    NBA Superstar FultzNationRISE's Avatar
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    Default Re: Draymond discusses Melo vs KD as scorers.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kblaze8855 View Post
    I suspect playing with Wade and Anthony Davis types instead of aging AI and 40 minutes of Amare makes him “help you win” a lot more. But fans rarely care why anything happens just that it did or did not.

    I would say elite defense, playmaking, and scoring efficiency wrapped up in a 25 ppg guy helps you win a lot more than a guy who scores 25 and does none of that.

    We gonna sit here and compare Melo's impact with Lebron!? Is that it?? Are we really going THERE...!?


    I am going to allow the benefit of the doubt that you are enjoying MULTIPLE pre-dinner cocktails at the moment.

  11. #11
    7-time NBA All-Star
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    Default Re: Draymond discusses Melo vs KD as scorers.

    Melo's game always wowed fellow hoopers.

    Listen to Lenny Cooke's buddies clowning him over Melo:

    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=r38IXKGlfSA&t=35m05s

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    Titles are overrated Kblaze8855's Avatar
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    Default Re: Draymond discusses Melo vs KD as scorers.

    The difference between Lebron and Melo obviously does exist. But it isn’t such that Lebron wins anything that matters on Melos teams in their primes. Just be a matter of precisely how far short they fell. I’d say a healthy prime Melo in Lebron place his entire career? Maybe 1 ring instead of 4. 2 if Wade had more left than he showed in 2012 which is conceivable.

    I also doubt he makes the 07 finals. But swap the two on every team? I’d say Melo has a ring or two to Lebrons none until maybe OKC Bron has near prime Westbrook and George. Lebron isn’t winning with Billups, Camby, and Kmart…or the Knick squads unless Amare stayed healthy.

  13. #13
    Bitch Hands fsvr54's Avatar
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    Default Re: Draymond discusses Melo vs KD as scorers.

    Melo is overrated

  14. #14
    NBA Superstar FultzNationRISE's Avatar
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    Default Re: Draymond discusses Melo vs KD as scorers.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kblaze8855 View Post
    The difference between Lebron and Melo obviously does exist. But it isn’t such that Lebron wins anything that matters on Melos teams in their primes. Just be a matter of precisely how far short they fell. I’d say a healthy prime Melo in Lebron place his entire career? Maybe 1 ring instead of 4. 2 if Wade had more left than he showed in 2012 which is conceivable.

    I also doubt he makes the 07 finals. But swap the two on every team? I’d say Melo has a ring or two to Lebrons none until maybe OKC Bron has near prime Westbrook and George. Lebron isn’t winning with Billups, Camby, and Kmart…or the Knick squads unless Amare stayed healthy.

    Oh helllll yeah he's winning a chip with that team.

    They also had Birdman and Nene in the rotation, shooters like JR and Kleiza, hustle/defense guys like Carter and Renaldo Balkman. That was a squad. Plus a HOF coach in George Karl. That was the one year Melo got to a conference finals. Lebron EASILY wins a trophy with that team. Not even being a homer.

    And of course I'm not saying Lebron wins a title on those Knick teams. But he gets you more wins, and closer to winning a chip than Carmelo does.

    And Melo winning a chip on any of Bron's teams is a HARD disagree. The Heat lose significant ball movement and defensive versatility, which were their staples. And obviously there's zero chance he wins in 16 or 20 in place of LBJ.

  15. #15
    I am creator deity Gohan's Avatar
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    Default Re: Draymond discusses Melo vs KD as scorers.

    Quote Originally Posted by FultzNationRISE View Post
    Sure, from an individual defender’s perspective if a guy shoots 42% on 25 shots, it means he still embarrassed you plenty of times.

    In the larger team-vs-team context, assuming most of those shots arent threes, it’s not really that productive compared to better shots other guys could have taken.

    Dray is a proud defender, and Kobe/Durant were proud scorers. Ofc theyll pump up Melo bc it makes themselves look better when they stop him (Dray) or have similar performances (Kobe and KD).

    But if youre not invested that way it’s clear to see the limited value of a guy who’s only skillset is volume isos on mediocre efficiency.
    It doesnt matter how many times someone tells you, you still wont get it. Pretending you know more than the actual players that devoted their whole life to basketball

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