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  1. #1
    College superstar TheGoatest's Avatar
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    Default jordon extremist alts' case for jordon being GOAT: Jack of all trades, Master of none

    When it comes to the criteria for GOAThood, the alts cannot pick a lane to stay in if his life depended on it:

    Winning = Bill Russell is superior
    Stats = LeBron and Wilt are superior
    Longevity = LeBron and Kareem are superior

    Instead, the alts desperately try to adjust the 3 of the criteria above in accordance with which player he is arguing jordon is superior than. Shit is hilarious to watch.

  2. #2
    Lol RRR3's Avatar
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    Default Re: jordon extremist alts' case for jordon being GOAT: Jack of all trades, Master of

    Meltdown

  3. #3
    College star dankok8's Avatar
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    Default Re: jordon extremist alts' case for jordon being GOAT: Jack of all trades, Master of

    It's true that Jordan's case relies on a combination of factors but there is another factor you didn't mention that most people associate with MJ that gives him an edge.

    Domination = Jordan is superior

    MJ never got clearly outplayed by anyone in the playoffs while all other GOAT candidates did many times.

    MJ won 10 scoring titles and carried the highest offensive loads in playoff history.

    And you can have Wilt in the regular season but Lebron isn't superior in stats. Prime Jordan from 1988-1993 was putting up better numbers.

  4. #4
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    Default Re: jordon extremist alts' case for jordon being GOAT: Jack of all trades, Master of

    The longevity argument favors LeBron, but actually hurts him, too. If you play longer, you should accumulate more. The problem is, you can't play significantly more and still, somehow, acquire less.

    So if MJ played 13 seasons with Chicago (11 full), and managed in that time to somehow win more scoring titles (by a significant margin), more All-Defensive selections, more DPOY awards, more MVPs, more FMVPs, and more titles, then the longevity argument doesn't help LeBron in this case, it actually hurts him.

    Add that to what dankok said, and it him having the better years peak for peak, then it's actually not comparable.

    If career accomplishments were all that matter (without any context), then yes, I'd say the two are neck and neck, and could reason with putting LeBron #1. But the game is far more complexed than that.

  5. #5
    Lol RRR3's Avatar
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    Default Re: jordon extremist alts' case for jordon being GOAT: Jack of all trades, Master of

    Quote Originally Posted by dankok8 View Post
    It's true that Jordan's case relies on a combination of factors but there is another factor you didn't mention that most people associate with MJ that gives him an edge.

    Domination = Jordan is superior

    MJ never got clearly outplayed by anyone in the playoffs while all other GOAT candidates did many times.

    MJ won 10 scoring titles and carried the highest offensive loads in playoff history.

    And you can have Wilt in the regular season but Lebron isn't superior in stats. Prime Jordan from 1988-1993 was putting up better numbers.
    Never eh? OP is ridiculous but so is this comment.

  6. #6
    National High School Star RogueBorg's Avatar
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    Default Re: jordon extremist alts' case for jordon being GOAT: Jack of all trades, Master of

    Quote Originally Posted by HoopsNY View Post
    The longevity argument favors LeBron, but actually hurts him, too. If you play longer, you should accumulate more. The problem is, you can't play significantly more and still, somehow, acquire less.

    So if MJ played 13 seasons with Chicago (11 full), and managed in that time to somehow win more scoring titles (by a significant margin), more All-Defensive selections, more DPOY awards, more MVPs, more FMVPs, and more titles, then the longevity argument doesn't help LeBron in this case, it actually hurts him.

    Add that to what dankok said, and it him having the better years peak for peak, then it's actually not comparable.

    If career accomplishments were all that matter (without any context), then yes, I'd say the two are neck and neck, and could reason with putting LeBron #1. But the game is far more complexed than that.
    Excellent post

  7. #7
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    Default Re: jordon extremist alts' case for jordon being GOAT: Jack of all trades, Master of

    Quote Originally Posted by TheGoatest View Post
    When it comes to the criteria for GOAThood, the alts cannot pick a lane to stay in if his life depended on it:

    Winning = Bill Russell is superior
    Stats = LeBron and Wilt are superior
    Longevity = LeBron and Kareem are superior

    Instead, the alts desperately try to adjust the 3 of the criteria above in accordance with which player he is arguing jordon is superior than. Shit is hilarious to watch.

    Career stats aren't the relevant stats

    Production rate (dominance) is what matters and Jordan leads all production rate stats like PPG, PER, BPM, VORP, WS/48, plus/minus, raptor - he simply dominated the most..

    No one else reached 30 ppg career playoff except Jordan is at 33.5.. A massive gap (4-5 ppg more than everyone)

    And only Jordan won 6 rings as the absolute man on his team - Russell didn't face any defensive attention because he wasn't a primary scoring option for most of his rings.. Otoh, Jordan is the only guy that faced MAXIMUM defensive attention in every series (carried scoring load in every series).

  8. #8
    College star dankok8's Avatar
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    Default Re: jordon extremist alts' case for jordon being GOAT: Jack of all trades, Master of

    Quote Originally Posted by RRR3 View Post
    Never eh? OP is ridiculous but so is this comment.
    What is ridiculous about what I said?

  9. #9
    NBA Legend Hey Yo's Avatar
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    Default Re: jordon extremist alts' case for jordon being GOAT: Jack of all trades, Master of

    33.5ppg on 28fga

  10. #10
    Serious playground baller
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    Default Re: jordon extremist alts' case for jordon being GOAT: Jack of all trades, Master of

    I don't think this thread is going as well as they had hoped.


  11. #11
    Lol RRR3's Avatar
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    Default Re: jordon extremist alts' case for jordon being GOAT: Jack of all trades, Master of

    Quote Originally Posted by dankok8 View Post
    What is ridiculous about what I said?
    You think thereís no chance he wasnít outplayed in this series by Cummings and/or Moncrief as a rookie? https://www.basketball-reference.com...-vs-bucks.html

    Or in this one by Bird? https://www.basketball-reference.com...s-celtics.html

    He didnít exactly have a good series here either outside of one huge game. https://www.basketball-reference.com...vs-knicks.html Pippen bailed him out here tbh. Not knocking him you need your teammates to step up obviously.

  12. #12
    College superstar TheGoatest's Avatar
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    Default Re: jordon extremist alts' case for jordon being GOAT: Jack of all trades, Master of

    He was outplayed by Shawn Kemp in the 1996 finals. And his team would've been in the exact same spot as the previous season against the Magic if they hadn't acquired Dennis Rodman to clean up jordon's brickage.

  13. #13
    Lol RRR3's Avatar
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    Default Re: jordon extremist alts' case for jordon being GOAT: Jack of all trades, Master of

    Believing MJ was never outplayed, even in the series that I brought up (+the 96 finals which I forgot but was listed after), simply because he had the most PPG regardless of efficiency or team success, would require you to concede that LeBron was the best player in the 2014, 2015 and 2018 finals which I doubt most MJ fans are willing to do. It also would make criticism of LeBron losing the 09 ECF despite averaging almost 40 PPG on excellent efficiency highly dubious.

  14. #14
    It is what it is TheMan's Avatar
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    Default Re: jordon extremist alts' case for jordon being GOAT: Jack of all trades, Master of

    Quote Originally Posted by RRR3 View Post
    Meltdown
    Lol, when even a LeBron stan recognizes how bad another LeBron stan is melting down, then it really has to be BAD

  15. #15
    It is what it is TheMan's Avatar
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    Default Re: jordon extremist alts' case for jordon being GOAT: Jack of all trades, Master of

    Quote Originally Posted by TheGoatest View Post
    He was outplayed by Shawn Kemp in the 1996 finals. And his team would've been in the exact same spot as the previous season against the Magic if they hadn't acquired Dennis Rodman to clean up jordon's brickage.
    After the Bulls were up 3-0, no one back then thought the Bulls would shit the bed 4 straight times. Kemp put up nice numbers when it was all but said and done

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