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  1. #31
    ISH jizzrag slayer Axe's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why does Rudy Gobert get a pass for not developing his offensive game, but Simmon

    Because toody is just a glorified role player.

  2. #32
    NBA All-star GimmeThat's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why does Rudy Gobert get a pass for not developing his offensive game, but Simmon

    because for reasons such as "team" or "system" it's somehow better for players to become even more specialized in the aspect of their responsibility. a concept in which pace tries to obliterate

  3. #33
    NBA Legend and Hall of Famer Xiao Yao You's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why does Rudy Gobert get a pass for not developing his offensive game, but Simmon

    Quote Originally Posted by Kblaze8855 View Post
    The purpose of a guy who removes the entire paint as an option, is to guard the entire other team. If he were there to guard individuals, he’d be of much less use. He’s a Dikembe Mutombo not a Dennis Rodman. He’s not a man to man stopper he is there for his team defense. Small ball, however makes him either play individual defense and destroy the entire game plan his team has relied on the entire year or continue to defend the paint and concede threes.

    Everyone on the team being good at everything isn’t a solution. Or better it’s the solution for everything not this specific issue. They aren’t gonna play him with a second rim defender. That’s usually gonna be a second guy to disrupt the spacing on offense.

    And putting him with two elite players isn’t a solution either. You might as well say you solve a teams problems by making them a superteam too overwhelming for their dysfunction to matter.

    ”Make the whole team great ln both ends” and “Give him two offensive superstars” aren’t tactics they are fairy tails. A gm would likely say “Oh…add multiple superstars? Damn why didn’t we come up with that?”.

    It’s just trying to cover the problem with other peoples greatness. You can cover any problem by just adding insurmountable talent so long as they get along.

    In the real world where you don’t just make stars and 8 great two way players appear out of thin air you need solutions that involve tactical changes and I don’t see what they could be at this point.

    His type just isn’t built for playoff ball in a league where 9 people on every team can punish you from 3 so you can’t play your regular season D after they decide to make you honor it.

    If your idea is for him to go guard the perimeter one on one while everyone else stops their men from getting to the paint in a league that set out to neuter perimeter defense you need to go back to the drawing board.

    Players can travel, carry, and push off….defenders can’t hold them on the ball or off….and they all have massive driving lanes once you are forced to guard everyone at 23-30 feet.

    ”Everyone just stop your man” is a pipe dream in the league the nba has created with the caliber of player these guys have to stop.

    The problem is leaning on these old school paint clogging bigs to anchor the D all year to begin with. Works great for a while. Will win you some games. But it just gets them out of practice with the kinda offense the nba will play to get that guy out of the game.

    There is little to do about it I can see.
    we've already seen it. They were upset arguably once. They weren't supposed to win the series they lost with the team they had. They pulled two upsets though. You talk like teams have beaten their D every year. Their D was good enough to beat Houston. Rubio and Favors spotting up in the corner wasn't. Then they tried to play offense like Houston with no 4 and a tiny back court and their D got worse. Than last year they had a great offense during the regular season and in the playoffs it was Rubio/Favors level. Conley sucked. You had a coach that wouldn't make adjusments in the playoffs for 3 straight years. Supposedly they had reached their ceiling. COTM had reached his ceiling 3 years earlier. Tweek the roster with Hardy who knows? I do realize Hardy wasn't as good of a player as COTM though!

  4. #34
    Titles are overrated Kblaze8855's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why does Rudy Gobert get a pass for not developing his offensive game, but Simmon

    I’ve seen you make that reference at the end like 10 times lately and it feels like you think you’re referencing some argument we had in the past and for the life of me I can’t remember what it was. I can’t find any reference ever of me talking to you or anyone about how good a coach was as a player somehow making him better than coaches who played worse. And I am very good at finding such things. None of my searches have shown me having such a conversation with you but you seem to reference it 4 times a week.

    Did you dream it or was it from that lost period around Kobes accident where everything is gone?

  5. #35
    NBA Legend and Hall of Famer Xiao Yao You's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why does Rudy Gobert get a pass for not developing his offensive game, but Simmon

    Quote Originally Posted by Kblaze8855 View Post
    I’ve seen you make that reference at the end like 10 times lately and it feels like you think you’re referencing some argument we had in the past and for the life of me I can’t remember what it was. I can’t find any reference ever of me talking to you or anyone about how good a coach was as a player somehow making him better than coaches who played worse. And I am very good at finding such things. None of my searches have shown me having such a conversation with you but you seem to reference it 4 times a week.

    Did you dream it or was it from that lost period around Kobes accident where everything is gone?
    To paraphrase you basically told me I couldn't criticize COTM because he was a better basketball player than me. Hard to forget something so bizarre

  6. #36
    NBA Legend and Hall of Famer Xiao Yao You's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why does Rudy Gobert get a pass for not developing his offensive game, but Simmon

    and hard for anyone to argue that I was right about the Jazz being long over due for a coaching change

  7. #37
    NBA All-star GimmeThat's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why does Rudy Gobert get a pass for not developing his offensive game, but Simmon

    Quote Originally Posted by Xiao Yao You View Post
    and hard for anyone to argue that I was right about the Jazz being long over due for a coaching change
    if by hard to argue, you mean you're basing your entire argument that Clarkson playing better than last season is what's making the Jazz better. yea

  8. #38
    Titles are overrated Kblaze8855's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why does Rudy Gobert get a pass for not developing his offensive game, but Simmon

    Quote Originally Posted by Xiao Yao You View Post
    To paraphrase you basically told me I couldn't criticize COTM because he was a better basketball player than me. Hard to forget something so bizarre
    Whatever that discussion was(if it happened to begin with) I suspect your “paraphrase” is more than a little off.

    I’m sure he knew his team better than you did(especially considering you looked at it entirely from a point of view built around propping up one player) but whatever he was as a player wouldn’t be why.

    Id love to read whatever that argument was just to see how absurd your take away is and why you think I’d remember it. I’ve been wondering what the hell you’re talking about for quite a while.

  9. #39
    NBA Legend and Hall of Famer Xiao Yao You's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why does Rudy Gobert get a pass for not developing his offensive game, but Simmon

    Quote Originally Posted by GimmeThat View Post
    if by hard to argue, you mean you're basing your entire argument that Clarkson playing better than last season is what's making the Jazz better. yea
    no I'm talking about a young guy that hasn't gotten set in his ways and is willing to try anything. He has them playing hard and sharing the ball. They have had a chance to win pretty much every game this year. They have won in many different ways. Clarkson is his biggest negative for sure

  10. #40
    Titles are overrated Kblaze8855's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why does Rudy Gobert get a pass for not developing his offensive game, but Simmon

    Quote Originally Posted by Xiao Yao You View Post
    no I'm talking about a young guy that hasn't gotten set in his ways and is willing to try anything. He has them playing hard and sharing the ball. They have had a chance to win pretty much every game this year. They have won in many different ways. Clarkson is his biggest negative for sure
    Yet it seems he’s gonna play the most minutes of his career. Why do you think that is? Why did both his previous coach you hate and his current coach you seem to think is a step in the right direction want to play this guy you think it’s terrible so many minutes?

  11. #41
    NBA Legend and Hall of Famer Xiao Yao You's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why does Rudy Gobert get a pass for not developing his offensive game, but Simmon

    Quote Originally Posted by Kblaze8855 View Post
    Whatever that discussion was(if it happened to begin with) I suspect your “paraphrase” is more than a little off.

    I’m sure he knew his team better than you did(especially considering you looked at it entirely from a point of view built around propping up one player) but whatever he was as a player wouldn’t be why.

    Id love to read whatever that argument was just to see how absurd your take away is and why you think I’d remember it. I’ve been wondering what the hell you’re talking about for quite a while.
    I wouldn't think you'd remember. I certainly didn't forget. God forbid someone criticizes a coach on a discussion board!

    He knew his team so much better than me he refused to make adjustments in the playoffs for 3 straight years! I looked at it as they could have beat Denver, LAC and Dallas if they weren't getting out coached. He out coached Rivers and Donovon when they upset those teams. Coaching does matter. A coaches former playing ability not so much

  12. #42
    NBA Legend and Hall of Famer Xiao Yao You's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why does Rudy Gobert get a pass for not developing his offensive game, but Simmon

    Quote Originally Posted by Kblaze8855 View Post
    Yet it seems he’s gonna play the most minutes of his career. Why do you think that is? Why did both his previous coach you hate and his current coach you seem to think is a step in the right direction want to play this guy you think it’s terrible so many minutes?
    could care less. He's a bum as far as I'm concerned. He's a gunner. He's got a low BB IQ. He doesn't defend. He can't shoot but shoots more than anyone. He's awful in the clutch and in final possessions. There's a reason he was a 6th man and not playing at the end of games his whole career. You're free to think what you like about him. I don't like him and never will. I don't like all players. Never have. Can't imagine anyone does!

  13. #43
    NBA Legend and Hall of Famer Xiao Yao You's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why does Rudy Gobert get a pass for not developing his offensive game, but Simmon

    COTM loved Clarkson and didn't allow Alec Burks to play that way. I'd take Burks any day. He's been good as soon as he got away from Utah

  14. #44
    NBA All-star GimmeThat's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why does Rudy Gobert get a pass for not developing his offensive game, but Simmon

    Quote Originally Posted by Xiao Yao You View Post
    no I'm talking about a young guy that hasn't gotten set in his ways and is willing to try anything. He has them playing hard and sharing the ball. They have had a chance to win pretty much every game this year. They have won in many different ways. Clarkson is his biggest negative for sure
    actively trying to solve world hunger we see.

  15. #45
    Titles are overrated Kblaze8855's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why does Rudy Gobert get a pass for not developing his offensive game, but Simmon

    Quote Originally Posted by Xiao Yao You View Post
    I wouldn't think you'd remember. I certainly didn't forget. God forbid someone criticizes a coach on a discussion board!

    He knew his team so much better than me he refused to make adjustments in the playoffs for 3 straight years! I looked at it as they could have beat Denver, LAC and Dallas if they weren't getting out coached. He out coached Rivers and Donovon when they upset those teams. Coaching does matter. A coaches former playing ability not so much
    I strongly suspect that not only did I not say it did nobody ever did in a serious fashion. What do you think? I think Magic Johnson was a better coach than Phil Jackson? You have been hung up for months on an argument that either never happened or you intentionally took the wrong way. What do you even think it was about? Give me some key words. I’ll find whatever it was if it happened.

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