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Thread: Soccer Players are World Class Athletes??

  1. #76
    -primetime-
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    Default Re: Soccer Players are World Class Athletes??

    Quote Originally Posted by kentatm
    some of you need to get a clue. NBA and NFL players the best athletes?

    yea right.

    that honor goes triathlon competitors.

    Also, any of you saying NBA and NFL players are more athletic than soccer players are nitwits. They are about even.

    You can even throw rugby, hockey cross country skiing, swimming etc etc etc into the mix for best athletes.

    athleticism is more than jumping high. idiots.
    you should read more

    they are trying to prove that the greatest combination of all athletic traits is used in the NFL

    speed, strength, endurance, ect...

  2. #77
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    Default Re: Soccer Players are World Class Athletes??

    you are saying that they are equal?

    it depends on the position the player in the NFL is playing...

    a versitile athlete like Deion or LT is more athletic than any soccer player...but a punter is no where close to a star soccer player

    the NFL is a wide range of body types and skill sets
    True, the NFL is a wide range of body types and skills sets- that's why you have to compare the players in both sports who are similar. There's no point in trying to put Orlando Pace, as great of an athlete as he is, against any soccer player ever. That still doesn't invalidate that on average, a top NFL running back is going to be stronger, tougher, and likely faster for the first 10 or 15 yards, while a top Champions League striker is going to be better conditioned, more coordinated/skilled, and faster sprinting over a slightly longer distance.

    They're amazing athletes, with a lot of similarities. But there is specialization due to the different demands of the sports.

    All I know is that Bo Jackson and Deion Sanders are 5x more athletic than the greatest soccer players in the history of the game...

    and the size of the soccer feild shoudn't matter that much..NBA players have to run up and down the court the whole time they play....the are running 24/7 just lie a soccer player is....it shouldn't matter if thefeild is 5 miles long or 5 inches long....they are still constantly running

    if you want to talk about a sport that needs the most endurance (other than marathon running)....look at boxing

    many will tell you that boxing is the most athletic sport there is...just you and your fists and your heart, and a ton of footwork
    See, now this post is worthless. Without explaining AT ALL, you make a claim that 2 of the most athletic players ever in a sport drawing from a talent pool of 300 million, are 5x more athletic than players from a sport that requires similar abilities, drawing from a talent pool of several billion. Great logic. I guess I wouldn't understand someone with a screenname of Primetime to be logical about admitting that Deion is basically as close to a "soccer" type athlete playing in the NFL as you'll ever get.

    I'll repeat the question- how much top level soccer do you watch?

    Oh, and your point of basketball fitness versus soccer fitness isn't good.
    There is a vast difference between making lots of little spurts of speed and explosion, followed by a rest on the bench (basketball), versus essentially non stop fast jog punctuated by rare, long distance sprints with no sitting rest (soccer). The first needs anaerobic fitness, the second needs both aerobic and anaerobic fitness. And if you don't know the difference between the two, don't try pulling something out of your ass about them.

    Again, do you even watch soccer?
    Last edited by srv_fan; 08-11-2007 at 06:39 PM.

  3. #78
    Why do you care? dhenk's Avatar
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    Default Re: Soccer Players are World Class Athletes??

    Quote Originally Posted by Young HkM
    The vice versa would have been a professional soccer player has no chance in the NFL, not the NBA.

    They're two different professional leagues. Dumbass.
    Congratulations,it took time,but you became smarter...
    That`s why I said,read the original post I responded to...

    and welcome to ISH,people here talking about basketball fyi
    But let me make it clear for you,so you won`t be confused...

    The average soccer player has no chance in the NBA,ABA and NFL...

  4. #79
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    Default Re: Soccer Players are World Class Athletes??

    The average soccer player has no chance in the NBA,ABA and NFL...
    Maybe not the average player, but a really athletic top player in La Liga or whatever, if they had focused on football and its skills rather than soccer, could definately be an NFL WR. Look at Steve Smith and Marvin Harrison- they're WAY more of a stereotypical "soccer" athleticism type than football.

    Similarly, Steve Smith or Marvin Harrison, if they had focused on soccer, would be sick.
    Theres a lot of athleticism crossover, whether the ISHiots want to admit it nor not.

  5. #80
    -primetime-
    Fan in the Stands (unregistered)

    Default Re: Soccer Players are World Class Athletes??

    Quote Originally Posted by srv_fan
    See, now this post is worthless. Without explaining AT ALL, you make a claim that 2 of the most athletic players ever in a sport drawing from a talent pool of 300 million, are 5x more athletic than players from a sport that requires similar abilities, drawing from a talent pool of several billion. Great logic. I guess I wouldn't understand someone with a screenname of Primetime to be logical about admitting that Deion is basically as close to a "soccer" type athlete playing in the NFL as you'll ever get.
    so who is a more well rounded athlete in your opinion?

    Deion/Bo or Pele?

    Quote Originally Posted by srv_fan
    I'll repeat the question- how much top level soccer do you watch?
    ZERO....but I grew up playing all sports (except hockey)

    football, soccer, basketball, and baseball

    imo football is the most demanding on your body...also takes the biggest toll on you.....thus only 16 games

  6. #81
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    Default Re: Soccer Players are World Class Athletes??

    Quote Originally Posted by srv_fan
    Serious question to anyone posting on this thread: how much Euro league soccer have you watched? It's a fair question, because I think a lot of people are associating soccer in the U.S., which ABSOLUTELY gets the reject athletes from bigger sports. American football players destroy American soccer players athletically. However, in virtually every country besides America, the best athletes are playing soccer, not football. Do you guys actually think a talent pool drawing from the best athletes of a population of several BILLION can't produce an equal athlete to NBA guards or NFL wide recievers? Think of all the gold medal winners in sprints, long distance running, high jumps, weightlifting, wrestling, etc. that come from countries other than the US. I'm pretty sure if they can produce gold medal winners in every other sport, they can get athletes as good as the best American ones.

    I'd like to see if anyone is willing to make a coherent argument against mine.
    As for the serious question, I have been to a few Champions League and Dutch League matches in person, plus all of the big leagues are on TV all the time and I have played soccer for a team myself for nearly a decade.

    But on the original argument "Soccer Players are World Class Athletes??", I don't think you can argue soccer players anywhere near NFL or NBA players as athletes.

    I'm not even going to go into upper body strength, because that should be obvious.

    But even lower body strength, soccer players aren't exceptional because it's not needed, or they have to be too well rounded otherwise. They have to have that endurance. But endurance always will hurt your top speed. Yet they can't have too much endurance, because that would hurt their speed too much.
    To put it simple:
    A decent amateur long distance runner would destroy a soccer player at a half marathon. An decent amateur sprinter would destroy a soccer player at a sprint.

    Being quick with the ball on your feet, agile with the ball, your coordination, I see those as skills. A guy like Cruyff was a notorious smoker and had bad conditioning overall, but he was still the quickest player in the world. It had nothing to do with his athletisism.

    Now, I'm not saying they couldn't be top athletes, because a lot of top soccer players are exceptional physical talents. But they simply aren't trained to be.

  7. #82
    NBA Legend kentatm's Avatar
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    Default Re: Soccer Players are World Class Athletes??

    Quote Originally Posted by -primetime-
    you should read more

    they are trying to prove that the greatest combination of all athletic traits is used in the NFL

    speed, strength, endurance, ect...

    ehh, don't have time to go through this whole thing since this pops up at least 3 or 4 times a year.

    but as for the greatest athletic traits going into football? thats a no again. especially when it comes to endurance.

    worthless debate though. you can take the top three athletes in each of these sports and they would all be about the same. that includes baseball players too.

  8. #83
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    Default Re: Soccer Players are World Class Athletes??

    Iverson is arguably the most athletic player in NBA history. Please don't compare Nate Robinson to Iverson athletically.
    Nate Robinson is more athletic than AI you ****in moron.

  9. #84
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    Default Re: Soccer Players are World Class Athletes??

    but as for the greatest athletic traits going into football? thats a no again. especially when it comes to endurance.
    Strength, speed, vertical are all at top levels in the NFL. Endurance is important too. Take LT, he sprints then gets hammered and gets up again and does it over and over for 60 minutes.

  10. #85
    Up in the Rafters Young HkM's Avatar
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    Default Re: Soccer Players are World Class Athletes??

    Quote Originally Posted by dhenk
    Congratulations,it took time,but you became smarter...
    That`s why I said,read the original post I responded to...

    and welcome to ISH,people here talking about basketball fyi
    But let me make it clear for you,so you won`t be confused...

    The average soccer player has no chance in the NBA,ABA and NFL...
    I'll reply to whichever post I feel. If you weren't an idiot your posts wouldn't conflict with eachother so it wouldn't be necessary for me to read your OP dumbass.

    Welcome to ISH? You're the newb. Yes we're here to talk basketball, but we're not here to be retarded, something you're leading the forum in.

  11. #86
    Why do you care? dhenk's Avatar
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    Default Re: Soccer Players are World Class Athletes??

    Quote Originally Posted by Young HkM
    Or instead I can stop reading where I see a problem and reply to a borderline retarded post.
    That`s how I care about your opinion.

  12. #87
    NBA Legend kentatm's Avatar
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    Default Re: Soccer Players are World Class Athletes??

    Quote Originally Posted by Skywalker
    Strength, speed, vertical are all at top levels in the NFL. Endurance is important too. Take LT, he sprints then gets hammered and gets up again and does it over and over for 60 minutes.
    No he does not. There is this thing that happens called defense where he goes and sits his ass down on the bench for extended periods of time. There are also these things called passing plays where quite often he flares out on a short route as nothing more than a safety valve.

  13. #88
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    Default Re: Soccer Players are World Class Athletes??

    Soccer players are just much better than NFL or NBA players. Every soccer player requires strength ( they're weaker than football players though), speed, endurance, creativity, SHAPE ( no 300 pound guy can make it), ability to elevate, accurance, and explosiveness. ( i'm not talking about a " exploded to the rim" explosiveness). Also, before you talk you're suppose to know how european "football" works. It's a different level than the MLS. Just because you've seen a top ten soccer play in SC doesn't mean you know how it works.

  14. #89
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    Default Re: Soccer Players are World Class Athletes??

    so who is a more well rounded athlete in your opinion?

    Deion/Bo or Pele?
    I think Bo is possible the greatest natural athletic talent of all time, so I'd probably put him above any soccer player or other NFL player I've seen. You're just not supposed to be that big, fast, quick, and coordinated. He would have been dominant in basically every sport not involving marathon-type stuff that I can think of.

    Deion- I think he is/was an absurdly fast, quick, coordinated, and skilled athlete, who lacked strength compared to other NFL players- you're a Dallas fan, so don't try to pretend he was anything less than the greatest cover corner of all time, yet one of the worst tacklers in the NFL. Deion is the closest to a soccer type athlete playing in the NFL you will ever see. I think in a Euro soccer league, Deion would be among the very top tier of athletes (like top 5 or whatever), but not undisputedly the best. I urge you to Youtube Thierry Henry or Cristiano Ronaldo because you will see that they are very similar athletes to Deion.

    Pele is from a much earlier era, so it isn't really a fair comparison. If you want a good one, I will absolutely say that Thierry Henry and Deion are roughly equal athletically.
    imo football is the most demanding on your body...also takes the biggest toll on you.....thus only 16 games
    Absolutely true. Football ends careers with a regular basis.

    But on the original argument "Soccer Players are World Class Athletes??", I don't think you can argue soccer players anywhere near NFL or NBA players as athletes.

    I'm not even going to go into upper body strength, because that should be obvious.

    But even lower body strength, soccer players aren't exceptional because it's not needed, or they have to be too well rounded otherwise. They have to have that endurance. But endurance always will hurt your top speed. Yet they can't have too much endurance, because that would hurt their speed too much.
    To put it simple:

    Being quick with the ball on your feet, agile with the ball, your coordination, I see those as skills. A guy like Cruyff was a notorious smoker and had bad conditioning overall, but he was still the quickest player in the world. It had nothing to do with his athletisism.

    Now, I'm not saying they couldn't be top athletes, because a lot of top soccer players are exceptional physical talents. But they simply aren't trained to be.
    Most of your points trying to say soccer is skill rather than athleticism are not physiciologically true, though I do agree with the larger point that soccer is more of a skill sport than football.

    Soccer players don't have lower body strength? So how do they kick the ball at up to 90 MPH? The Force?

    You claim coordination and quickness is a learned skill. That is simply not true. You can practice to improve those traits, but a large part of it is genetic. I could practice every day for the rest of my life and not touch AI or Messi for coordination and agility. Learn about kinesiologys test for spatiovisual coordination- its a genetic trait.

    A decent amateur long distance runner would destroy a soccer player at a half marathon. An decent amateur sprinter would destroy a soccer player at a sprint.
    The exact same is true for a NFL running back.

    A guy like Cruyff was a notorious smoker and had bad conditioning overall, but he was still the quickest player in the world. It had nothing to do with his athletisism.
    Bringing up Cruyff is invalid- he played in such a long ago era where basically no one followed proper fitness. If you get to bring him up, why not start mentioning how Bob Lanier (voted to 50 greatest NBAers of all time) chainsmoked?
    Last edited by srv_fan; 08-11-2007 at 07:05 PM.

  15. #90
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    Default Re: Soccer Players are World Class Athletes??

    Soccer players are just much better than NFL or NBA players. Every soccer player requires strength ( they're weaker than football players though), speed, endurance, creativity, SHAPE ( no 300 pound guy can make it), ability to elevate, accurance, and explosiveness. ( i'm not talking about a " exploded to the rim" explosiveness). Also, before you talk you're suppose to know how european "football" works. It's a different level than the MLS. Just because you've seen a top ten soccer play in SC doesn't mean you know how it works.
    You don't count 300 pounders, since they are needed in NFL and not in EPL and all that.

    As athletes, american football players are superior.

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