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Old 01-02-2018, 04:20 PM   #856
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Default Re: 2017-2018 regular season...back to square one again

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Move #4: Trade Derrick Favors to Memphis for Tyreke Evans and Brandon Wright, plus the right for the Jazz to swap its 2018 1st round draft pick with Memphis's 2018 1st round draft pick (which swap might also require the Jazz to throw in the Jazz's 2019 1st round draft pick).

Although Tyreke Evans has been the Grizzlies' best player for most of this season, he is on a low dollar one-year deal, and with the way he has been playing, the Grizzlies probably won't be able to re-sign him during the off-season--even if they had cap room. By trading for Favors, the Grizzlies get a very good post player who fits well into their system, and who can be re-signed even if they are over the salary cap (and luxury tax cap), because of his Bird rights. Brandon Wright needs to be thrown into the deal to make the dollars work, but he could also fill Favors' current role with the Jazz for the remainder of the season. Tyreke Evans--if he continues playing the way he has been playing recently--could fill most of the scoring and play making void created by the loss of Gordon Hayward in free agency, and should be able to be signed for the mid-level exception in the off-season ($8.4 mil. per season). By obtaining a swap of draft picks with Memphis (even if it means the Jazz would also have to trade next season's 1st round draft pick to Memphis) the Jazz would be able to pick high in the 2018 draft lottery in order to get a good replacement PF for Derrick Favors. Favors would get to go to a system (that fits his skill set) where he could continue to be a starter and have a big role--and the addition of Favors might be enough to allow Memphis to get back to its winning ways without having to go through a major rebuild. Finally, the Jazz would get some cap relief by replacing Favors' salary for 2018-2019 and beyond with Tyreke Evans' salary for 2018-2019 and beyond (plus a rookie scale salary).

Memphis would want the pick protected

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Proposed Jazz roster following 2018 trade deadline:

PG: Hill, Exum (injured), Burks

SG: Mitchell, Ingles, Hezonja

SF: Evans, Sefolosha, O'Neale

PF: Jerebko, Leonard, Wright

C: Gobert, Udoh, Bradley

I'd start Burks and bring Hill off the bench for lots of minutes behind both positions and with Alec sometimes at the 3.

Evans is probably best off the bench or starting at the 2.

Need Ingles or Thabo starting at the 3

Thabo could start at the 4 as well.

Trade Udoh/Exum instead of Neto

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Proposed Jazz roster for 2018-2019 season:

PG: Hill, Exum, Burks

SG: Mitchell, Ingles, Hezonja

SF: Evans, Sefolosha, O'Neale

PF: Williams, Jerebko, Leonard

C: Gobert, Udoh, Bradley

Goss?

So two more years of Leonard and he's not playing? Resigning Hezonja and he's not playing? Keeping Burks and he's not playing? O'Neale isn't playing? Bradley isn't playing?

Hard to predict how the guys you acquired fit.

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What do you think--if the Jazz could pull it all off?

Better than what they have but I don't think they can do it exactly like that. Same guys I'd be looking to trade with Udoh and Exum as well not Neto. Don't think they necessarily have to get a lot back as far as immediate starters/rotation players. Be more about getting rid of those guys and adding some flexibilty and assets

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I don't like the Hill trade
Hill is one of the few point guards playing worse than Rubio. I also think the Jazz lost all interest in him once he declined the extension they offered.

Other than that, I don’t mind the moves.

by Beeblebrox42 on Jan 1, 2018 | 2:13 PM reply



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Hill has not played well for the kings, and I think it could create a weird locker room for him to come back after declining the extension last year.

Why? Both sides made business decisions. Both sides should welcome a reunion. Makes too much sense.

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A trade I think is interesting is working something out with the bucks for Jabari.
Jazz Trade: Favors, Hood
Bucks Trade: Jabari, Delluvedova

http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=y8mfebp8

Why the Jazz do it:
Favs, Rudy, Rubio don’t work, and Favs is expiring, so getting any value back for him would be good, and you do him a solid by sending him to a good team. You give up Hood, but get back Jabari, who could be a great fit next to DM and Rudy.

Why the Bucks do it:
They get an upgrade at center, and another good c&s wing to play with Giannis. They also get out of Dellavedova’s contract (3yrs at $9m), and don’t have to worry about matching a potential max contract for Parker this summer (the would have to be willing to, of course).

I think it’s a decent win-win scenario

Signing a guy coming off his 2nd ACL injury to max?
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Old 01-02-2018, 10:43 PM   #857
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Default Re: 2017-2018 regular season...back to square one again

https://www.slcdunk.com/2018/1/2/168...ll-rudy-gobert

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The Jazz have scored 102 points per 100 possessions in 551 minutes with both starting guards on the floor, and 109 in 525 minutes with Mitchell on the floor without Rubio.

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Old 01-03-2018, 01:17 PM   #858
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Default Re: 2017-2018 regular season...back to square one again

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Scotto: You have Anthony Davis entering his prime. Cousins is in his prime. Why are you resetting at that point? You’re trying to make the playoffs — not only keep your job if you’re Dell Demps and the guys in that management — but you’ve shown flashes of having a puncher’s chance against Golden State when you have those big guys as a tandem. I don’t see him getting moved at this point. – via audioBoom

Alex Kennedy: Do you think we see DeAndre Jordan get moved before free agency this upcoming summer? Michael Scotto: I think certainly the Clippers will gauge his value in the trade market. That said, it’s funny because around the league you hear conflicting things. I think the people who want DeAndre Jordan are pushing the narrative that the Clippers are trying to get rid of him. I don’t necessarily get that vibe if you’re the Clippers. Because I’ve heard from some people, they want to keep DeAndre and make him a Clipper for life with Blake Griffin. So really, it depends who you talk to. – via audioBoom

more value for Favors!
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Old 01-03-2018, 02:04 PM   #859
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Default Re: 2017-2018 regular season...back to square one again

https://thejnotes.com/2018/01/03/uta...-battle-dimes/

Pretty much the Jazz in a nutshell. Have to have a big night from Rubio or Hood to compete because they getting about 1/4 the minutes regardless of their play.
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Old 01-03-2018, 02:13 PM   #860
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Default Re: 2017-2018 regular season...back to square one again

https://fansided.com/2018/01/02/dono...ordon-hayward/

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So in 2018? Don’t try to plan. Don’t try to predict. Don’t try to sign Gordon Hayward or draft Markelle Fultz. When life hands you a 13th pick, or takes away a Jazz legend, it may seem like a catastrophe but only if you can’t find it in yourself to hope or dream. The world is a mansion bigger than the moon, and behind every door is Donovan Mitchell.

If only Ricky wasn't coming out the other door
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Old 01-03-2018, 08:40 PM   #861
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Default Re: 2017-2018 regular season...back to square one again

https://www.slcdunk.com/2018/1/3/168...novan-mitchell

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maybe going small with Thabo Sefolosha is the answer. Instead of fighting fire with fire, maybe fighting fire with small-ball could work. However, with Davis’ and Cousins’ penchant for post play, I worry about Thabo’s ability to keep them out of the paint and off the boards.

Put Ingles on Cousins and try to get him to lose his cool!
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Old 01-04-2018, 10:57 AM   #862
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Default Re: 2017-2018 regular season...back to square one again

https://www.ksl.com/?sid=46229462&ni...ss-to-pelicans

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It's been a little bit strange for the Jazz, who I think have played with more up-and-down force than any season since the final Ty Corbin year. Usually, they're better at more consistently giving more effort, but they have a lot of players in weird contract situations. Maybe that's playing a role.

Time for the GM/coach to do something about it. Hard to believe benching Thabo or Jonas is the way to go though

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Alec Burks made some horrific decisions with the ball throughout the game, except that he was the Jazz's offensive spark early in the fourth quarter.

until he was benched so Hood could clank up a few more

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Ekpe Udoh made 3-4 shots, had two steals ... and was a -12 in only 13 minutes on the floor.

His best game in at least 5

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The very best example of this: I had five people say that Ricky Rubio was the Jazz's worst player, and three people say that Rubio was the Jazz's best player. Rubio tried pretty hard, picked up 11 points, seven assists, and four steals. But the Jazz were outscored by 20 points when he was on the floor. Which is right? The truth is probably somewhere in between.

He's the worst player on the roster no question about it though

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But I think it's also a good example of how our own biases and perspectives change how we view the game. Someone who prefers plus-minus as a player-evaluation tool might have a wildly different opinion than someone who likes to look at clutch performance, or efficiency, or even just the eye test.

In a game like tonight's, with no obvious standouts, it's easy to just apply your own preconceived notions coming into the game over what actually happened.

Yeah like how you and Snyder can think Hood is great and Burks sucks!
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Old 01-04-2018, 07:13 PM   #863
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Default Re: 2017-2018 regular season...back to square one again

Brian Mahoney: Boston’s Jayson Tatum, Utah’s Donovan Mitchell the NBA’s Eastern and Western Conference rookies of the month for December. – via Twitter briancmahoney
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Old 01-04-2018, 07:16 PM   #864
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Default Re: 2017-2018 regular season...back to square one again

And before anyone starts screaming into the Twittersphere, Hill says it himself: This is not George Hill. “Very frustrating,” he said. “I’ve never been through anything like this, not ever. It’s not what I expected, a little more difficult than I anticipated. I think as a team we all get along. We like being around each other, like doing things together. But we’re still trying to learn each other, and it’s a different style of play. I’ve just got to figure things out.” – via Sacramento Bee
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Old 01-04-2018, 07:19 PM   #865
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Default Re: 2017-2018 regular season...back to square one again

The Knicks’ offense is floundering and there’s a desire from some in the organization to call up their G-League star Trey Burke, a source told the Daily News. However, there’s also a big obstacle to such a move — the team would need to create a roster spot. Burke, a 25-year-old point guard, signed with the Knicks in October but was immediately released and sent down to the G-League team in Westchester, where he’s averaging 27.3 points and shooting nearly 50 percent. – via New York Daily News

New York’s current starting point guard, Jarrett Jack, is the only Knick on a non-guaranteed deal. His contract will become guaranteed if he’s not cut by Jan. 7 because it takes a full 48 hours to clear waivers (the guarantee date is technically Jan. 10). Among the other 14 players on the roster, point guard Ramon Sessions would be the most likely waiver-wire candidate given his small contract and lack of playing time. – via New York Daily News

However, the Knicks would prefer to make a trade to free up a roster spot. They already waived a player on a guaranteed deal (Mindaugas Kuzminskas) to make room for the return of Joakim Noah following a PED suspension. – via New York Daily News
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Old 01-04-2018, 07:34 PM   #866
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Default Re: 2017-2018 regular season...back to square one again

http://www.sltrib.com/sports/jazz/20...-for-the-jazz/

Quote:
But against the Pelicans, he showed a glimpse of why Snyder has continued to play him in each game while switching out Thabo Sefolosha and Jonas Jerebko around him.

But why bench two of their best players while Rubio and Hood continue to kill the team?
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Old 01-04-2018, 07:46 PM   #867
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Default Re: 2017-2018 regular season...back to square one again

http://www.sltrib.com/sports/jazz/20...stern-matchup/

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Without Rudy Gobert, and with Donovan Mitchell representing Utah’s only consistent scoring threat, the Jazz are a team with no margin for error. If everything is working smoothly on a given night, the Jazz can beat anyone in the NBA.

But if the Jazz miss even one more shot than usual, or give a shoddy defensive effort, or run into a difficult matchup, victories are hard to come by. This is why they are 16-22 on the season, and have lost 11 of their past 14 game

They have that record because of the gm and the coach that gives 1/4 of the minutes to Hood and Rubio no matter how they perform and benches one of their best players ever game now because he thinks he's so smart

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“We didn’t hit shots, but they outplayed us,” Jazz guard Rodney Hood said.

you especially though

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They trailed by as many as 13 points in the second half, but pulled within 84-81 with eight minutes remaining after two free throws by Alec Burks.

and Burks was benched for some reason and it was over!

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They are 3 1/2 games behind the Pelicans for the eighth and final playoff spot in the Western Conference, and 11th in the West overall.

almost time to officially tank
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Old 01-04-2018, 08:10 PM   #868
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Default Re: 2017-2018 regular season...back to square one again

http://saltcityhoops.com/pels-jazz-n...m-monster-duo/

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It seemed Joe Johnson was becoming frustrated with his role within Quin’s rotation, but showed why he needs to play

Frustrated? Two other guys are being platooned so Joe can play big minutes


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an off night for Rodney Hood (1-for-10)

he has a lot of off nights

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Alec Burks brought some excitement with a big dunk and then an and-one of his own to give the Jazz life with an 84-79 deficit. A few plays later, Burks went streaming down the lane to earn a pair of freebies on a hard foul by Darius Miller. However, that was the last rally as the Jazz couldn’t get much momentum the rest of the way and Anthony Davis remembered that he is really, really good at basketball.

And that Snyder is a horrible coach as Burks got benched
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Old 01-04-2018, 08:17 PM   #869
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Default Re: 2017-2018 regular season...back to square one again

http://saltcityhoops.com/jazz_small_lineups_fall_short/

Quote:
10 percent – Rodney Hood’s field goal percentage, including missing all six of his three point shots. He’s now taken at least 10 shots and made fewer than 30 percent in a quarter of his games this season.

go to guy!

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This is turning out to be a rough season for Hood. Tonight his shot was off–and when he’s off he’s really off. Yet he clearly tried to attack the hoop but only served to put on display how shaky his handle is when trying to penetrate against a set defender, turning the ball over four times and losing his balance on almost every drive. After the expectations saddled on him entering the season, these grotesque shooting games are killing his confidence. And to be honest, they’re killing the Jazz. Utah has had 21 players take at least 10 shots in a game where they shot at or below 30 percent from the field. Here are the team’s winning percentage in those games:

What's killing the Jazz is Snyder playing Rubio and Hood no matter how much they are killing the Jazz

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The Jazz have been outscored by 87 with Hood in the game this season. In Alec Burks’s minutes, they’ve outscored opponents by 27. They’ve been outscored by 111 with Rubio on the court. With Mitchell in the game they’ve managed to outscore opponents (by two), despite the hellish December schedule. The guard line needs adjustment: in shot distribution, and minutes, and roles. The team may really be missing Dante Exum.

Yeah Rubio lite would solve everything!
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Old 01-04-2018, 08:46 PM   #870
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Default Re: 2017-2018 regular season...back to square one again

https://www.slcdunk.com/2018/1/3/168...-game-reaction

Quote:
Hood: Management needs to know how he fits on the team and how he adjusts to the role of alpha scorer at times on the court. Can he play point-forward minutes? How does he work as the initiator? This information will feed into decisions about his contract (should they max him, start with a lower offer, or not offer him at all? Would they match any offer from another team or be more guarded?).

Not much doubt they will pay him whatever it takes. It's why the Jazz will always be mediocre.

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Sefalosha: He is being rested for "match-up" purposes like guarding KD and Lebron, which only makes sense as advertisement as a trade piece. His super team-friendly contract and lockdown wing defense will make him a very attractive trade piece for a contending team as his age makes him too big a risk for the Jazz to try and build around with the Mitchell-Rudy core, which is at least another year or two out from really being contenders.

I'd consider trading him for the right price because of his age but he could be a piece for years to come still. The fact that he is being platooned is ridiculous

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Jerebko: His value is akin to that of Thabo’s. However, there is probably value for his staying on the Jazz as well due to age and stretch-4 capability, which is why he is losing minutes to the next guy. If the Jazz know he is part of the plan moving forward, then they have to focus on the immediate need of showcasing the trade assets to increase their value prior to the deadline.

I'd consider trading him for the right price because of his age too but he's certainly another one that fits.

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Johnson: Joe is being showcased the same as Thabo and Favs. He has the potential to offer a scoring touch off the bench for contenders and is capable of playing better defense when he feels like it. Like Thabo, there needs to be enough evidence that he is capable of producing like he did against the Clippers last year (especially coming off his injury) and, frankly, the man deserves a run with a title contender. That last part won’t be a big part of the decision, I assume, just my personal respect for his help last year and willingness to come to Utah as a free agent. I’ll always respect and appreciate JJ for that.

Wouldn't surprise me at all if he was back next year. That's the way the Jazz roll

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Udoh: I don’t see as much managerial strategy surrounding Udoh as with the other guys I listed, but he also carries a team-friendly deal that can be leveraged should the need arise. I think non-stretching C is not in high demand right now, despite their clear positive impact with shooters around, but it doesn’t hurt to have the piece to match and make salaries work or what not.

Plenty of teams need a rim protector. I'd see what he's worth. He's ideally an end of the bench player not a rotation player

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So assuming this hypothesis has some substance, then I do not get so upset about seeing Hood playing ineffective minutes, because management needs to know this year what to do with him.

What will they see that hasn't been seen? I saw him as a 6th man 2 years ago. I see the Jazz move the ball without him in the game. Pretty obvious he needs to go but he will be paid. I think that's already been determined. Snyder might quit otherwise

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Alec is a quantity that doesn’t need to be known until next year, as he is contractually locked-in, which separates him from the free agents we signed last summer who are carrying team options.

That's stupid! He will have less value next year than now. They don't like him. They should be showcasing him

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I imagine that we’ll see a very different rotation after the trade deadline (not with Hood, but with JJ, Jerebko, Thabo, and Favs) because I imagine the roster will be different in some way on the other side (maybe even start to see Bradley in non-garbage time).

Other than Favors probably being gone I don't expect much else to change. Bradley might be in the rotation by the end of the year. O'Neale instead of Burks

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So what does this all mean to me as a Jazz fan in the here and now? I just watch the games now to see DM play, because he is getting meaningful minutes and is playing like a star. I really hope that this strategy (some suggest it is stealth tanking), if true, does not preclude the Jazz from getting into the playoffs because it is fun to watch and is important exposure for Mitchell and potentially Exum by then at this early stage of their careers.

Means the same old shit from this organization. Exum?

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Johnson and Favors have almost no trade value. No contenders are going to want a 4 month rental for a UFA. We might get a 2nd rounder back or some albatross contract. I also don’t see any contenders that need them. Cleveland doesn’t need ‘em. Houston doesn’t need ‘em. The Warriors don’t need ‘em. Boston can’t use them. Not sure about Toronto, but again, I don’t see the value.

Plenty of those teams could use them. Rather they have the pieces to get a deal done I don't know

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Thabo has trade value because his contract is great. But then why not play him? He’d be better than Johnson against AD.

He's be better than Rubio and Hood

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But Thabo, Udoh, and Jerebko all have very friendly contracts. There is no need to trade them. They’ve all been some of the best players on the team this year.

There's a need depending on the return

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Burks contract is a bit pricey, but hardly back-breaking.

A bargain for a potential all-star

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The Jazz don’t have a salary cap issue next year unless we are overpaying for Dante, Hood, and Favors. I think Dante will be cheap. I think Hood’s value is under 15M. And I think Favors will walk.

They'll have to spend money on someone to make up for Hood, Exum and Rubio sucking

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And remember, the key is not about being better now or next year, per se; it is about being a championship caliber team during the Gobert-Mitchell tenure.

You get better now by trading certain guys

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My guess is that Ekpe and Jonas are part of that plan for now, but Thabo is going to be a casualty because of his age. I admit that this is entirely speculative and it is possible that Quin is just being hard-headed about the rotation. That feels too simplistic of an explanation for me, though.

Quin is just an idiot. Won't bench Rubio or Favors but instead platoons Thabo and Jonas!

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I just don’t see that the team has much incentive to trade the cheap contract guys who are good unless they get good young guys in return.


again it depens on the return. Hood's contract is cheap He needs to go before it's not. Udoh is cheap and he shouldn't be in the rotation and Bradley needs a look. Anything for Exum would look good

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Trade
Favors/Rubio for Hill/Randolf??

If it's the only way to get rid of Ricky than yes!
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