Even as a fan for well over 2 decades I still must say..I dont think the NBA owes me.

[Kblaze8855]

As I often do....I find myself very much against public opinion on this one. But I have like 2 hours with nothing to do but eat lunch and watch tv so....**** it. Rambling time.

Fans are pissed about no season. Mad at rich players and even richer owners. Players and owners alike have their publicist approved comments lined about to appease simple minded fans who actually believe such comments.

But really...you know they dont care right? Of course you do. Most of you at least. Even the players with good attachments to their fanbases...the fans arent the issue. They sure as hell arent to the owners.

And really I dont see why they should be.

There is the ever present "Without us...they would be ____! We make all this possible!" way to look at it. But really...think about it....

Doesnt the public make every rich person rich? The money always comes from those who want or need the product or service they offer. be it NBA players rich off basketball owners rich off cruise lines and computers or...walmart. Whatever.

Rich peopel get rich off many people wanting what they offer. But does that really mean they owe us for deciding that they ask a fair price and us paying it to enjoy ourselves?

Do roller coaster engineers just...owe the people at disneyworld?

Does the mcdonalds board owe people who like burgers and kids who want a toy?

How does someone owe you...for you wanting what they sell?

Besides....how many players and owners do you think provide less than a standard fan?

Ive been a fan for many years. Ive been to Bulls, Hornets, Hawks, Wizards and Magic games live. Bulls many many many times. Hornets 20-30. Hawks about that. Wizards maybe 15-20. Couple magic games back in the 90s. I watch shows about the NBA. I have NBA tv and all. Ive had league pass and collected cards and bought home videos and all.

Fine.

Even ignoring the fact that I decided of my own free will to do these things....

Am I to believe the owners and players arent big enough fans to have done the same?

Mark Cuban has been a sports fan a long time. I suspect hes spent more than I have supporting the NBA even before he was an owner. How many players used to watch the games? How many still do?

What if I watch and contribute to ratings that means they need to consider how I feel....but when players and owners watch it doesnt count?

When players like Bogut but 100 tickets for his fan section its not paying for the NBA? My 80 bucks count but his thousands dont?

All those jerseys and shoes players buy over the years...thats not going into the pool?

The players and owners ARE fans.

And not only that...they are fans other fans tend to hate on.

Forget cases like Lebron....Grant hill. Captian America in basketball form....got booed and hated in Michigan for going to Orlando. Shaq got booed for like 10 years for leaving Orlando. Fans throw beer at players. Some fan heckled Vernon Maxwell about his little baby girl who passed away. We have rude disrespectful idiots as fans. Probably more than we have bright eyed innocent little kids who just want to see Kobe dunk.

The fans are you and me. The fans are *****....who at the drop of a dime will hate anyone not on their team....at times boo people who are on it...contribute less to the leagues success on average than the players do and far less than owners.

But...they need ot be thinking about us while they conduct business?

Who EVER thinks about the public when business is done?

When there is a strike or lockout or anything...its always selfish on every side. Especially these days in America when workers have so many rights. This isnt 1908. We dont have 6 year old losing rms working 14 hour days in coal mines as a normal thing.

People who are getting by(sometimes by a little...usually by a lot) decide they want more and the people who usually recieve their product can go **** themselves. Writer strike....they dont give a **** if you wanna see your favorite show and your fanhood of it pays them.

When you watch guys jerseys burn, people wish injury on people, fans who know nothing about the situation calling Kobe a rapist, drunken idiots chanting nonsense, and beers flying, and fans shooting up parking lots and all...

How do you come out of it saying the fans and owners need to think more about us?

What do we actually do...for them...that they dont do for themselves?

Buy tickets? No. They probably buy more on average than mostindividual fans. Watch games? Nope. They do too.

Buy things that are NBA related? Same. They have kids who love the NBA with jerseys and shoes and cups and all. Their kids have NBA 2k too.

Having thought it out...I think im done being mad at either side.

I want them to play. But I dont see why they should care what I want.

Not more than what they want. I sure dont care more about them than I do about me.

Being richer means they should be less selfish?

Is that supposed to be the real world?

Fans can cry that they are the ones being screwed....but really. Isnt it always the public who loses during a labor battle?

But in this case....sports? I think athletes and owners might provide more of their own money than most other labor situations.

The owners are the ones paying for lunch for guys they already give millions to. The players are the ones who were us...but for the most part worked harder to get where they are than we were willing to(dont think there are only 400 tall athletic people out there....it takes a lot more).

Both sides provide endless entertainment at virtually no cost for people who dont go to games live....

But they owe even more? because we willingly give them money for a service we find fairly priced?

Nah.

And im sure in private they say the same thing. But if they said it in public there would be outrage. People cant handle real talk and honesty but dont wanna hear bullshit fed to them either.

I dont envy the publicists in this fight.

Really...I hate that there is even a need for such people. THe public is full of overly emotional soft types who cant look at themselves before hating on someone else.

I think im gonna give both sides a break and stop complaining. I ot 20 years of something for next to nothing. And if I were on either side id be holding out for more too.

They are just people. Prone to selfish acts.

Just like us.

And I think im ready to stop being pissed off and just....watch something else till it works out. I'll be happy when they get it sorted out and wish both sides the best.

But I suspect I may be nearly alone in that...

Hate is very popular when people feel wronged. And im not sure I can justify feeling wronged when I think about it.



Annoyed people who skimmed it...let me get a funny "Did not read" picture. Ive not seen a good one in months and I try nto to take myself too serious.

[GOBB]

I tried reading it all but was interuptted by....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7NyFC2DKWJM

[The Macho Man]

I agree.

[Kblaze8855]

I never watched the first series much but my star trek knowledge borders on creepy. Im a man of many many interests and i dont halfass much

[SpecialQue]

I never watched the first series much but my star trek knowledge borders on creepy. Im a man of many many interests and i dont halfass much

Picard = GOAT Captain.

However, Spock >>>>>>> Data, and it ain't even close.

[Kblaze8855]

Picard may well be the GOAT but I wouldnt trade Sisko during the Dominion war for Picard in his prime. Picard is a peace time captian.

[triangleoffense]

I'm not really sure at what your getting at in the OP but I think your trying to imply that everything is a fair price because of the "free market" and that business owners are allowed to charge whatever they want because they own the means of production for the said product. This is inherently untrue in our current model of economics because of the various bi-laws of the legal and business systems. J

ust because somebody (or some entity) owns the means of production doesn't mean that whatever price he chooses to put on it is a fair and legit price. Many variables have to be taken into account such as the level of competition, manufacturing cost, distribution costs, etc. The first such variable, level of competition is exactly why the players have just cause atm to file an anti-trust lawsuit, which is giving them huge bargaining power at the negotiating table. Your making it sound unfair business practices do not exist when in reality it is the norm of certain industries to engage in such practices.

To further illustrate my point take this example into account: I am a writer, I write a book and want to sell, produce and distribute my book so I can make money. I find to my dismay that a certain publishing house has cornered the market, thus creating a monopoly along with its other subsidiary companies, forcing any credible author that wants to do business into using its publishing brand to sell his own books. This publishing house also has a stipulation that any emerging writer gets a mere 1 cent on the dollar for every copy of his book sold. Would this practice exactly be "deciding that they ask a fair price and us paying it to enjoy ourselves"? Also take in mind that this scenario also happens to be the norm for virtually every industry on the market today.

[Kblaze8855]

My point wasnt that any price is a fair price....
my point was that im not sure fans consider the fact that the owners and players probably contribute more to the success of the league they say they support than most of them do.


But yes I would say a price one is willing to pay must be fair. If it isnt fair...why pay it?

A good profit margin doesnt make your product too expensive if the people who buy it dont mind paying your asking price.

[triangleoffense]

My point wasnt that any price is a fair price....
my point was that im not sure fans consider the fact that the owners and players probably contribute more to the success of the league they say they support than most of them do.


But yes I would say a price one is willing to pay must be fair. If it isnt fair...why pay it?

A good profit margin doesnt make your product too expensive if the people who buy it dont mind paying your asking price.

So you think that even though the NBA has a monopoly on professional basketball that the price they ask to pay for tickets and merchandise is fair? Keep in mind the average price for an "authentic" NBA jersey is 59.99.

http://store.nba.com/product/index.j...669&cp=1400498

[Bernie Nips]

Best thread of the lockout so far. Someone who isn't trying to see it from either side's perspective, but just stepping back and looking at the whole picture.

[Kblaze8855]

When I go to a game the ticket price is the last thing I notice. If anything is unfair its the price of parking and concessions. They take advantage there. But so does everyone when they know you have no choice. Last time I was at disneyworld a sprite was 4 dollars and that was probably 1997.

Far as a jersey? What do I know about what the NBA paid to have it created? I dont know the profit margins. Im sure the material doesnt cost but actually putting it together? I dont think the NBA is likely to own its own sweatshops. The people really getting over are probably the ones paying kids a dollar an hour to make the products.

[bdreason]

Like Spidermans dying Uncle said, "with great power, comes great responsibility."

[Kblaze8855]

Yea but when America tries to police the world they hate us for it.

Uncle Ben should have told Peter to mind his own business. Someone else can save the city. Like 900 superheroes are in New York already.

He could have settled down with Mary Jane without her almost being killed 88 times first.

[Smoke117]

Just gives me more time to drink.

[Kblaze8855]

Find a Suns vs Warriors game from like 2008 on youtube. Take a shot every time someone takes a questionable 3 in transition.

Report back on the results if you live.