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Old 03-13-2009, 04:38 PM   #16
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Default Re: Jon Stewart vs. Jim Cramer

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Originally Posted by vapid
People are hyping this up way more than it should be. I still find problem with Jon Stewart attacking from his comfortable position as a satirist and supposed "comedian". Anyways, the main problems that Jon was talking about doesn't have as much to do with Cramer as the CEO of CNBC (or the CEO of the holding company, etc.) anyways, and I'm sure he understands news reporting is a business first anyways. If you're lazy enough to take what any news channel says on face value you deserve to get screwed.
Absolutely no excuse for Cramer and the rest of CNBC to fail to tell the people what they know and do real reporting. They're supposed to be a business news network, and they blew it just like the general media blew it leading up to the Iraq War. In both cases it's fallen to a stand-up comic to report what's really going on. Which is a sad commentary on our news. People don't accept what the media tells them out of laziness, they believe what they're told because they have been lead to believe that the people telling them are trustworthy.
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Old 03-13-2009, 04:43 PM   #17
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Default Re: Jon Stewart vs. Jim Cramer

I didn't get the impression Cramer was challenging anything. He sounded apologetic and agreed with Stewart. Now whether Cramer was faking it or whatever, it doesn't matter because he wasn't challenging Jon.

Also, I wouldn't call Cramer's show one for long-term investors to be following anyways, and for Cramer admitting that he did some sneaky things, and well I don't blame him, it wasn't half as bad a strategy at the time, and he wasn't exactly running a Ponzi scheme. To me, the financial system is all about the smartest minds trying to outdo each other. There is opportunity in any market, and we see that many of the best firms (like Goldman, where some departments made a windfall betting against many of the popular derivatives) were hurt, but they have since refinanced, slimmed down and cut off some of the fat, and I bet will emerge better for it in 5-10 years. Yes, what many of these people did were wrong, they deserve to fail and lose their jobs because they were irresponsible. But lets not go blame all of Wall Street.
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Old 03-13-2009, 04:46 PM   #18
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Default Re: Jon Stewart vs. Jim Cramer

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Originally Posted by Real Men Wear Green
Absolutely no excuse for Cramer and the rest of CNBC to fail to tell the people what they know and do real reporting. They're supposed to be a business news network, and they blew it just like the general media blew it leading up to the Iraq War. In both cases it's fallen to a stand-up comic to report what's really going on. Which is a sad commentary on our news. People don't accept what the media tells them out of laziness, they believe what they're told because they have been lead to believe that the people telling them are trustworthy.
I agree, these news shows are not trust worthy and fail at providing accurate information. That is why you shouldn't believe them, and go out, take initiative and gather news yourself, do your own research from multiple sources. Just don't sit back and harangue the shows and not do anything about it, they are in it to make money and you should know that. (not saying you specifically)
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Old 03-13-2009, 04:53 PM   #19
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Default Re: Jon Stewart vs. Jim Cramer

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Originally Posted by vapid
Yes, what many of these people did were wrong, they deserve to fail and lose their jobs because they were irresponsible. But lets not go blame all of Wall Street.
Why not? Cramer clearly knew what was happening (though he failed to mention it on his actual show). I don't think the outrage stems from the fact that there were major players on Wall Street who were morally bankrupt and greedy. The average person on the street could tell you that.

What makes this horrific, however, and what allowed it to reach the calamity that we are currently in is people like Cramer who knew what was going on and didn't speak up. To me, that makes him almost as responsible as those that were doing the fleecing.

If these things had been exposed on his show or any show on CNBC in 2006, this economic disaster could have been addressed before it reached the level of threatening every American and the world-wide market.

You don't have to actually do the shooting to be charged with murder. If you are complicit and simply along with the ride, the justice system treats you the same as it would the guy who pulled the trigger. There are A LOT of people that were watching this thing go down and doing nothing about it. What Stewart exposed was that Cramer was one of those people and his credibility is shot as a result.

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Old 03-13-2009, 04:54 PM   #20
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Default Re: Jon Stewart vs. Jim Cramer

Why is Cramer bad for exposing tricks hedge funds use to manipulate the markets?

I think Jon Stewart agreed that Cramer wasn't the main problem, it was the entire network's poor journalism. But there weren't many people who predicted things to get this severe. He's holding Cramer and CNBC accountable for things that the SEC, wall street and Feds missed.

Cramer needs to tone it down though. He's a smart guy (JD Harvard, former hedge fund manager) who actually saved a lot of people money when he asked people to sell off at DOW 10500, but it's hard to take his show seriously. He's probably one of the best commentators CNBC has to offer though.
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Old 03-13-2009, 04:58 PM   #21
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Default Re: Jon Stewart vs. Jim Cramer

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Originally Posted by RedBlackAttack
Why not? Cramer clearly knew what was happening (though he failed to mention it on his actual show). I don't think the outrage stems from the fact that there were major players on Wall Street who were morally bankrupt and greedy. The average person on the street could tell you that.

What makes this horrific, however, and what allowed it to reach the calamity that we are currently in is people like Cramer who knew what was going on and didn't speak up. To me, that makes him almost as responsible as those that were doing the fleecing.

If these things had been exposed on his show or any show on CNBC in 2006, this economic disaster could have been addressed before it reached the level of threatening every American and the world-wide market.

You don't have actually do the shooting to be charged with murder. If you are complicit and simply along with the ride, the justice system treats you the same as it would the guy who pulled the trigger. There are A LOT of people that were watching this thing go down and doing nothing about it. What Stewart exposed was that Cramer was one of those people and his credibility is shot as a result.

I would prefer Cramer tell his viewers to short whatever, if he knew for sure, how things were going to go (which I really doubt) then he would, and should find a way to tell his audience and give them better returns.
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Old 03-14-2009, 10:52 AM   #22
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Default Re: Jon Stewart vs. Jim Cramer

I thought this was kind of messed up. Its like they set Cramer up for some sting to ruin his credibility. Its also disingenuous to pretend most people in this country aren't going to take advantage of opportunities that are technically legal, even if somewhat underhanded. There are snake oil salesman everywhere in the country, not just on media levels, but there are tons there too. Limbaugh himself preaches lies and exaggerations, and has made a fortune doing it. I blame the people who listen and follow more than the ones who dupe and aren't exactly honest in how they bill themselves.

I'm surprisingly way more in the middle on this than i thought i'd be. Altho its nice to see CEO's being called out like this, and it getting so much attention.
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Old 03-16-2009, 10:39 AM   #23
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Default Re: Jon Stewart vs. Jim Cramer

That was the definition of the word sonning. I mean, really, the way Jon was talking to him at the end, and the way Jim was responding, you could literally think Jon was his father and Jim was his son. The last time i saw something like that was when I was in my early teens and my dad caught me in a huge lie. The way that conversation went was the way this one did. Like a father scolding his son.

He even told him to change the name of his program, and he agreed. Sonned.
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Old 03-16-2009, 10:49 AM   #24
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Default Re: Jon Stewart vs. Jim Cramer

Cramer went around a bunch of shows on NBC, MSNBC and CNBC calling out Jon Stewart before his Daily Show appearance.

Looks like that plan backfired.
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Old 03-16-2009, 01:37 PM   #25
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Default Re: Jon Stewart vs. Jim Cramer

cramer is a clown. who the hell takes him seriously in the first place?
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Old 03-16-2009, 01:54 PM   #26
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Default Re: Jon Stewart vs. Jim Cramer

felt kind of bad for cramer there. He was making bad jokes and seemed really uncomfortable. Then I kept looking at his rolled up sleeves and couldnt help but think this douche deserves it.
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Old 03-16-2009, 02:01 PM   #27
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Default Re: Jon Stewart vs. Jim Cramer

We must all fear evil men, but there is a greater evil out there, one that we must fear worst of all... and that is the absence of good men.
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Old 03-16-2009, 02:14 PM   #28
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Default Re: Jon Stewart vs. Jim Cramer

Cramer is going to respond by releasing a sex tape of stewart's baby-mama
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Old 03-18-2009, 12:53 PM   #29
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Default Re: Jon Stewart vs. Jim Cramer

Tucker Carlson is still hurt from his violent rape at the hands of John Stewart.
Quote:
Poor Tucker Carlson. His career was sidelined by Jon Stewart in a cruel sneak attack five years ago, and he's never gotten over it. Now he's trying to start a beef with his former tormentor. In the Daily Beast, Carlson raises a hoary complaint: That Stewart is a critical darling who gets away with murder because the self-loathing media loves him too much to criticize him. Stewart's much-heralded interrogation of Jim Cramer, Carlson says, was "incoherent"—Stewart went after Cramer's manipulative short-selling shenanigans, and then tried to link them to credit default swaps, which are totally different things! And when Stewart interviewed John Kerry before the 2004 election, he totally gave him a pass, "squandering" the opportunity.
But Carlson's real objection to Stewart is that he doesn't play by the gentleman's rules of cable news theatrics, and actually takes the things he says seriously enough to repeat them when cameras aren't trained on him. After Stewart's 2004 Crossfire appearance, when he asked Carlson and his co-host Paul Begala to "stop hurting America," Carlson writes, Stewart had the temerity to stay after the show was over to try—earnestly!—to continue the argument:
Unlike most guests after an uncomfortable show, Stewart didn't flee once it was over, but lingered backstage to press his point. With the cameras off, he dropped the sarcasm and the nastiness, but not the intensity. I can still picture him standing outside the makeup room, gesticulating as the rest of us tried to figure out what he was talking about. It was one of the weirdest things I have ever seen. Finally I had to leave to make a dinner. Stewart shook my hand with what seemed like friendly sincerity and continued to lecture our staff. An hour later, one of my producers called me, sounding desperate. Stewart was still there, and still talking.
How weird, indeed! It was almost as though he actually meant the things he said, and was interested in what other people had to say in response. This is the pitfall of people who get paid to think and say things for a living: Thinking and talking and arguing gets reduced to punch-the-clock labor, and people who take it seriously or do it for free or absent an audience are considered unsophisticated amateurs. Come on, leave me alone, Stewart, I gotta go to dinner! This attitude is known as hackery.
And it is the business end of Stewart's critique. For Carlson to attack Stewart because he is insufficiently glib is pitiful and sad and explains everything about why Carlson lost that argument so devastatingly.
The upside is that Carlson, who is a talented writer and reporter, is back at his keyboard, where he can occasionally write true things like this sentence: "The relationship between Stewart and the media is a marriage of the self-loathing and the self-loving: He insists their real news is fake, they insist his fake news is real."

http://gawker.com/5173532/jon-stewar...-bitter-nights
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Old 03-18-2009, 01:22 PM   #30
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Default Re: Jon Stewart vs. Jim Cramer

Anybody who gets investment advice from a cable news tv show which is basically a financially themed Gallagher routine deserves to lose their money.
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