GOAT's SPHA Finalists - Top 5 Players by Year (1980-1999)

[G.O.A.T]

As part of my annual breakdown of the NBA and each of is majestic seasons I, like many others, find it important to determine who the best and most important players were from each season. My method for doing so has evolved over the years into what I now call the SPHA Award or Signature Player Historical Achievement Award. The names comes from the acronym for the Southern Philadelphia Hebrew Association. The group which, organized by later NBA forefather Eddie Gottlieb, would become the first all-Jewish professional basketball team. For a couple decades they remained one of the premier teams on the barnstorming circuit and even had a brief shot at the big leagues before Gottlieb hitched his wagons to the NBA and the team that would eventually become first the Philadelphia, and now Golden State Warriors. In honor of that team and the enormous contribution to the history of the game they left, I now look to honor the player whose combined talent, intelligence, heart, hustle, drive and most of all accomplishments best tells the story of each particular season. Looking for help seeing and understanding other peoples view points as I open up this score of seasons for debate.

With that said, here are the top five nominees in the order I currently have them. Letting the debating and berating begin...

1980
1. Kareem
2. Doctor J
3. Bird
4. Magic
5. Moses

1981
1. Bird
2. Doctor J
3. Moses
4. Kareem
5. Gervin

1982 (changed)
1. Moses
2. Magic
3. Kareem
4. Bird
5. Gervin

1983
1. Moses
2. Magic
3. Doctor J
4. Kareem
5. Moncrief

1984
1. Bird
2. Magic
3. Kareem
4. King
5. Isiah

1985
1. Bird
2. Magic
3. Kareem
4. Isiah
5. Moses

1986 (changed)
1. Bird
2. Magic
3. Hakeem
4. McHale
5. Nique

1987
1. Magic
2. Bird
3. Jordan
4. Hakeem
5. McHale

1988
1. Magic
2. Jordan
3. Bird
4. Hakeem
5. Isiah

1989
1. Jordan
2. Magic
3. Hakeem
4. Barkley
5. Isiah

1990 (changed)
1. Jordan
2. Magic
3. Barkley
4. Ewing
5. Isiah

1991
1. Jordan
2. Magic
3. Barkley
4. Robinson
5. Malone

1992 (changed)
1. Jordan
2. Drexler
3. Malone
4. Ewing
5. Robinson

1993
1. Jordan
2. Barkley
3. Hakeem
4. Ewing
5. Robinson

1994
1. Hakeem
2. Ewing
3. Robinson
4. Pippen
5. Shaq

1995
1. Hakeem
2. Robinson
3. Shaq
4. Malone
5. Barkley

1996
1. Jordan
2. Pippen
3. Payton
4. Shaq
5. Hakeem

1997 (changed)
1. Jordan
2. Malone
3. Hakeem
4. Shaq
5. Pippen

1998 (changed)
1. Jordan
2. Malone
3. Shaq
4. Duncan
5. Miller

1999
1. Duncan
2. Shaq
3. Malone
4. Mourning
5. Kidd

Your thoughts? Where have I gone wrong? Make sure to give me your reasoning so I can better understand your perspective.

[Toizumi]

Got lost in the shuffle last night because of the game, putting it back out there today.

Good to see you back GOAT. I checked the pasture a couple of times, but there was no activity and it was badly spammed by bots.

I started following basketball in the late 90's, early 2000's.. so putting together top 5's of prior season is tough to do for me. I can rate players historically based on what i've read, heard, seen, but doing it year by year is tough. I'll follow this project though, pretty interesting. Pippen going from no.2 in '96 to out of the top 5 in '97 stood out to me. The Bulls were less dominant, but his numbers were pretty consistent and his game also.

[OldSchoolBBall]

1985
1. Bird
2. Magic
3. Kareem
4. Isiah
5. Moses

Jordan should be over Moses and/or Isiah here. He pretty clearly had a better season than Moses did at a minimum.

1989
1. Jordan
2. Magic
3. Hakeem
4. Barkley
5. Isiah

Few people considered Hakeem to be better than Barkley in '89.

1992
1. Jordan
2. Drexler
3. Malone
4. Robinson
5. Ewing

I think Robinson has to go at #2 in 1992, above Drexler. Ewing above Malone, too.

1993
1. Jordan
2. Barkley
3. Hakeem
4. Ewing
5. Robinson

Shaq should replace DRob, who had a down year in the middle of an incredible 4 year stretch.

1994
1. Hakeem
2. Ewing
3. Robinson
4. Pippen
5. Shaq

DRob and Shaq pretty easily above Ewing imo. Pippen at #5 or bumped to #6 by Malone.

1995
1. Hakeem
2. Robinson
3. Shaq
4. Malone
5. Barkley

Pippen at #5 above Barkley.

1996
1. Jordan
2. Pippen
3. Payton
4. Shaq
5. Hakeem

Shaq, Hakeem, and DRob above Pippen pretty clearly; Penny possibly above Pippen.

1997
1. Jordan
2. Malone
3. Hakeem
4. Shaq
5. Mourning

Hill and Penny perhaps over Mourning.

1998
1. Jordan
2. Malone
3. Shaq
4. Duncan
5. Payton

Shaq over Malone. Hill over Payton.

[ShaqAttack3234]

First, let me say nice work putting together these lists.

1980
1. Kareem
2. Doctor J
3. Bird
4. Magic
5. Moses

Looks good, except I wouldn't have rookie Magic over Moses, and I might put Bird below Moses as well.

1981
1. Bird
2. Doctor J
3. Moses
4. Kareem
5. Gervin

I'd put Kareem first, this was the least year he was pretty much at his prime level and that alone is enough for me. He looked like pretty much the same player he was in 1980 in the games I've seen. Hasd the misfortune of Magic missing 45 games so they didn't get a bye for the mini-series. Those series were ideal for upsets, and the primary reason they lost was Magic, who had arguably the worst series of his career shooting 39% and airballing the potential series winning shot on a play designed for Kareem.

1982
1. Moses
2. Magic
3. Kareem
4. Bird
5. Gervin

Well, I'd put Kareem over Magic, at this point, Kareem was still clearly the better player to me since Magic was limited in the half court with an outside shot at this stage of his career and Kareem was still blocking around 3 shots per game. I've always considered Bird consistently better than Magic pre-'87 as well, but he did have some injuries this season.

Other than that, I'd probably have to put Dr. J in the top 5.

1983
1. Moses
2. Magic
3. Doctor J
4. Kareem
5. Moncrief

Well, again, Kareem over Magic for the same reasons as '82. This was the last year that I consider Kareem to have been clearly the better player, while it was debatable until it became Magic's team in the '86-'87 season. Kareem averaged 27 ppg and almost 4 blocks on 57% shooting in the playoffs.

1984
1. Bird
2. Magic
3. Kareem
4. King
5. Isiah

Looks good, my personal preference would still probably be Kareem over Magic,

1985
1. Bird
2. Magic
3. Kareem
4. Isiah
5. Moses

Same as '84, looks good.

1986
1. Bird
2. Hakeem
3. Magic
4. Nique
5. McHale

Can't really argue with anything, I might move McHale over Nique because of his defense and because he was pretty much as unstoppable as any scorer in the league at that time. Probably one of the 5 best post scorers ever. And it's worth noting that he did an excellent job defending Nique in the '86 semifinals.

But that's debatable. Can't really argue with anything on this one.

1987
1. Magic
2. Bird
3. Jordan
4. Hakeem
5. McHale

Everything looks solid, this might be my exact top 5.

1988
1. Magic
2. Jordan
3. Bird
4. Hakeem
5. Isiah

That might be my top 4.

I'd probably put Barkley or Nique at 5. This was the year of the Bird/Nique duel.

1989
1. Jordan
2. Magic
3. Hakeem
4. Barkley
5. Isiah

This also might be my top 4. I'm reviewing the '89 season right now actually and watching games from that year when I have time.

Would go with Ewing, Malone or KJ at 5.

1990
1. Jordan
2. Magic
3. Barkley
4. Hakeem
5. Isiah

My top 5 is

1.Jordan
2.Magic
3.Ewing
4.Barkley
5.Hakeem

Ewing was too dominant for me to leave him out. His 1st round series vs Boston showed how dominant he was at this time. To come back from down 0-2 in a best of 5 with games of 33/19, 44/13/5/7 and 31/8/10/4 vs a much more talented team is pretty amazing.

From what I've read, most players and coaches as well as many writers were calling him the best center this year. Here are some quotes about Patrick that season.

Ewing's play has been an even more important component of New York's success. "He might be the best in the game right now," Los Angeles's Mychal Thompson told the New York Daily News after Ewing scored 29 points in a 115-104 loss on Dec. 3. "He and Magic [Johnson] are shoulder to shoulder."

''He has taken his game to another level,'' Johnson continued, ''a level I've never seen him play at before. He's dominating offensively and defensively, but he's also making the right plays at the right time. He's leading his team, as opposed to before, when it seemed he'd just as soon let somebody else lead. That's the real mark of an m.v.p.''

"People are starting to see what a force he can be," Bulls superstar Michael Jordan said. "With the numbers he's putting up and the way he's carrying that team, there's no question he's a top MVP candidate. I don't see anyone better than him right now."

1991
1. Jordan
2. Magic
3. Barkley
4. Robinson
5. Malone

This is my top 5 as well.

1992
1. Jordan
2. Drexler
3. Malone
4. Robinson
5. Ewing

Drexler at 2 is too high, imo, but in fairness, many were calling him the 2nd best in the league from what I've read and from games I've watched.

I'd put Ewing over Robinson who missed the playoffs with an injury because of how much heart he showed in the Bulls series, and also in front of Drexler because I think he was just flat out better.

Malone had probably the best playoff run of his career so I can see him there. My biggest complaint about him has been that his game didn't translate as well to the playoffs, especially the late 80's/early 90's version, but I can't use that here.

It's strange to have Hakeem out of the top 5, his team did miss the playoffs, but that was a result of them going 2-10 without him(40-30 with him).

1993
1. Jordan
2. Barkley
3. Hakeem
4. Ewing
5. Robinson

Looks good, except I'd switch Barkley and Hakeem. Hakeem was an incredible two-way player by this point. The most dominant defensive player in the game and his offense improved greatly. He stepped up with everything running through him in the post with the 4 out/1 in system. He became a great playmaker in addition to an unstoppable scorer while always playing as hard as anyone. He had virtually no weaknesses. He made Houston a 55 win team and a contender, and looking at the other contenders in the West such as Phoenix and Seattle, Houston's talent paled in comparison. They took an absolutely loaded Seattle team to overtime of the 7th game and that was with some suspect calls.

Other than that, I'd like to give Dominique Wilkins a sort of honorable mention, and he is borderline to me. He had what he called his best season, and I agree with him. A remarkable feat at 33 after his injury in '92.

1994
1. Hakeem
2. Ewing
3. Robinson
4. Pippen
5. Shaq

Beyond Hakeem, the top 5 really are debatable. Not sure about Ewing at 2nd, but Robinson had the horrible playoff series vs Utah when he was shut down by Malone and Shaq was still very raw.

1995
1. Hakeem
2. Robinson
3. Shaq
4. Malone
5. Barkley

I'd put Pippen in the top 5 ahead of Barkley, and switch Shaq and Robinson. It is close since it's pretty much offense vs defense, but I'd much rather have Shaq in the playoffs, and he had a much more respectable series vs the Rockets.

1996
1. Jordan
2. Pippen
3. Payton
4. Shaq
5. Hakeem

Payton at 3 is definitely too high, imo, and I'd move Hakeem up to 2nd. He was still the best center, imo and at the tail end of his prime. His team got really unlucky with injuries. I'd also put Robinson in the top 5. Not sure what to take off for Shaq's missed games.

I'm not sure Pippen was ever the second best player in the league, though Doug Collins did call him the best player in the league in '95-'96, and he was playing arguably the best ball of his career before the ankle injury in February.

1997
1. Jordan
2. Malone
3. Hakeem
4. Shaq
5. Mourning

Looks good, though I'd be much more willing to rank Shaq over Hakeem in '97 than '96. Hakeem declined, while Shaq improved, had one of his best rebounding/shot blocking years and the Lakers had the best record in the West before his injury in early February. But he did miss a lot of games again and had a poor series vs Utah.

I wouldn't put Mourning in the top 5 either. His temper could still get the better of him as we saw when Rodman got into his head, and he was still not as smart and polished as we would be a couple of years later. Pat Riley and Heat players were calling Tim Hardaway their MVP. Patrick Ewing was still the better center, imo, and I'd bet money that his team would've beaten Mourning's if not for the ridiculous suspensions.

Grant Hill is another top 5 candidate and someone I'd rank over Mourning. He led Detroit to 54 wins while being their scorer and creating everything for them as a point forward. But he did blow a 2-1 lead to Atlanta and blow a 4th quarter lead in game 5 to lose the series while being held scoreless in that 4th quarter.

Scottie Pippen is another guy in the mix for top 5.

1998
1. Jordan
2. Malone
3. Shaq
4. Duncan
5. Payton

By this point, I'd rank Shaq as the best player in the league. He entered his prime this year and was only clearly better in 2 seasons which were'00 and '01, arguably '02. But I can understand Jordan ahead of him for what he did that season.

I'd consider Robinson, but I'm fine with Payton, he had arguably his best season that year.

1999
1. Duncan
2. Shaq
3. Malone
4. Mourning
5. Kidd

Looks good, except I'd switch Zo and Malone. Grant Hill and Payton are top 5 candidates, but I can agree with Kidd. He really entered his prime that year and had a great season in a year when not many players had great seasons.

[G.O.A.T]

@ Shaqattack3234

I will break my response into a few parts for the different sections of players being discussed. Thanks for the excellent and thoughtful as usual response. I want to remind you that the criteria for these lists is not simply who are the best/most talented five players, but also which five players were most significant/important in a particular season. To make the list I consider the following:

1) Who was the best most talented player that season
2) Who had the best season, team and individual success factored in
3) Who had the most important season.

The third one is where I consider things like all-NBA, MVP, Finals MVP, playoff runs etc.

For an example, I'll start with my response to the 1980 season...

1980: Looks good, except I wouldn't have rookie Magic over Moses, and I might put Bird below Moses as well.


1981: I'd put Kareem first, this was the least year he was pretty much at his prime level and that alone is enough for me. He looked like pretty much the same player he was in 1980 in the games I've seen. Hasd the misfortune of Magic missing 45 games so they didn't get a bye for the mini-series. Those series were ideal for upsets, and the primary reason they lost was Magic, who had arguably the worst series of his career shooting 39% and airballing the potential series winning shot on a play designed for Kareem.



1982: Well, I'd put Kareem over Magic, at this point, Kareem was still clearly the better player to me since Magic was limited in the half court with an outside shot at this stage of his career and Kareem was still blocking around 3 shots per game. I've always considered Bird consistently better than Magic pre-'87 as well, but he did have some injuries this season.

Other than that, I'd probably have to put Dr. J in the top 5.



1983: Well, again, Kareem over Magic for the same reasons as '82. This was the last year that I consider Kareem to have been clearly the better player, while it was debatable until it became Magic's team in the '86-'87 season. Kareem averaged 27 ppg and almost 4 blocks on 57% shooting in the playoffs.

1980 is a tough year for me. The first two are obvious I believe and I am also sure Moses was the third best player that year, but with the Celtics great turnaround and sweeping Houston from the playoffs, the incredible impact Bird had and most of all, Magic's amazing and unforgettable finals performance, all add up to me thinking they had more significant seasons than Malone. I think I'm going to end up putting Magic 3rd, Bird 4th, Moses 5th. That doesn't mean I think Bird and Magic had already become better players than Moses, just that their seasons were more meaningful to NBA history.

As far as 1981, I can't put Kareem first, though everything you say about that season is true, Kareem still got outplayed (slightly) by Malone during the series and the Lakers collapse based on Magic's brooding suggests how important he had become to the team and how little leadership Kareem brought to the table. So while I too think Kareem was, for at least the 11th straight year, the NBA's greatest talent, he did not have the best season by any means.

By 1982 it was more Magic's team than Kareem and while Kareem was better, Magic was more important. I respect your perspective on this but the all-NBA and MVP voters, the Lakers owner and fans, my gut, the books I've read on the subject, the historical verdict all favor Magic. From 1982 on, Magic was more important and had more important seasons than Kareem every year.

If we are asking which player was more talented and if you gave them each their own teams which one would produce more measurable wins, it's probably Kareem through 1984 or 1985, but based on what happen on and off the court and considering all the intangibles, Magic is the clear choice for me.

I think you're right about Doc over Ice in 1982, I'm going to break this one down tonight with the files and film I have of both players that season.

[G.O.A.T]

1986: Can't really argue with anything, I might move McHale over Nique because of his defense and because he was pretty much as unstoppable as any scorer in the league at that time. Probably one of the 5 best post scorers ever. And it's worth noting that he did an excellent job defending Nique in the '86 semifinals.

But that's debatable. Can't really argue with anything on this one.


1988: That might be my top 4.

I'd probably put Barkley or Nique at 5. This was the year of the Bird/Nique duel.


1989: This also might be my top 4. I'm reviewing the '89 season right now actually and watching games from that year when I have time.

Would go with Ewing, Malone or KJ at 5.


1990 My top 5 is

1.Jordan
2.Magic
3.Ewing
4.Barkley
5.Hakeem

Ewing was too dominant for me to leave him out. His 1st round series vs Boston showed how dominant he was at this time. To come back from down 0-2 in a best of 5 with games of 33/19, 44/13/5/7 and 31/8/10/4 vs a much more talented team is pretty amazing.

From what I've read, most players and coaches as well as many writers were calling him the best center this year.

Thoughts on Barkley vs. Nique in '86? I have been tempted to move McHale up one spot. The Hawks and Celtics meet in the playoffs that year and Nique was pretty shaky despite a regular season where I believe he finished second to Bird in the MVP race.

As far as 88-90, the big difference we seem to have is on Isiah. To me he meant too much to too important a team not to find his way into the conversation. Remember that during the Conference Finals and NBA finals he had games where he outplayed MJ and Magic. Despite Zeke posting better numbers in previous years the consensus among his teammates, the Detroit media at the time, Chuck Daly and Isiah himself is that he was a much better player from '88-'90 than in his younger more statistically impressive days.

1990 was the toughest year maybe of all-time for me. Ewing was excellent, but those other five guys were all in their primes and near or at their peak and are all top 25 players all-time to me whereas Ewing isn't even top 40 anymore. (With Wade, Dirk and LeBron passing him in the last two years). Barkley and Olajuwon were simply better (by quite a bit IMO) and Isiah was the best player and MVP for a 60-win repeat Champion. The Pistons and Knicks meet in the playoffs that year and Isiah was as good or better in 4 of 5 games.

As much as I am sure we both feel like were making objective points here, I think that fact that I am an Isiah guy and you a Ewing guy is probably showing a bit.

[oolalaa]

1980
1. Kareem
2. Doctor J
3. Bird
4. Magic
5. Moses

Agreed, Kareem proved in the post season that he was still easily the best.

1981
1. Bird
2. Doctor J
3. Moses
4. Kareem
5. Gervin

This is pretty tough. Bird, Moses and Kareem all have great claims to the top spot. Kareem does seem too low, though. This was his last year as an elite rebounder - that part of his game seemed to fall off the cliff from '82 onwards - and probably the last year of his prime.

I would also, definitely, rank Moses over Dr J. I see no justification for rankng a past his prime Julius Erving over a peak/prime Moses Malone - Moses was just too dominant.

1982
1. Moses
2. Magic
3. Kareem
4. Bird
5. Gervin

Agreed.

1983
1. Moses
2. Magic
3. Doctor J
4. Kareem
5. Moncrief

Bird was never not a top 5 player (before '89 anyway). Ranking Moncrief over him is extremely generous. I loved Moncrief - he was one of the best all round player of the 80s, before his knee injury anyway. I loved his reckless abandon and his silky smooth jumper, but Bird brought way more to the table. This was Larry Bird! I dont care if it was an off year. Incidentally, he had an 'off year' in part because, by the end of the regular season, the Celtics had flat out revolted against Fitch. They wouldn't play for him against the bucks in the 1st round.

Moses deserves top spot though. He was too dominant this season.

1984
1. Bird
2. Magic
3. Kareem
4. King
5. Isiah

Agreed.

1985
1. Bird
2. Magic
3. Kareem
4. Isiah
5. Moses

I would take Magic over bird, after all, the Lakers did beat Boston in the finals, but that's just a preference thing. And, damn you Bernard King, damn you!!

1986
1. Bird
2. Hakeem
3. Magic
4. Nique
5. McHale

Stick McHale on any other team (apart form the Lakers) and his numbers drop significantly, from his 25/9 peak, anyway (especially his efficiency). Bird MADE McHale, in a similar way to how Magic (Who 2nd year Hakeem has no business being over btw) made Worthy.

However, this wasn't exactly a stellar year for talent, so I wont argue too much with McHale sneaking in there. I would take Isiah over him, though.

1987
1. Magic
2. Bird
3. Jordan
4. Hakeem
5. McHale

Agree, but with Isiah over McHale.

1988
1. Magic
2. Jordan
3. Bird
4. Hakeem
5. Isiah

Jordan's prime officially began in 87/88. Magic was really great, but this was Michael Jordan.

And btw, a team with Mo Cheeks running the point and Charles Barkley coming into his prime should have been able to make the playoffs. It's a pity they couldn't stop anyone on the other end.

1989
1. Jordan
2. Magic
3. Hakeem
4. Barkley
5. Isiah

I would just be nitpicking.

1990
1. Jordan
2. Magic
3. Barkley
4. Hakeem
5. Isiah

This was Bird's last relatively healthy year. A Larry Bird at 85% is still worthy of a top 5 spot, and remember, the Celtics were one of the favourites to win it all going into the post season. It took a superhuman series from the 'finally maturing Patrick Ewing' to spoil the party.

Incidentally, give me Ewing over Hakeem. Whilst Ewing was dismantling the Celtics in the 1st round, Hakeem was stink bombing against the Lakers (was he hurt? I really cant remember). Jordan, Magic, Isiah, Ewing, Bird.

1991
1. Jordan
2. Magic
3. Barkley
4. Robinson
5. Malone

Completely agree

1992
1. Jordan
2. Drexler
3. Malone
4. Robinson
5. Ewing

It's seems crazy that 'Clyde The Glide' was the second best player in 91/92, but I think you might be right!!

1993
1. Jordan
2. Barkley
3. Hakeem
4. Ewing
5. Robinson

Completely agree.

1994
1. Hakeem
2. Ewing
3. Robinson
4. Pippen
5. Shaq

I feel like Chuck should squeak in, but I'm not sure who to remove

1995
1. Hakeem
2. Robinson
3. Shaq
4. Malone
5. Barkley

Shaq > Robinson (too much of a cuddly, wuddly softy). And, chuck over Malone. Chuck > Malone, until '97.

1996
1. Jordan
2. Pippen
3. Payton
4. Shaq
5. Hakeem

You sure Payton was the best player on that Sonics finals team? It's close, but I think I might take the 'Reign Man'. Gary Payton was a top 3 player in the league at one point? Really? That cant be right. I would choose Robinson, Ewing, Chuck, Kemp, Malone and maybe even Mourning over him.

And I really dont see a case for Pippen being number 2. He was great in the 1st half of that season - he had a 5 game stretch in december where he averaged 32/8/8 & 2 stls - but those injuries late in the year took a lot of his rythm away for the playoffs

1997
1. Jordan
2. Malone
3. Hakeem
4. Shaq
5. Mourning

Shaq had overtaken Hakeem by this point.

1998
1. Jordan
2. Malone
3. Shaq
4. Duncan
5. Payton

Agreed.

1999
1. Duncan
2. Shaq
3. Malone
4. Mourning
5. Kidd

Agreed.

I got a little lazy towards the end I'll give some more detail soon.

[tmacattack33]

Penny Hardaway over Payton in 1996. He was 3rd in MVP voting and held his own when Shaq was injured.

[G.O.A.T]

1992: Drexler at 2 is too high, imo, but in fairness, many were calling him the 2nd best in the league from what I've read and from games I've watched.

I'd put Ewing over Robinson who missed the playoffs with an injury because of how much heart he showed in the Bulls series, and also in front of Drexler because I think he was just flat out better.

Malone had probably the best playoff run of his career so I can see him there. My biggest complaint about him has been that his game didn't translate as well to the playoffs, especially the late 80's/early 90's version, but I can't use that here.

It's strange to have Hakeem out of the top 5, his team did miss the playoffs, but that was a result of them going 2-10 without him(40-30 with him).

In regards to 1992 Drexler belongs at number two because of the season's narrative. Clyde had been to the Finals in 1990, he had his best season in 1992, with Magic retired the West was up for grabs. Portland, San Antonio, Utah, Houston, Phoneix, they were all 50 win teams with marquee stars and it was Drexlers Blazers who emerged. Clyde finished second in the MVP voting, averaged an impressive 26-7-7 through the 20-some playoff games. Putting Drexler at #2 for the season helps tell the story of the season. As the finals began the pregame talk was of rather or not Glide had soared to MJ's heights. As it turned out, no, but he was as close as anyone else who ever took a shot during the two three-peats.

In regards to Ewing vs Robinson that year, I had to give Robinson the edge for a few reasons. One he finished third in the MVP voting and actually had an edge or was even in every major traditional statistical category. And while Ewing had a strong final game versus the aging Pistons in round one and the Knicks did battle very hard to push Chicago to seven, that series to me is further evidence why Ewing was never a true superstar. In the final two games in Chicago, which New York needed to win at least one of, Ewing was awful, shooting 13-39 and averaging just 18 points, 8 rebounds and 1 assist. Ewing never went down with a good effort in that era:

1990 versus Pistons: 7-23 field goals
1991 versus Bulls: 7-19 field goals
1992 versus Bulls: 8-19 field goals

He was never a great shooter in clutch games, but at least in 1993 and 1994 he was dominant on the glass and making plays. He had something like 25-20-7-7 versus Indiana in game six or seven. Like 30 and 15 closing out the Bulls that year. That's why I have him at #2 in 1994 despite some erosion of his physical skills.

For me, a lot of times I can see the case for a lot of players so things like the playoffs where the the stakes are amplified matter a lot and if it's sort of a toss up, I'll let the player who's team one a closely contested series get the nod.

[Shep]

1980
1. Kareem - correct
2. Doctor J - correct
3. Bird - incorrect (magic johnson)
4. Magic - incorrect (larry bird
5. Moses - incorrect (norm nixon

1981
1. Bird - correct
2. Doctor J - incorrect (moses malone)
3. Moses - incorrect (kareem abdul-jabber)
4. Kareem - incorrect (magic johnson)
5. Gervin - incorrect (julius erving)

1982
1. Moses - incorrect (magic johnson)
2. Magic - incorrect (kareem abdul-jabbar)
3. Kareem - incorrect (larry bird)
4. Bird - incorrect (julius erving)
5. Gervin - incorrect (moses malone)

1983
1. Moses - correct
2. Magic - correct
3. Doctor J - correct
4. Kareem - correct
5. Moncrief - incorrect (larry bird)

1984
1. Bird - correct
2. Magic - correct
3. Kareem - correct
4. King - incorrect (isiah thomas)
5. Isiah - incorrect (robert parish)

1985
1. Bird - correct
2. Magic - correct
3. Kareem - correct
4. Isiah - correct
5. Moses - correct

1986
1. Bird - correct
2. Hakeem - correct
3. Magic - correct
4. Nique - incorrect (kevin mchale)
5. McHale - incorrect (charles barkley)

1987
1. Magic - correct
2. Bird - correct
3. Jordan - incorrect (hakeem olajuwon)
4. Hakeem - incorrect (michael jordan)
5. McHale - incorrect (isiah thomas)

1988
1. Magic - incorrect (michael jordan)
2. Jordan - incorrect (magic johnson)
3. Bird - correct
4. Hakeem - correct
5. Isiah - incorrect (john stockton)

1989
1. Jordan - correct
2. Magic - correct
3. Hakeem - correct
4. Barkley - incorrect (isiah thomas)
5. Isiah - incorrect (kevin johnson)

1990
1. Jordan - correct
2. Magic - incorrect (david robinson)
3. Barkley - incorrect (hakeem olajuwon)
4. Hakeem - incorrect (magic johnson)
5. Isiah - incorrect (patrick ewing)

1991
1. Jordan - correct
2. Magic - incorrect (scottie pippen)
3. Barkley - incorrect (magic johnson)
4. Robinson - correct
5. Malone - incorrect (john stockton)

1992
1. Jordan - correct
2. Drexler - incorrect (scottie pippen)
3. Malone - incorrect (david robinson)
4. Robinson - incorrect (clyde drexler)
5. Ewing - incorrect (hakeem olajuwon)

1993
1. Jordan - correct
2. Barkley - incorrect (hakeem olajuwon)
3. Hakeem - incorrect (charles barkley)
4. Ewing - incorrect (david robinson)
5. Robinson - incorrect (scottie pippen)

1994
1. Hakeem - correct
2. Ewing - correct
3. Robinson - correct
4. Pippen - incorrect (karl malone)
5. Shaq - incorrect (scottie pippen)

1995
1. Hakeem - correct
2. Robinson - correct
3. Shaq - correct
4. Malone - correct
5. Barkley - correct

1996
1. Jordan - correct
2. Pippen - correct
3. Payton - incorrect (david robinson)
4. Shaq - correct
5. Hakeem - incorrect (karl malone)

1997
1. Jordan - correct
2. Malone - correct
3. Hakeem - incorrect (shaquille o'neal)
4. Shaq - incorrect (scottie pippen)
5. Mourning - incorrect (hakeem olajuwon)

1998
1. Jordan - correct
2. Malone - correct
3. Shaq - correct
4. Duncan - incorrect (scottie pippen)
5. Payton - incorrect (david robinson)

1999
1. Duncan - correct
2. Shaq - incorrect (david robinson)
3. Malone - incorrect (alonzo mourning)
4. Mourning - incorrect (shaquille o'neal)
5. Kidd - incorrect (karl malone)

mm

[G.O.A.T]

(in 1996) I would choose Robinson, Ewing, Chuck, Kemp, Malone and maybe even Mourning over him. (Payton)

Robinson - D-Rob did finish second in the MVP voting but was a disaster in the playoffs. The Spurs held HCA for the WCSF vs. Utah, but Robinson had games of 11-9, 11-4 and 17-8 in Utah as predictably, the Spurs got trounced.

Ewing - The Knicks won just 47 games as a decking Ewing posted his worst scoring and rebounding totals in eight seasons and shot a career low (at that point) .466 from the field.

Barkley - An aging and increasingly frustrated Barkley shot 6-15 as his team was closed out in the first round and Sun set on Chuck career in Phoenix. The Suns were just a .500 team anyway as Barkley fell to the all-NBA third team.

Kemp - Payton received a greater percentage of the MVP vote than Kemp and played eight mpg more in the regular season and playoffs. Payton was the key to both the Sonics offense and defense. Furthermore George Karl described Kemp as "independent from the team" and said he had "His own way of doing things that didn't always help the team."

Malone - I have him 6th for the season and a case could be made that he should be higher. The Jazz played the Sonics tough in the WCF and Malone put up good numbers throughout the series though he did struggle in game seven going 8-22 from the field and grabbing just 5 rebounds.

Mourning - Not there yet. Still the fifth best center in the league and even if he's a comparable player, you'd rather have the best PG than the fifth best center. In the playoffs Mourning couldn't even stay on the floor against the Bulls.

The reason for Payton's position being higher than his talent is a perfect storm for the glove that season. His team finally didn't underachieve in the playoffs. He won the defensive POTY award. He had a very strong statistical playoff run during which he was being lauded by the announcers for his leadership and focus and he played the most effective defense of anyone all season on MJ in the finals. A lot of the guys you mentioned were better than GPO, but they didn't have better seasons.

[NugzHeat3]

I'm not a huge fan of your criteria. You seem to be putting more emphasis on player of the year as in which player had a better story for the season or the better season as opposed to who was the better player. You also seem to be rewarding team success quite a bit, more so than I feel you should.

Personally, the better player to me is the one who makes the biggest impact and contributes the most to his team's success regardless of how far they go. I try to separate quality of teammates and team success from individual contribution and I can't give said player extra credit for getting farther than somebody else when it's clear that the difference between the two is that one plays on a much better team than the other. Also, I say this realizing that there's a strong correlation between individual contribution and team success.

I'm just commenting because I read your post where you defend your opinion on Drexler and you seem to be intent on having your rankings describe the season's narrative . If that's what you want to do, that's fine but I don't think you can really say you're ranking the better player in that case.

Here's my opinion though keep in mind, my criteria is just to rank the 5 best players in order. Also, I can't comment on the 80s and I do penalize players for missing the playoffs but I also draw a line somewhere in how much I can dock them.

1990
1. Jordan
2. Magic
3. Barkley
4. Hakeem
5. Isiah

I don't know a whole lot about this year but I'd definitely take Ewing over Hakeem. I saw a couple of games from Ewing this year and he seemed less reliant on his jumpshot, played more of an interior game, seemed much more quicker and less predictable due to it and he also didn't since his athleticism was able to bail him out. The Knicks also overachieved beating Boston after being down 0-2 and winning the pivotal game 5 @ the Boston Garden. Ewing was immense in the last 3 games and I read your post that playoff games can be a deciding factor so I can't see why that shouldn't apply in this case.

Hakeem was a monster defensively but Ewing was no slouch in this regard and he was a much better offensive player although Hakeem was probably more skilled at that point. Also, Hakeem had a rep of trying to do to much at this point because he didn't trust his teammates enough and too much of something is never good. I don't really blame him a whole lot in retrospect though.

Ewing also got quite a bit of love this year from his peers. He was considered the best consensus C and in the sporting news MVP voting, he was 4th behind Barkley, Magic and Jordan.

In balloting by 180 NBA players, Barkley received 57 1/2 votes. Los Angeles guard Magic Johnson received 44 1/2. Chicago's Michael Jordan was third with 44 votes, followed by New York's Patrick Ewing with 21 1/2 and Houston's Akeem Olajuwon with 7

http://www.deseretnews.com/article/1...-NBAS-MVP.html

1991
1. Jordan
2. Magic
3. Barkley
4. Robinson
5. Malone

Agreed on all counts.

1992
1. Jordan
2. Drexler
3. Malone
4. Robinson
5. Ewing

My top 5 is the same as yours except that I'd move Robinson 5th since he missed the playoffs. Ewing is 4th and I'm switching Karl Malone and Drexler. This is where we disagree regarding team success and season narrative. I simply feel Malone was better. He actually did pretty well in the 4th quarters from what I saw and I'd says it's because he mixed the perimeter game well with inside game. Of course, Stock was pretty good at getting him the ball off screen and rolls, tough angles and they ran some cross screens with J. Malone and Edwards to help him set up deeper because their man wasn't going to switch.

He had several 4th quarters in the 1992 playoffs where he scored 10+. In game one vs Seattle, he had 16 of his 30 in the 4th and they mentioned Utah brought him up high and he made great decisiosn from there. To close Seattle, he had 15 of his 37 in the 4th and Eaton fed off the attention he drew late in the quarter.. In the Blazer series, he was the best player on the floor. He was posting up deep on Buck Williams, drawing a lot of fouls, putting the ball on the floor, doing that trademark set up on the left block and rolling across the lane. His jumper did not have quite the same range but he was still effective on the face up and turnaround. Passing wasn't quite as good in the late 90s. He didn't have the same touch, control or accuracy. Good outlet passing though. He played huge @ Portland in the pivotal game 5 with 28 pts in the second half realizing that Stockton was hurt and wasn't coming back. He helped force OT where the Blazers talent was simply overwhelming. In game six, Portland limited him pretty well and he only scored 2 in the 4th but they were doubling him hard and even sending triple teams making guys like Tyrone Corbin and Edwards beat them but that wasn't happening. This was a huge issue with the Jazz in the early 90s as they didn't have proper spacing. Hornacek was a huge upgrade over the one dimensional Jeff Malone in this regard.

1993
1. Jordan
2. Barkley
3. Hakeem
4. Ewing
5. Robinson

I'd switch Barkley and Hakeem and it's not even close to me. Hakeem got underrated throughout the year though there were a few people who noticed the great year he had and said he => anyone in the league Jordan included. Hard to get people to notice you when you have 1 nationally televised game all season to be honest. Anyway, he was flawless and awesome on both ends on the court, emerged into a leader by example and showed examples of vocal leadership in the locker room as well (Tree Rollins verifies this). The coaches actually voted him MVP this year by a smidge. The gargantuan difference between their defense is enough for me and I can't help but remember Houston getting jobbed down the stretch vs Seattle with multiple calls while the MVP needed a HORRIFIC no call on a clearly late putback in game 5 just to beat the sub.500 Lakers.

1994
1. Hakeem
2. Ewing
3. Robinson
4. Pippen
5. Shaq

Ewing is way too high but I realize it fits your criteria and see why you have him here.

Believe it or not, Karl Malone is my #2 even though he had a very down year in terms of numbers. Here's a post I wrote about this year on Karl: I've watched a lot of playoff games and that was a transition year for him. He didn't set up as deep (probably to extend his career) and became more of a jump shooter and extended his range. His passing to cutters as well as towards the strong side and weakside was a lot better.

In the playoffs, he took it to Rodman/Robinson and completely shut Robinson down. That swipe was deadly, he made Robinson pass up shots and look tentative with the excessive physical play. He hit a go-ahead jumpshot with about 40 seconds left to close the Spurs out.

Against Denver, he didn't post as much because Dikembe was a huge presence in the lane but his perimeter game was on point. He saved Utah the embarassment by not losing game 7 after losing a 3-0 lead with a huge first half being extremely wet from the perimeter. In game three, Denver was so concerned with Malone on the pick and roll, that they were allowing Stock and Hornacek to shoot. They did and Sloan afterwards said, "that was good to see because Stock doesn't usually take those shots" a sign that indicates he didn't assert himself enough. Paraphrased.

Against Houston, they came out flat, Hakeem was going off and getting too much attention and they lost to a better team. Malone had food poisoning which definitely effected him after game two. This is another series where I think Stockton should have been more aggressive and taken advantage of the Houston defense. Houston couldn't guard PGs to save their lives and that was the only glaring weakness of that team.

Robinson is my #3 even though he has quite a bit of flaws and Malone thoroughly embarrassed him in the first round.

Shaq is my #4. He was a very dominant albeit still flawed offensive force at this point. I can't base too much on a 3 game playoff series since the sample size is really small. Shaq got more MVP love than anyone not named Hakeem and David.

His fellow NBA players agreed and voted Olajuwon THE SPORTING NEWS NBA Player of the Year. "I don't like to campaign for myself," Olajuwon says. "But humility demands the truth." Olajuwon tallied 72 votes, with David Robinson (56) and Shaquille O'Neal (15) finishing second and third.

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/m...g=content;col1

NBA survey salutes the Admiral as top gun // Players uniformly like the view in Phoenix

[FINAL Edition]
USA TODAY (pre-1997 Fulltext) - McLean, Va.
Author: David DuPree
Date: Apr 28, 1994
Start Page: 11.E
Section: BONUS
Text Word Count: 1006
Abstract (Document Summary)

David Robinson of San Antonio, the NBA's leading scorer, was voted most valuable player in USA TODAY's third annual survey of players, coaches, trainers and general managers. Robinson received 47% (126 votes) to 36% (98) for Hakeem Olajuwon of Houston. Shaquille O'Neal of Orlando was a distant third.

http://pqasb.pqarchiver.com/USAToday...x&pqatl=google
It's very tough between Pippen and Ewing but I'll side with Ewing by a smidge though it feels wrong completely leaving Pippen off the list considering the year he had overachieving with Chicago. I can understand an argument for Pippen and somebody may convince me.

[LosBulls]

[NugzHeat3]

Another long ass post incoming.

1995
1. Hakeem
2. Robinson
3. Shaq
4. Malone
5. Barkley

I'd switch Shaq and Robinson. Shaq was a much better offensive player with a better back to basket game which is more suitable in playoff environment as opposed to a face up game which Robinson relied on. All you have to do is compare the series vs the Rockets . Houston's game plan was to double team each guy. Robinson very much struggled to break down the double teams because he couldn't see the floor as well and just flustered under pressure. Shaq's dominant back to basket game + superior passing ability made it much easier to pass out of double teams and he was also getting deeper position which meant the Rockets perimeter players who were helping had to spend more time getting there and more time recovering thus an easier time for the Orlando shooters who still failed to knock down open shots. I'd argue Shaq was a better post-defender as well due to his bulk + superior strength and he's always been great at contesting shots against post-players on the move.

Robinson had a more superior season, was the MVP and overachieved with the Spurs more so than Shaq did but I'm going to war with Shaq.
I would also move Robinson behind Malone for the same reason. Struggling to type this because you know a guy must be a choker if you're taking Malone over him but I'd go to WAR with Karl Malone over David Robinson. I still have 1994 in my mind where he completely dominated him and he does the same in 1996 as well.

Karl did great vs Houston and didn't get adequate support + he simply lost to a better team. He also had a very good elimination game. In the crucial 4th quarter, he did have 9 points and 3 rebounds including a desperation three in Hakeem's grill. Hakeem had 12 points and 5 rebounds and was the better player in the quarter (made a insane turnaround shot off the edge of the glass and dunked on the entire state of Utah on a lob pass). That said, Utah after being up with about 7 minutes left tried running the clock down, fed Malone who got doubled, kicked it out to Benoit and CLANK.

Technically, Karl made the right play as he was drawing a double team while the rest of the team couldn't reduce the load. Hakeem had support. Drexler had 8 points, 3 rebounds, 2 assists in the quarter while the great Johnny Stockton had 1 points and 0 assist along with 4 missed shots.

1996
1. Jordan
2. Pippen
3. Payton
4. Shaq
5. Hakeem

Again, disagree outside of Jordan who is a clearcut #1. I see your stance on Payton considering the criteria.

Payton would be nowhere near my top 5 though. Firstly, let's see GP's perception amongst players, coaches, GMs in a best in the league poll.

1996 USA TODAY surveyed NBA players, coaches, trainers and general managers in seven
different
categories. Of 435 ballots distributed, 301 (69%) were returned. Voters could
pick teammates, their own
coach or home arena. All selections were confidential. The results:
Best player
Player Team Points
1. Michael Jordan Chicago 132
2. Hakeem Olajuwon Houston 25
3. Scottie Pippen Chicago 19
4. Anfernee Hardaway Orlando 7
5. Shaquille O'Neal Orlando 3
6. Grant Hill Detroit 2
(Magic Johnson of the Los Angeles Lakers, David Robinson of San Antonio,
Charles Barkley of Phoenix,
Mitch Richmond of Sacramento and Shawn Kemp of Seattle each received one vote)

Gary Payton didn't get a single vote for best player in the league at the end of the 1996 season. Jordan got 132, Hakeem 25, Pippen 19, Penny 7, hey even Magic coming out of retirement got one and his own teammate as well.
Lets see which PGs coaches thought were the best in 1996:

Who's the NBA's best point guard? SI asked the league's 29 coaches to name their top three choices. Twenty-four responded, and they overwhelmingly voted for an old reliable, 33-year-old, 12-season vet John Stockton, who in a Feb. 20 game against the Celtics established himself as the league's alltime leader in steals (with 2,321 and counting at week's end), to go with his status as the alltime assists leader (11,025 and counting). The results, with three points given for a first-place vote, two for a second and one for a third (first-place points in parentheses):

1. John Stockton 57 (14)

2. Anfernee Hardaway 44 (5)

3. Jason Kidd 19 (3)

4. Gary Payton 18 (2)

5. Magic Johnson 2

6. Mookie Blaylock 1

Kevin Johnson 1

Scottie Pippen 1

Rod Strickland 1

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vau...7830/index.htm

Payton was 4th behind Jason Kidd. Yes, that's young Kidd.

His DPoY is one of the worst selections in league history showing the emphasis voters put on stats such as spg. He himself admits this.

Those moments probably had as much to do with winning the award, an accomplishment Payton says he considers on par with winning an NBA title.

Payton said, overall, he had a better defensive season last season. This season, he conceded, the difference was leading the league in steals.

"I didn't come into the season looking to lead the league in steals," Payton said. "But I got off to a good start, and got the lead early. About two months into the year, I decided it was going to happen. I led the league in steals because I went for more steals."

http://community.seattletimes.nwsour...7&slug=2327993

What kind of shit is that? He admits he had a better defensive season the year before he won the award. In 1995, he had 2 votes in total and goes to winning the award from there despite having a worse season according to himself.

It just shows you the level of idiocy of some of the voters and the emphasis on stats to measure defense.

Don't get me wrong. GP's defense was great and it got their entire defense going because it was a team that was built around pressure defense and trapping which got the team's transition offense going through turnovers forced. He'd pressure the ball, hound his man, they'd trap with their bigger gurads or forwards like McKey or McMillan and someone else would step into the passing lane. Payton was also pretty active, very quick hands, long arms for effective double teaming and ball denial. I've seen him have GW steals on guys like Jordan and Hakeem.

But the system the Sonics ran (SOS pressure defense of Bob Kloppenburg) had just as much to do with it as Payton's defense. There was a lot of switching involved and so many rotations because they swarmed you so much so the Sonics defense was as much of a team-oriented defense as any.

To be fair, every defense is team-oriented but Payton wasn't a guy who could single handedly anchor a defense or give you a foundation to build your defense around like David Robinson who was the rightful DPoY.

Payton had a great year but he wasn't better than Shaq, Hakeem, Penny, David Robinson or Karl Malone.

I'm not 100% certain on how rank 2-5 but I'd go Hakeem, Shaq, Malone and Robinson in that order. Hakeem got unlucky with all the injuries Houston had and his perception was still high as he got most votes for best in the league not named Jordan. I talked to ShaqAttack about this and I think Hakeem was just coasting early on in that season before the injuries for everyone started to pile up. Given his age, he was probably saving himself for the post-season but he was forced to pick up the load as they had a plethora of injuries. His numbers are really good post All-Star break and pretty mediocre before it but that's what ultimately led to his downfall in the playoffs. In the season, in order, Drexler went down with a shin injury, Elie broke his wrist shortly after, Horry had knee tendinitis, Cassell had elbow surgery and Hakeem ended up wearing himself down as well as went down with knee tendinitis late in the season which continued in the playoffs.

You can see they had to call up quite a few CBA players that year and the team never really got a chance to group together and get themselves ready for the playoffs as quite a few were still banged up. The Lakers were favourites in the first round vs Houston to paint the picture for you.

Shaq was great that year and though he missed a good portion early in the year, he available in the playoffs and played well for most of the year.

David Robinson had a great regular season and a first round as he overachieved with San Antonio but he again failed in the playoffs vs Utah and struggled against a good defensive frontline in Karl Malone and Felton Spencer with John Stockton helping. That's his flaw and it's in his offensive game and for all his defensive and stat stuffing ability, it moves him below Hakeem, Shaq and Malone.

1997
1. Jordan
2. Malone
3. Hakeem
4. Shaq
5. Mourning

Pefect except for Zo who has no business being there. He's not even the best player on his team or the MVP which was Tim according to Riley and multiple players on the team. He was very flawed at this point and led his temper get the best of him as Rodman got into his head in the playoffs. His offensive game isn't very reliable at this point or very polished. I'd take Hill instead of him and I see an argument for Pippen.

[NugzHeat3]

First page in candidacy for longest page in ISH history.

1998
1. Jordan
2. Malone
3. Shaq
4. Duncan
5. Payton

I'm going to agree with ShaqAttack and say Shaq was the best in the league at this point. This is basically a prime Shaq with not much difference from his 2000 version apart from the fact that Phil Jackson isn't coaching. Of course, Phil made him a more committed player in regards to rebounding and defense but in terms of skill level, this is prime Shaq. He was just playing on a very talented but flawed team that had a coach they had no respect for. He had an awesome series vs Seattle that got him huge respect for George Karl who said he was not only the best player in the league but also the best post player in the history of the league.

I'm totally fine with Jordan as #1 though who had an awesome year carrying Bulls to a great record with Pippen out for the first half of the season and putting a remarkable effort vs Utah in game 6 with Pippen literally serving as a decoy. He was definitely deserving of MVP. I love watching Jordan games from this year.

Malone, Duncan and Payton for 3-5 sounds good.

1999
1. Duncan
2. Shaq
3. Malone
4. Mourning
5. Kidd

I can dig this but I'd switch Zo and Malone. Zo had really improved his game this year by controlling his temper, becoming much more of a leader, improving his post game as he could hit jumphooks with both hands, put the ball on the floor, react better to double teams ect. His offensive support was terrible. Mashburn was an awful fit in the Heat offense and Tim Hardaway had also really declined at this point putting weight on, dealing with injuries and shot selection issues.