Best Player Post Jordan (1999) who is it?

[mrpuente]

Wow, you may be worse than LeBron fanboys. You really dont understand your own team with ridiculous posts like that do you?

Defense was what won the Spurs those titles more than anything, especially that year and you dont need to have superstars to play team defense. That team was LOADED with talent, even off the bench. You had Duncan and Robinson's size inside, Parker averaged 15+ PPG that year, Ginobli was pretty good, Stephen Jackson, Bruce Bowen, Steve Kerr, Danny Ferry...

Youre an idiot if you think the 03 team had allstar talent. Nothing more than role players. Tony Parker needed Speedy Claxton to bail him out. Sjax, Bowen, Kerr, and Ferry?

I cant argue with bandwagoners.

[Myth]

Shaq
TD

Kobe

Based on achievements and championships

Not that I necessarily disagree with your list, but if you are going "based on achievements and championships" then I think Duncan has Shaq beat. Duncan has 1 more MVP, 1 more All-NBA 1st team selection, 1 more All-NBA 2nd team selection, 8 more All-Defensive first teams (to Shaq's 0) (Shaq has 1 more 2nd team defense, but that is because Duncan was too busy getting 1st team selections).

[drza44]

The supporting cast of the '03 Spurs has gotten laughably under-rated over time. Yes, Robinson was old. He was also still a top-5 defensive big man in the NBA. Combine him with Duncan and the paint is locked down, especially important against the Lakers. Young Ginobili, young Jackson, and vet Bowen was a very solid blend of timely offense and aggressive defense on the wings. And young Parker/vet Claxton was another blend of youth/offensive talent and veteran expertise when a steadier hand was needed.

While it is true that the supporting cast wasn't near their peak (either too old or too young), there was plenty of talent and the old/young blend worked to hide the weaknesses of either. That team doesn't win a title without a legitimate superstar like Duncan to lead them, but this wasn't even close to a solo mission. That supporting cast was legit.

[big baller]

/agree, but id throw KG in there for sheer "shoulder load"-ness

LMAO, hell no

[JonnyBigBoss]

Kobe for sure as far as an all around basketball player goes. Duncan and Shaq are definitely amazing players but have great weaknesses that don't make them Jordanesque.

[Carbine]

The supporting cast of the '03 Spurs has gotten laughably under-rated over time. Yes, Robinson was old. He was also still a top-5 defensive big man in the NBA. Combine him with Duncan and the paint is locked down, especially important against the Lakers. Young Ginobili, young Jackson, and vet Bowen was a very solid blend of timely offense and aggressive defense on the wings. And young Parker/vet Claxton was another blend of youth/offensive talent and veteran expertise when a steadier hand was needed.

While it is true that the supporting cast wasn't near their peak (either too old or too young), there was plenty of talent and the old/young blend worked to hide the weaknesses of either. That team doesn't win a title without a legitimate superstar like Duncan to lead them, but this wasn't even close to a solo mission. That supporting cast was legit.

You don't win a championship without some type of talent surrounding your best player. But if you compare that teams talent to past champions and their supporting casts, it's almost impossible to say that the 2003 Spurs had legit talent.

There were numerous other stars who had better supporting casts in 2003 that didn't win the title. ****, there have been MANY superstars with clear cut more talent than the 2003 Spurs that did not even make the finals, let alone win the championship.

[drza44]

You don't win a championship without some type of talent surrounding your best player. But if you compare that teams talent to past champions and their supporting casts, it's almost impossible to say that the 2003 Spurs had legit talent.

There were numerous other stars who had better supporting casts in 2003 that didn't win the title. ****, there have been MANY superstars with clear cut more talent than the 2003 Spurs that did not even make the finals, let alone win the championship.

Without a lot of in depth analysis I'd say that in the last 20 years, the non-best-player-talent of the '03 Spurs compares favorably with the mid-90s Rockets and the '06 Heat among teams that have won titles. That puts the Spurs among the lesser pure-talented champs of recent years, but not as some big outlier.

As for the "MANY superstars with clear cut more talent", I guess it depends how you define superstar. In this generation, the only "superstars" I'd put in the same breath as Duncan are Shaq, KG, and Kobe (with LeBron from the next generation soon to join them). Shaq has almost always had as much or more talent than those '03 Spurs, but his teams have also generally been contenders. As for KG and Kobe, since coming into their primes I don't think either of them have ever had as much surrounding talent as the '03 Spurs and NOT been contenders. (That came out awkward, let me try again. Anytime either Kobe or KG have had as much surrounding talent as those '03 Spurs since they hit their peak, they've also fielded title contenders). And LeBron has already shown that he can make teams of similar supporting talent into contenders, and he's still a youngster in the game. And I've already pointed out what Wade did in '06, and I don't even consider him a "superstar" on Duncan's level yet.

And really, once you get past a certain talent threshold winning in the playoffs is as much about matchups, playing style and luck as it is about position-to-position comparisons. The cast of the '03 Spurs meshed very well with a generation-level superstar in Duncan, allowing them to be a very formidable team. And I have no problem at all with Duncan getting big props for taking that team to a title, as he was amazing that year...a generation-level talent at his absolute peak. It's just that the '03 Spurs are becoming like a fishing tall tale...just like the fish gets bigger with every telling, the Spurs cast seems to get worse every year. In '03, that Spurs team was considered formidable...at the rate it's going, by '13 people will be saying that Duncan was playing with 11 high schoolers that he picked at random from the crowd each game!

[Duncan21formvp]

Kobe for sure as far as an all around basketball player goes. Duncan and Shaq are definitely amazing players but have great weaknesses that don't make them Jordanesque.

Kobe never even won as the man and has 0 finals mvp's. You gotta put your talent together with individual success where you win as the man.