Page 9 of 9 FirstFirst ... 6789
Results 121 to 130 of 130
  1. #121
    NBA Legend and Hall of Famer
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Posts
    23,214

    Default Re: Better Case For GOAT? Wilt Chamberlain or KAJ

    Magic Johnson really saved Jabbar's career. He'd be thought of as an even more of a "can't win center" if Magic didn't come win him some rings.

    1 ring in the parity filled 70's?

  2. #122
    Seething... ClipperRevival's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Posts
    7,974

    Default Re: Better Case For GOAT? Wilt Chamberlain or KAJ

    Quote Originally Posted by Sarcastic
    Magic Johnson really saved Jabbar's career. He'd be thought of as an even more of a "can't win center" if Magic didn't come win him some rings.

    1 ring in the parity filled 70's?
    How many did Magic win without Jabbar? Right, ZERO.

  3. #123
    NBA Legend CavaliersFTW's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Ohio
    Posts
    16,655

    Default Re: Better Case For GOAT? Wilt Chamberlain or KAJ

    Quote Originally Posted by Sarcastic
    Magic Johnson really saved Jabbar's career. He'd be thought of as an even more of a "can't win center" if Magic didn't come win him some rings.

    1 ring in the parity filled 70's?
    ^ truth

  4. #124
    Seething... ClipperRevival's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Posts
    7,974

    Default Re: Better Case For GOAT? Wilt Chamberlain or KAJ

    Quote Originally Posted by CavaliersFTW
    ^ truth
    The truth is, we can play these "what if" scenarios with any player. How many does Bird win without McHale/Parish? Does LeBron win ANY ring if he doesn't go to a super team? How many would MJ win without Pip? Great teams win championships, which is usually led by an alpha dog and then a second fiddle and sometimes a very good third player. Magic needed KAJ just as much as KAJ needed Magic to win.

  5. #125
    NBA Legend CavaliersFTW's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Ohio
    Posts
    16,655

    Default Re: Better Case For GOAT? Wilt Chamberlain or KAJ

    Quote Originally Posted by ClipperRevival
    The truth is, we can play these "what if" scenarios with any player. How many does Bird win without McHale/Parish? Does LeBron win ANY ring if he doesn't go to a super team? How many would MJ win without Pip? Great teams win championships, which is usually led by an alpha dog and then a second fiddle and sometimes a very good third player. Magic needed KAJ just as much as KAJ needed Magic to win.
    I know we don't need what-ifs

    Wilt most dominant ever

    Russell winningest ever

    My two GOATs where the least number of what ifs are necessary to explain their place. They accomplished the most.

    KAJ and MJ next in line - for being in a sort of in-between zone with plenty of accomplishments in their own right.

  6. #126
    Seething... ClipperRevival's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Posts
    7,974

    Default Re: Better Case For GOAT? Wilt Chamberlain or KAJ

    Quote Originally Posted by CavaliersFTW
    I know we don't need what-ifs

    Wilt most dominant ever

    Russell winningest ever

    My two GOATs where the least number of what ifs are necessary to explain their place. They accomplished the most.

    KAJ and MJ next in line - for being in a sort of in-between zone with plenty of accomplishments in their own right.
    I see it the other way around. To me, MJ and KAJ are the two greatest ever and then you have Wilt/Russell.

    Russell lacked an offensive game. You couldn't throw the ball down the post to him and tell him to dominate via the post. And he also won most of his rings when the league only had 8 teams.

    Wilt, as dominant as he was, didn't have much of a game from 15 feet. He overpowered you with his size and athleticism. And his playoff stats are unimpressive with his 22ppg

    KAJ could do everything as a big. Probably not as dominant on the D end as the other two but he had the single greatest offensive weapon in history.

    To me, KAJ and MJ, when you look at their entire body of work, are the top 2. From individual accomplishments, individual awards, rings and college (for Jabbar). Also, you have to consider their game/skills. They were about as complete as you can get.

    I just don't see how anyone can rate Russell over Jabbar when Russell simply lacked a dominant offensive game. How can you be the greatest if you can't even dominate on one end of the court?

  7. #127
    ... on a leash ArbitraryWater's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    I walk a higher path, son
    Posts
    46,641

    Default Re: Better Case For GOAT? Wilt Chamberlain or KAJ

    Quote Originally Posted by CavaliersFTW
    I know we don't need what-ifs

    Wilt most dominant ever

    Russell winningest ever

    My two GOATs where the least number of what ifs are necessary to explain their place. They accomplished the most.

    KAJ and MJ next in line - for being in a sort of in-between zone with plenty of accomplishments in their own right.
    Again, I already said this in the other thread..

    what if we combine winning and dominance?

    MJ/Kareem > Wilt/Russell, get over it.

  8. #128
    NBA Legend CavaliersFTW's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Ohio
    Posts
    16,655

    Default Re: Better Case For GOAT? Wilt Chamberlain or KAJ

    Quote Originally Posted by ArbitraryWater
    Again, I already said this in the other thread..

    what if we combine winning and dominance?

    MJ/Kareem > Wilt/Russell, get over it.
    I could easily say combine them, and you'll still find Kareem and MJ don't add up to Wilt and Russell.

    Kareem and MJ have what, 1/30th of Wilt's dominating records? So they aren't even remotely close to his dominance.

    They have what, 2/5ths of Russell's championships?

    They aren't a perfect blend... they are as high a blend as any 2 players have ever gotten, but they still don't stack up to Wilt or Russell's level. They'd still have quite a ways to go if they wanted to be a reasonable blend of Wilt's dominance, like they didn't even get close to it. And they also didn't get half way to Russell's winning success.

    I didn't make this observation up either I heard it and am sharing this opinion from Sonny Hill, KAJ, and Rick Barry, the two players with the most stand out resumes that require the least amount of explanations at the top:

    Wilt - if you favor dominating

    Russell - if you favor winning
    Last edited by CavaliersFTW; 02-05-2015 at 03:27 PM.

  9. #129
    NBA Legend kuniva_dAMiGhTy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Posts
    16,664

    Default Re: Better Case For GOAT? Wilt Chamberlain or KAJ

    Quote Originally Posted by ArbitraryWater
    Again, I already said this in the other thread..

    what if we combine winning and dominance?

    MJ/Kareem > Wilt/Russell, get over it.
    When you combine all factors that go into GOAT: Dominance, Stats, Winning, Honors, Championships, Awards (MVPs and FMVPs), Jordan and Kareem have the best cases, in my opinion.

    Russell can be argued if literally all you care about is winning and removing context, but Wilt has the weakest case of all GOATs.

  10. #130
    WIND DEFENDER AirFederer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    3,739

    Default Re: Better Case For GOAT? Wilt Chamberlain or KAJ

    Isn't most dominant ever another way of saying Emptiest Stats Ever?

    Dominance w/o rings = empty stats


  11. #131
    ... on a leash ArbitraryWater's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    I walk a higher path, son
    Posts
    46,641

    Default Re: Better Case For GOAT? Wilt Chamberlain or KAJ

    Quote Originally Posted by kuniva_dAMiGhTy
    When you combine all factors that go into GOAT: Dominance, Stats, Winning, Honors, Championships, Awards (MVPs and FMVPs), Jordan and Kareem have the best cases, in my opinion.

    Russell can be argued if literally all you care about is winning and removing context, but Wilt has the weakest case of all GOATs.
    Yep, not hard to understand either.. dude can't, won't accept it though..

  12. #132
    NBA Legend and Hall of Famer
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Posts
    23,214

    Default Re: Better Case For GOAT? Wilt Chamberlain or KAJ

    To answer the OP's question, Wilt has the better case for GOAT. He has statistical dominance that is unparalleled in almost every other sport. Kareem does not have the statistical dominance that Wilt has, nor does he have the winning dominance that Russell. He has a little bit of both, but not good as either in the respective areas. There is not one aspect of basketball that he is the absolute best at, other than longevity, and that is not GOAT worthy.

  13. #133
    College superstar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Memphis
    Posts
    4,720

    Default Re: Better Case For GOAT? Wilt Chamberlain or KAJ

    Quote Originally Posted by kuniva_dAMiGhTy
    When you combine all factors that go into GOAT: Dominance, Stats, Winning, Honors, Championships, Awards (MVPs and FMVPs), Jordan and Kareem have the best cases, in my opinion.

    Russell can be argued if literally all you care about is winning and removing context, but Wilt has the weakest case of all GOATs.
    Why do people keep saying this? Russell has winning, records, stats, and accolades. For some strange reason people think that statistical dominance only relates to scoring numbers as if other stats don't exist. There is no greater correlation between volume individual scoring and winning than there is between volume individual rebounding and winning. Teams with the league's leading scorer have had losing seasons. Teams with the league's leading rebounder have had losing seasons also. Teams with the scoring champion have won rings just as teams with the best rebounder have won several championships. For the record, Russell has won championships as his team's leader in points, rebounds, assists, and fg% in the playoffs. What else is a player supposed to do?

  14. #134
    NBA Legend kuniva_dAMiGhTy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Posts
    16,664

    Default Re: Better Case For GOAT? Wilt Chamberlain or KAJ

    Quote Originally Posted by jlip
    Why do people keep saying this? Russell has winning, records, stats, and accolades. For some strange reason people think that statistical dominance only relates to scoring numbers as if other stats don't exist. There is no greater correlation between volume individual scoring and winning than there is between volume individual rebounding and winning. Teams with the league's leading scorer have had losing seasons. Teams with the league's leading rebounder have had losing seasons also. Teams with the scoring champion have won rings just as teams with the best rebounder have won several championships. For the record, Russell has won championships as his team's leader in points, rebounds, assists, and fg% in the playoffs. What else is a player supposed to do?
    Russell has the best case if you value championships (he isn't Robert Horry so don't get it twisted). If you value everything, his resume does NOT stack up to Kareem or Jordan's, who again, have the best combo of stats, dominance, accolades and honors.

  15. #135
    ... on a leash ArbitraryWater's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    I walk a higher path, son
    Posts
    46,641

    Default Re: Better Case For GOAT? Wilt Chamberlain or KAJ

    Quote Originally Posted by jlip
    Why do people keep saying this? Russell has winning, records, stats, and accolades. For some strange reason people think that statistical dominance only relates to scoring numbers as if other stats don't exist. There is no greater correlation between volume individual scoring and winning than there is between volume individual rebounding and winning. Teams with the league's leading scorer have had losing seasons. Teams with the league's leading rebounder have had losing seasons also. Teams with the scoring champion have won rings just as teams with the best rebounder have won several championships. For the record, Russell has won championships as his team's leader in points, rebounds, assists, and fg% in the playoffs. What else is a player supposed to do?
    What does this have to do with all around dominance against Kareem and Jordan?

    Sorry, he DOESN'T HAVE THAT KIND OF ABILITY....

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •