Illinois basketball fans

[IlliniFan]

Remember Arizona State? The team we beat in one of the first games of the season in Hawaii..They are now 14-2 and ranked #22 in the nation. Just thought that was interesting.

[ballinhun8]

Wow, and if actually had won some games we should've won (ARI, MIA[OH], PSU, TENN ST.) we could be a tourney team.

At least we are starting to play better and guys like McCamey are steppin up and players like Brock and Meachem are playing consistent.

If only our seniors would play with the same intensity as last night we'd be a team on the rise.

[dak121]

It's weird to see a team go from nearly undefeated 3 years ago to a team that might struggle to make the NIT.

Is Weber that bad a recruiter? That Purdue game was rough to watch.

[wang4three]

This team isn't a team to hang your hopes on. They are mentally weak down games and cannot execute.

Next year will be better with Legion and Jamar. D-Mac and Mike Davis will get better as well. Hopefully Rodney Alexander puts things together too, but I won't put too many ifs.

As for this season, it is what it is. A down season. A season to learn how far we can fall from greatness.

[TheGame414]

It's weird to see a team go from nearly undefeated 3 years ago to a team that might struggle to make the NIT.

It is weird, but it happens. UNC went from the Final Four in 1997 and 1998 to 8-20 in 2002. (Hell, they were a No. 2 seed the year before, in 2001.) Duke went from 1991 and 1992 national titles to being 14-15 in 1995. UConn missed the tourney shortly after winning both their 1999 and 2004 national titles, in 2001 and 2007. Look at where Maryland has gone after winning the 2002 title. Michigan State has had five seasons of 12+ losses since their 2000 national title, and haven't won a Big Ten crown since sharing it with Illinois in 2001.

Kentucky's worse off than Illinois at the moment.

It does seem weird, but the bottom line is, it happens to everyone.

Aside from Kansas and Arizona- and even those programs have at least had mediocre stretches-

Is Weber that bad a recruiter? That Purdue game was rough to watch.

It's a combination of bad recruiting and even worse luck. To put it simply, if the Gordons hadn't screwed Weber over, this conversation doesn't occur right now. If Worldwide Wes hadn't been involved with Derrick Rose's recruitment, this conversation doesn't occur right now. And if the two of them had followed through on what they started playing AAU together two summers ago, Illinois is probably the No. 1 team in the nation again.

This isn't to excuse a string of misses on the recruiting trail. Believe me, I'm not a Weber apologist. My dad is, and he gets so sick of my criticism of Weber at times that he'll leave the room during the game. It's simply to point out the obvious: that with so few scholarships to go around, unless you're a superpower like Kansas, UNC, or Duke, if you get boned over once it can start a nasty domino effect.

Of course, the recruiting seems to have reversed course with big-time recruits in '09 and '10. And the addition of Legion next year makes the '07 group pretty strong in a year or two.

I still believe that Weber can great results out of very good talent. The '05 team had two NBA guards, an outstanding college player who wasn't an NBA talent (Dee Brown), and two solid but far from dominant frontcourt players in Powell and Augustine. It wasn't a lineup full of lottery picks like UNC or Florida's title teams. Self left a very good roster in Weber's hands, but anyone who thinks he inherited a team full of megastars that SHOULD have gone 37-2 is crazy.

[TheGame414]

As for this season, it is what it is. A down season. A season to learn how far we can fall from greatness.

It's yet another reminder, like the ones in my previous post, how fleeting success can be in college basketball, and how quickly it can be found again with a few right recruits. Look at Indiana, how down they had been and how quickly Sampson has them back on top of the conference. Look how quickly Ohio State went from a middle-of-the-pack program on probation to the national title game.

Now matter how far things fall, there's always light at the end of the tunnel in college basketball. It helps when you have the best young players in the state already committed to you and three freshmen (McCamey, Tisdale and Legion) who are going to be upper-level Big Ten players by their junior years.

Don't throw dirt on the grave yet. Get your shots in now. We'll be back.

[IlliniFan]

Lost to Ohio St. tonight, but without the services of Pruitt. He was benched for some reason. Not being disclosed by the team.

[TheGame414]

From everything I've heard Pruitt has been a disruptive force in practices and in the locker room all season. It sounds like it's about damn time Weber did something about him.

[TheGame414]

Rodney Alexander has scored 28 points in 37 minutes the last two games. For a team that's offensively inept, maybe he should, you know....play more.

[wang4three]

Rodney was catching everything Chester and McCamey were throwing up. He looks good.

[JPR]

illinois has a schedule basically the opposite of indiana. starting @ Wisky, the Loosiers will actually start playing real big 10 teams while illinois finally is starting to play teams like Northwestern, Minnesota, Iowa, ect. If Illinois goes 8-2 over their last 10 games and wins 2 games in the tourney, they'll be a bubble team.

[IlliniFan]

How about we win the tourny, and get in like that?

[TheGame414]

illinois has a schedule basically the opposite of indiana. starting @ Wisky, the Loosiers will actually start playing real big 10 teams while illinois finally is starting to play teams like Northwestern, Minnesota, Iowa, ect. If Illinois goes 8-2 over their last 10 games and wins 2 games in the tourney, they'll be a bubble team.

We more or less need to win out in the regular season to even be in the picture. Four home losses, no signature nonconference wins (the Arizona State win looks good in retrospect, but it was their first game of the season with three freshman guards starting; they were not a good team when we beat them).

It's win the Big Ten tourney or nothing. We need to play a lot better just to get into the NIT.

[IlliniFan]

Who do you think will be our final recruit for the 09/10 classes? We have one more scholarship available according to what I've read on other boards. Will it be Griffey? Cooley?

Also, If Carlwell redshirts, does that prevent us from signing one more player?

[TheGame414]

Who do you think will be our final recruit for the 09/10 classes? We have one more scholarship available according to what I've read on other boards. Will it be Griffey? Cooley?

Also, If Carlwell redshirts, does that prevent us from signing one more player?

Griffey, Cooley and Mason Plumlee are the three names I've heard, but I haven't paid tremendously close attention and don't know anything about any of them except Griffey.

Cooley would reportedly accept an Illinois offer immediately. Plumlee, I didn't even know about until Loren Tate mentioned him a week ago. Griffey's recruitment remains pretty open as far as I can tell. I'm pretty sure he and his family like Illinois and I know they've visited a number of times, but like I said, I don't know if he's close to a decision.

It's gotta be one of them; Tisdale, Cole and Semrau will be upperclassmen by the time they're here and we have to replentish our stockpile of tall white guys, don't we?

Since I know Griffey is tough, athletic and willing to bang inside, I hope we get him unless either Plumlee or Cooley also fits that description. With Cole and Tisdale we'll be set on inside-out, Euro-style big men until the '09 class are college juniors. Simpson would be our only banger otherwise.

If Carlwell were to redshirt, the scholarships would look like this, assuming no one leaves early for the NBA or transfers (both of which are certainly possible):

2009:

Seniors: Brock, Alexander, Frazier
Juniors: Smith
Sophomores: McCamey, Legion, Davis, Cole, Tisdale, Carlwell, Semrau
Freshmen: Simpson

2010:

Seniors: Smith
Juniors: McCamey, Legion, Davis, Cole, Tisdale, Carlwell, Semrau
Sophomores: Simpson
Freshmen: Paul, Bertrand, Richardson, (insert white power forward here)

2011:

Seniors: McCamey, Legion, Davis, Cole, Tisdale, Carlwell, Semrau
Juniors: Simpson
Sophomores: Paul, Bertrand, Richardson, (insert white power forward here)
Freshmen: Richmond, Head

So there's your answer. That's 14 scholarships in 2011 if Carlwell redshirts and no one else leaves. Too many.

I'm pretty sure they want to add a big man in 2009 so Simpson isn't the only one returning in 2012, so I doubt Carlwell redshirts. (This is why I think it was a mistake to not redshirt either Davis or Cole. We'd be no worse off without one of them this year, and four years from now either one would be a really good senior on a team that will need a big man.)

If he does, though, these things have a way of working themselves out. We sure as hell aren't going to get to Signing Day in November 2009 with only one scholarship open and two 5-star prospects committed.

It's rare that you go that long without anyone leaving one way or another. Odds are good that someone transfers, quits, or enters the NBA Draft.