"I don't know my ceiling." -LeBron James

[Doctor Rivers]

Do you know what his ceiling is?

[Kurosawa0]

His ceiling has always been the greatest player ever. I really doubt he gets there, but it's always been on the table for LeBron.

[Iceberg Slim]

His ceiling has always been the greatest player ever. I really doubt he gets there, but it's always been on the table for LeBron.

this

I hope KD doesn't become Malone and doesn't win because LeBron is around

[Kblaze8855]

Id say 4th greatest player of all time. I dont see him accomplishing enough to knock MJ, Russell, or Kareem down as far as "greatness". If we are talking how good you are at basketball...id say maybe...6-8th? Depending on what I do with the Duncan/Hakeem/Shaq group. To me closer to 8th or 9th is where id put him. Some will no doubt go higher.

[Doranku]

His ceiling has always been the greatest player ever. I really doubt he gets there, but it's always been on the table for LeBron.

That ship sailed a LONG time ago. If you get outscored by Jason Terry in the finals, you have no case for GOAT. Ever. Period.

There's really no discussion to be had.

[DatAsh]

Id say 4th greatest player of all time. I dont see him accomplishing enough to knock MJ, Russell, or Kareem down as far as "greatness". If we are talking how good you are at basketball...id say maybe...6-8th? Depending on what I do with the Duncan/Hakeem/Shaq group. To me closer to 8th or 9th is where id put him. Some will no doubt go higher.

I've never liked the distinction between "greatest" and "best". For me, they're the same thing.

[bmd]

That ship sailed a LONG time ago. If you get outscored by Jason Terry in the finals, you have no case for GOAT. Ever. Period.

There's really no discussion to be had.

Players can't improve? You are a simple mind.

[Kblaze8855]

Except if you are gonna call them the same thing one would have to assume George Mikan would be the best center in the NBA. Which is just....absurd.

How good you are and where you are ranked are not the same thing. I guess you can call them the same...but then you need something else to describe who plays basketball the best.

[bagelred]

He don't know his ceiling? Just look UP, fool!

[Goldrush25]

That ship sailed a LONG time ago. If you get outscored by Jason Terry in the finals, you have no case for GOAT. Ever. Period.

There's really no discussion to be had.

If you possess intelligence there is always a discussion to be had. When facts change most intelligent people change their viewpoints.

Most simple people keep the same viewpoints irrespective of the facts.

[Foster5k]

Lebron may not know his ceiling, however we pretty much have it figured out.

First off, he can not surpass Michael Jordan. Jordan's achievements, stats, global impact, what he did for the league, his iconic status, etc is just unobtainable for Lebron James. Lebron may have taken the Cavs to a NBA Finals, however he also got swept. This is something that the G.O.A.T would not have let happened. Jordan would of at least won one to three games versus the Spurs by himself. He might would of willed him teammates to play better and ultimately win the series. Who knows. What we do know is that he wouldn't have gotten swept, based on his past achievements/stats, etc.

Secondly, Lebron layed one of the biggest eggs versus the Mavericks in the 2011 NBA Finals. Certainly, for a player of his caliber, for someone wanting G.O.A.T status, this is highly unacceptable. Michael Jordan would of won that series by himself. He would of out played Dirk. He would of willed his teammates past the 2011 Mavericks. The trash talk would not have effected him. He would of played better. He would of showed the world why he is Michael Jordan, the greatest of all time.

Those two facts alone makes him lesser than Jordan. Not to mention the stats, championships, global impact, etc.

So, he will not and cannot eclipse Jordan.

Then we have the big men. Bill Russell, Wilt, etc. I wouldn't put him above those guys.

So, in the end, I think he'll end up above Kobe. It will be Lebron then Kobe, etc. But, that is if he can keep up his current progess, etc.

[Doranku]

Players can't improve? You are a simple mind.

He was in his prime, on a stacked team, and had homecourt advantage. Yet he was outplayed by a bench player and cost his team the series with his passiveness and nonexistent 4th quarter play.

I'm sorry, but nobody is ever going to consider him GOAT with that black mark on his resume. And the worst part is... that wasn't even his worst finals performance. He was even worse in 2007 against the Spurs.

He'll never have an argument over Michael as GOAT. Ever.

[I.R.Beast]

Top 15-20 ever...needing wade and bosh to win a title hurts his case also choking with wade and bosh hurts his case. If he does'nt get another ring with those 2 guys that also hurts his case. His efficiency will continue to be inflated as long as wade and bosh are around to take offensive load off of him, so that will help.... But i dont see him cracking top 5...top 10 maybe..small maybe.

[Haymaker]

Top 15-20 ever...needing wade and bosh to win a title hurts his case also choking with wade and bosh hurts his case. If he does get another ring with those 2 guys that also hurts his case. His efficiency will continue to be inflated as long as wade and bosh are around to take offensive load off of him, so that will help.... But i dont see him cracking top 5...top 10 maybe..small maybe.

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[Doranku]

If you possess intelligence there is always a discussion to be had. When facts change most intelligent people change their viewpoints.

Most simple people keep the same viewpoints irrespective of the facts.

What facts have changed? Him winning a ring in a shortened season doesn't somehow erase all of his past failures.