Prime Wade vs Prime T-Mac?

[ClipperRevival]

I'm somewhat with Smoke on this one. I think McGrady is a bit overrated. If you are "the man" on a team, there is a right way and wrong way to play the game. You can get yours at the expense of the offense or within the flow of it. Just because you put up 30+ PPG, even at good efficiency, doesn't necessarily mean you are playing optimal, team basketball. I've always viewed McGrady as a great, individual talent who didn't necessarily know how to elevate the level of his teammates while I viewed Wade as a true all-time great who not only knew how to get his but knew how to get his teammates involved and play an optimal type of ball that leads to winning.

[Dragonyeuw]

I'm somewhat with Smoke on this one. I think McGrady is a bit overrated. If you are "the man" on a team, there is a right way and wrong way to play the game. You can get yours at the expense of the offense or within the flow of it. Just because you put up 30+ PPG, even at good efficiency, doesn't necessarily mean you are playing optimal, team basketball. I've always viewed McGrady as a great, individual talent who didn't necessarily know how to elevate the level of his teammates while I viewed Wade as a true all-time great who not only knew how to get his but knew how to get his teammates involved and play an optimal type of ball that leads to winning.

I would say that's fair, though in reality being able to blend your own prodigious talent with lesser teammates is a skill in and of itself, and isn't necessarily natural to everyone. It would have been interesting if Hill and Mcgrady had 5 years together injury-free. That may have done wonders for Tmac in terms of maximizing your team while 'getting yours'. I would guess that Tmac's mentality back in 2003 was 'hey I've giving you 32/6/6. I'm doing my part'.

This was also a criticism levied at MJ early on in his career, especially since by 87 or 88 the conversation was becoming 'who's the best player? MJ, Magic, or Bird?' The knock on early career MJ was that the leading scorer won't win a championship, something he went on to disprove 6 times of course.

[ClipperRevival]

I would say that's fair, [COLOR="Red"]though in reality being able to blend your own prodigious talent with lesser teammates is a skill in and of itself, and isn't necessarily natural to everyone[/COLOR]. It would have been interesting if Hill and Mcgrady had 5 years together injury-free. That may have done wonders for Tmac in terms of maximizing your team while 'getting yours'. I would guess that Tmac's mentality back in 2003 was 'hey I've giving you 32/6/6. I'm doing my part'.

This was also a criticism levied at MJ early on in his career, especially since by 87 or 88 the conversation was becoming 'who's the best player? MJ, Magic, or Bird?' The knock on early career MJ was that the leading scorer won't win a championship, something he went on to disprove 6 times of course.

Exactly!

Playing the right way and being able to maximize the talents on a team is a learned trait through trial and error. Finding the right balance of taking over offensively and making sure teammates are involved is a balancing act. The true greats can sense what the team needs on almost every possession. Sometimes the team needs alpha dog scoring when the offense is just dead and sometimes the leader needs to feed his teammates to get their energy up. McGrady just didn't have that type of awareness imo.

[Mass Debator]

A 33-34y/o Wade per 36 "is" averaging 24/5/4 and on 53TS%.
A prime McGrady (4th-10th year) was 25/5/6 on 53TS%.

Wade when shooting near three attempts from 3 per game shot above 30% from deep.

McGrady's last 4 all-star years shot 33% on 6 attempts and had a 76FT%.

Anyone who watches Wade could see that if he shot 6 threes (especially in transition), he's going to make 2 of them most of the time...33%. I'm not saying Wade is a comparable shooter overall which he may be, but his shot IQ and patience is definitely a skill force to be reckoned with.

Ultimately, Wade is a better player because he's a more well-rounded player when taking skills, stats, and intangibles into equation. He has the aura of a natural leader that not many has and embraces which constitutes as a winner.

That being said, I'd take McGrady > Wade in a 1v1 contest but pro ball is a team sport that Wade has mastered.

[Spurs5Rings2014]

If it's such a team game then why was one man able to impact the game so much to the point where he showed the world that he didn't know how to lose in the finals even though he played in 6 finals?!?

Either it's a team game or MJ was just so fvcking good compared to anyone else in the history of the game that he is the exception to the rule. Which one is it?

Your boy was one Ray Allen fluke shot away from being matched. Settle down.

[SouBeachTalents]

Your boy was one Ray Allen fluke shot away from being matched. Settle down.

Not in Finals MVP's though

[Wade's Rings]

Your boy was one Ray Allen fluke shot away from being matched. Settle down.

Why do people say this? You don't think if the Heat lost in '13 they don't comeback extra motivated? Why would the Spurs head into the '14 Season even more motivated?

Even if the Spurs won back-to-back Duncan would still only have 4 Finals MVPs to Jordan's 6.

[ClipperRevival]

Your boy was one Ray Allen fluke shot away from being matched. Settle down.

Not all rings carry the same weight. MJ got his in the most overbearing way imaginable. He actually led the league in scoring all 6 times he won a ring. Not to mention, the GOAT level D he played. No one had to carry such a burden for his teams as "the man". That's why MJ's 6 rings carry such weight. It's not like KAJ where he was "the man" in 2/3 of those rings and played a lesser 2nd or 3rd fiddle role in others.

[SouBeachTalents]

Not all rings carry the same weight. MJ got his in the most overbearing way imaginable. He actually led the league in scoring all 6 times he won a ring. Not to mention, the GOAT level D he played. No one had to carry such a burden for his teams as "the man". That's why MJ's 6 rings carry such weight. It's not like KAJ where he was "the man" in 2/3 of those rings and played a lesser 2nd or 3rd fiddle role in others.

Only Russell was his teams best player for more rings than Jordan, and even his aren't as indisputable as Jordan's were

[ArbitraryWater]

People are picking Wade because his prime is fresher in their memories.

If the 2 peaked at the same time, it would be closer to 50/50 with probably a slight edge to T-Mac.

Prime T-Mac was being argued as > Kobe. Wade never really was.

You gotta love an already fcked up random line of argumentation that on top is wrong, both ways