Message Board Basketball Forum - InsideHoops

Go Back   Message Board Basketball Forum - InsideHoops > InsideHoops Main Basketball Forums > Off the Court Lounge

Off the Court Lounge Basketball fans talk about everything EXCEPT basketball here

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 02-20-2014, 07:03 PM   #16
KevinNYC
Perfectly Calm, Dude
 
KevinNYC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 11,396
Default Re: Venezuela: The Game Changed Last night (some REAL S*** is going down there)

Here's an article about their economy from November.

Quote:
The slump in Venezuelan oil prices is depriving the South American nation of its main source of revenue and threatening bondholders already suffering the worst losses in emerging markets.

Average prices of Venezuelan crude exports, responsible for 95 percent of the nation’s foreign currency earnings, fell to a 16-month low this month and ended last week at $93.98 a barrel. Each $1 dollar decline in a barrel of oil costs Venezuela about $700 million per year, according to estimates from state-owned Petroleos de Venezuela SA.

and it's only gotten worse.

Inflation is up to 50%, there's a black market of people exchanging their money for US dollars, there's shortages in the markets.
KevinNYC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2014, 07:04 PM   #17
Lebowsky
Hi, how are you?
 
Lebowsky's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 5,012
Default Re: Venezuela: The Game Changed Last night (some REAL S*** is going down there)

Quote:
Originally Posted by KevinNYC
My guess would be that without Chavez you still have all the repression with none of the cult of personality.


Protestors are leaving these in the streets to protect against the motorcycle thugs.

That's right. Maduro has no charisma or appeal to the masses, unlike Chavez. Now factor in the economic situation getting beyond critical, corruption and street crime running rampant, state repression tightening, and here's the result.

Things are getting really bad. 6 dead in a week of protests. They arrested one of the main leaders of the opposition under crazy made up charges and put him in a military prison. The government is arming and funding street gangs to attack protesters. Cuban intelligence agents are starting to arrive in the country. Things are looking really dire, it's about to blow up.
Lebowsky is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2014, 07:20 PM   #18
KevinNYC
Perfectly Calm, Dude
 
KevinNYC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 11,396
Default Re: Venezuela: The Game Changed Last night (some REAL S*** is going down there)

I don't know about y'all but between this and the Ukraine and Aleppo, I'm feeling fortunate that I don't have to confront those issues.
KevinNYC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2014, 07:21 PM   #19
Dictator
Insidehoops Mafia ©
 
Dictator's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 3,415
Default Re: Venezuela: The Game Changed Last night (some REAL S*** is going down there)

Quote:
Originally Posted by MightyWhitey
America should have bombed Venezuela off the face of the Earth when Hugo was still alive. These Latin American countries are ripe with corruption and human rights abuses. Now the worlds police will eventually have get involved somehow because people don't know how to govern themselves.


Eat a snickers, you turn into a dumbass when you're hungry.
Dictator is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2014, 07:23 PM   #20
Lebowsky
Hi, how are you?
 
Lebowsky's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 5,012
Default Re: Venezuela: The Game Changed Last night (some REAL S*** is going down there)

Quote:
Originally Posted by RidonKs
i was just reading about this after seeing a friend post this video on facebook, which is making serious waves around the web and actually comes straight from the blog (caracaschronicles) cited in the op.

it's worth reading up from as wide a variety of sources you can. too often when people take to the streets, our instinct as secure and insulated westerners is to jump on the side of the people and decry everything about the state. and as usual, whether we're talking about ukraine, venezuela, thailand, or egypt and syria in recent years... that's a mistake. i found some more reasonable accounts at places like human rights watch and amnesty international. the independent and christian science monitor also had more balanced takes. there's a democracynow interview with a professor that comes off as a bit of a maduro/chavez whitewash but nevertheless highlights the nuances of what's happening right now.

the bottom line imo is that students are pissed off, as they should be, because the economy does appear to be in shambles. i don't believe economic policy is strictly to blame but i don't have the background to take a strong stand on that.

a major mistake is to presume supposed "leaders" -- i'm specifically talking about leopoldo lopez now -- are the good guys fighting the big bad commie takeover government (that won substantially in municipal elections not three months ago bear in mind). check into his background. btw, another thought to bear in mind, his party has been supported for years now by the american "civil society funding" initiatives, which is code for foreign electioneering by the NED and its republican (i think) counterpart.

as for lopez' imprisonment, nobody has any idea right now if the charges against him, which range from inciting murder to arson, are backed by any evidence whatsoever. it's worth noting that when he turned himself in, a week after the government issued its warrant (and he wasn't hiding), he was joined by thousands of supporters, and actually given a megaphone to address them before he was taken away.

i think accusations of government repression are overblown. i read the word totalitarian in one article, which is completely disrespectful to the people who actually were forced to live under such a regime. the media takeover is apparently also somewhat distorted in the western media. the colombian station (supposedly one of the few anti-govt stations left) was taken off the airways recently. but as to maduro owning and operating or coercing every media outlet in the country... it's farfetched. heres a publication by jimmy carter's org that details the media as of the presidential election back in april. worth a look.

the maduro government is not responding as it should. he issued a declaration that all violent action against nonviolent protest will be acted upon by his own forced... but police, national armies, and paramilitaries which i know nothing about (and nobody else seems to either) are acting on their own accord. there are realities here on the ground, from the past many years, that need to be addressed. progress has been made since chavez came into power, that much is undeniable, but these students need to get a personal and genuine response from their president. i sincerely hope he brings it. and i sincerely hope they (the protesters) aren't usurped by leaders with ulterior motives that will unquestionably lead to even more dissatisfaction.

Sorry, Ridonks, but most of your post is fairly misguided. While I do agree with some of your points, others do come across a bit naive.

Students (but not only them) are pissed of, and rightfully so, because a potentially wealthy country is going down the shitter due to corruption and incompetence. Economic policy is indeed to blame. Their minister of finance used to be an old-school communist up until recently (Giordani). They've robbed the country blind of its means of production by confiscating private companies who wouldn't bend to their desires. Those once succesful businesses have been completely run to the ground, to the point they currently have to import an overwhelming majority of what they consume. In a country that depends on oil income, that's an extremely risky position to hold. To make it worse, their currency is pegged to the dollar, so people and businesses can't freely buy dollars to finance their imports, which has led to the extreme shortage of basic goods they have.
On top of all that, the Government is extremely corrupt. They are robbing the country blind, plain and simple. To give you an example,years ago, some foreign independent reporters traced accounts in some Swiss banks to Diosdado Cabello, one of PSUV's main leaders, in excess of USD21M. Imagine how much he has by now. And that's just one case.

Then you also have the state-sponsored paramilitary groups, the mindblowing murder rates, the tolerance towards FARC and ELN terrorists operating in Venezuela, the Cuban interference in their national affairs...

Regarding the elections you mentioned, it was proven beyond doubt that the results were rigged by PSUV, I thought that was common knowledge. Nobody from the opposition acknowledged the results. They demanded for the results to be independently audited, and then the electoral commision enacted a ridiculous charade. There is no separation of powers in Venezuela, the PSUV permeates all and rules all.
I'm not sold on Leopoldo Lopez as a leader either. Capriles looks like the perfect guy to lead the country out of the shadows, and he should be doing that now if not for the massive electoral fraud.

People have been passive long enough, but they are tired and they want a change. I don't know how it will end, but at least is something.

Last edited by Lebowsky : 02-20-2014 at 07:26 PM.
Lebowsky is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2014, 07:35 PM   #21
fsvr54
Bitch Hands
 
fsvr54's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 3,548
Default Re: Venezuela: The Game Changed Last night (some REAL S*** is going down there)

I'm part Venezuelan on my dad's side, I was born there.
fsvr54 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2014, 09:01 PM   #22
christian1923
NBA lottery pick
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 5,615
Default Re: Venezuela: The Game Changed Last night (some REAL S*** is going down there)

Damn that capped miss venezuala. What's wrong with these ppl
christian1923 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2014, 09:08 PM   #23
netsfan549
Good High School Starter
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 848
Default Re: Venezuela: The Game Changed Last night (some REAL S*** is going down there)

Do you guys see Obama getting in this?
netsfan549 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2014, 10:26 PM   #24
KevinNYC
Perfectly Calm, Dude
 
KevinNYC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 11,396
Default Re: Venezuela: The Game Changed Last night (some REAL S*** is going down there)

Quote:
Originally Posted by netsfan549
Do you guys see Obama getting in this?

Since this is almost purely domestic, I don't think so.

With the Ukraine, you have the situation of where the government wants to get close to Putin and the population seems to want to join the EU. We might do sanctions against them....we may even still have some in place. You would think that Obama would be on the side of the protesters and given our recent history with Venezuela, our getting overtly involved would discredit the protesters.

If you remember a couple of years ago when they were having the protests in Iran, folks wanted Obama to endorse one of the reform candidates. This probably would have been a terrible idea for the reasons this Iranian journalist lays out
Quote:
As the demonstrations grew, the two main opposition leaders—Mir Hossein Mousavi and Mehdi Karroubi—repeatedly emphasized that the protests were grassroots, peaceful, and unrelated to any foreign governments. And with good reason. For more than three decades, the Iranian regime has accused political dissidents of being American pawns as an excuse to suppress them.

After the 2009 election, when hardliners in Tehran faced a strong and unprecedented backlash from those who were fed up the fraudulent results, the regime claimed that the U.S. had orchestrated the protests. They made these accusations in order to demonize the opposition and to justify one of the most brutal crackdowns Iran has ever experienced.

If President Obama had publicly supported the pro-democracy protesters, he would have played right into the regime’s hands. The movement would have lost its authenticity in the eyes of a wide range of supporters, irrespective of class, ethnicity, or political beliefs. Remember that in 1953 the CIA helped overthrow the most democratic government Iran had ever seen; for years, the American government also helped prop up the corrupt and feckless government of Shah Mohammad Reza Pahlavi. It’s no wonder that people in Iran, and the Middle East, are highly suspicious of any U.S. political interference.
KevinNYC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2014, 10:38 PM   #25
MightyWhitey
Local High School Star
 
MightyWhitey's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: nYc
Posts: 1,074
Default Re: Venezuela: The Game Changed Last night (some REAL S*** is going down there)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dizzle-2k7
fukk you , war mongering , assh0le
Grow up. Venezuela is nothing more than a dictatorship that should've been torn down years ago.
MightyWhitey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2014, 10:42 PM   #26
MightyWhitey
Local High School Star
 
MightyWhitey's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: nYc
Posts: 1,074
Default Re: Venezuela: The Game Changed Last night (some REAL S*** is going down there)

Quote:
Originally Posted by oarabbus
Do you even know our history with Latin American countries? I really hope you do although that statement is stupid anyway.

Idiot.
Sure do know about it. And now the United States of America has another leader to install in power in another troublesome country. Or we could just bomb the hell out of them and teach them a lesson in Statecraft and human rights abuses.
MightyWhitey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-21-2014, 12:46 AM   #27
cuad
kings fan
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 1,359
Default Re: Venezuela: The Game Changed Last night (some REAL S*** is going down there)

USA sponsored paramilitary*.

We comin' for dat oil, Venezuela.

Last edited by cuad : 02-21-2014 at 12:49 AM.
cuad is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-21-2014, 01:08 AM   #28
Big_Dogg
Dunktacular
 
Big_Dogg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Doggville
Posts: 918
Default Re: Venezuela: The Game Changed Last night (some REAL S*** is going down there)

Quote:
Originally Posted by MightyWhitey
Grow up. Venezuela is nothing more than a dictatorship that should've been torn down years ago.


Funny how countries are a dictatorship in America's eyes when the countries leader tells America to go fu(k itself coz they won't give up the rights to their oil reserves
Big_Dogg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-21-2014, 01:17 AM   #29
MightyWhitey
Local High School Star
 
MightyWhitey's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: nYc
Posts: 1,074
Default Re: Venezuela: The Game Changed Last night (some REAL S*** is going down there)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Big_Dogg
Funny how countries are a dictatorship in America's eyes when the countries leader tells America to go fu(k itself coz they won't give up the rights to their oil reserves
MightyWhitey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-21-2014, 01:39 AM   #30
Big_Dogg
Dunktacular
 
Big_Dogg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Doggville
Posts: 918
Default Re: Venezuela: The Game Changed Last night (some REAL S*** is going down there)

Quote:
Originally Posted by MightyWhitey

Don't tell me you're stupid enough to think it was for other reasons
Big_Dogg is offline   Reply With Quote
This NBA Basketball News Website Sponsored by:
Reply


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 12:55 PM.






NBA BASKETBALL FORUM KEY LINKS:
InsideHoops Home
NBA Rumors
Basketball Blog
NBA Daily Recaps
NBA Videos
Fantasy Basketball
Search Site

FOLLOW US
Twitter
Facebook
















Powered by vBulletin Version 3.5.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd. Terms of Use/Service | Privacy Policy