Message Board Basketball Forum - InsideHoops


Go Back   Message Board Basketball Forum - InsideHoops > InsideHoops Main Basketball Forums > Off the Court Lounge

Off the Court Lounge Basketball fans talk about everything EXCEPT basketball here

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 10-31-2019, 03:12 AM   #76
MaxFly
Stylin' on you
 
MaxFly's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Boston, MA
Posts: 10,174
Default Re: Even at the age of 6 years old...we are still athletically superior

Quote:
Originally Posted by aj1987
Do you understand basic physics? 6 years olds, no matter what, are not capable of inflicting that sort of damage. They do not have the required momentum. I have nephews, who, as kids, took tumbles all the time. It's pretty much the same. Both are on pace to get into Ivy League schools. Didn't affect them, one bit. Not to mention the fact that they had injuries where they broke their noses, etc..

Again, I posted actual research which when into it. You're using an opinion as your argument.

From my article, which was ACTUAL RESEARCH:

When it comes to concussions, for 8-13 year old kids, there was a 0.067% chance of a kid getting a concussion.

When it comes to serious injuries, for 8-13 year old kids, there was a 0.14% chance of a serious injury.

Injuries in general, for 8-13 year old kids, was 0.26%.

The risk of actual injury for both tackle and flag football is a whopping 0.27%.

Again, this is not a small sample size. This is a sample size of 44,164 kids who played tackle football. Flag football pretty much doubles the injury rate though. Something which is still negligible.


As I said, kids at their ages (the ones posted in the twitter link) are not even remotely close to being able to hit hard enough to inflict actual damage. Basic physics and biology.

Please go through this article:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5305025/

I'm sorry, I missed this... I'm not citing opinion. I'm citing experts who both discovered CTE and specialize in studying CTE and other brain injuries.

Quote:
"Based on everything we know about CTE, Flag Football Under 14 makes overwhelming scientific sense," said Lee Goldstein, M.D., Ph.D., associate professor at Boston University School of Medicine and College of Engineering and principal investigator for the Brain study, in the release. "We will never prevent CTE by focusing on concussions. Any meaningful prevention campaign has to focus on preventing all hits to the head, including subconcussive impacts."

I'm not sure if you read my post, but I specifically noted that subconcussive hits were the real concern, not simply concussions.

Quote:
A Boston University study released Thursday provided scientific evidence that repeated hits to the head, even those that do not produce concussion or concussion-like symptoms, can lead to the degenerative brain disease chronic traumatic encephalopathy (CTE).

"We've had an inkling that subconcussive hits — the ones that don't [show] neurological signs and symptoms — may be associated with CTE," Dr. Lee Goldstein, an associate professor of psychiatry at the Boston University School of Medicine and the lead investigator on the study, told NPR. "We now have solid scientific evidence to say that is so."

So while the research you mentioned dwells on concussions and observable injuries, the research has moved beyond that. Also, I'm glad your nephews are doing well, but signs and symptoms of brain degeneration don't generally and necessarily present in young people in their late teens and early twenties. The concern isn't that kids are going to struggle early in life because they played football when they were kids. The concern is that while the subconcussive hits they receive when they are young don't produce any noticeable damage when they are young, those repeated hits will set them up for challenges when they are older.
MaxFly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-31-2019, 05:45 AM   #77
aj1987
MH!
 
aj1987's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 21,953
Default Re: Even at the age of 6 years old...we are still athletically superior

Quote:
Originally Posted by MaxFly
I'm sorry, I missed this... I'm not citing opinion. I'm citing experts who both discovered CTE and specialize in studying CTE and other brain injuries.

I'm not sure if you read my post, but I specifically noted that subconcussive hits were the real concern, not simply concussions.

So while the research you mentioned dwells on concussions and observable injuries, the research has moved beyond that. Also, I'm glad your nephews are doing well, but signs and symptoms of brain degeneration don't generally and necessarily present in young people in their late teens and early twenties. The concern isn't that kids are going to struggle early in life because they played football when they were kids. The concern is that while the subconcussive hits they receive when they are young don't produce any noticeable damage when they are young, those repeated hits will set them up for challenges when they are older.
From the article you cited:

"Researchers examined the postmortem brains of four male athletes ages 17-18..."

Also, unless I'm completely misunderstanding your source, those brains were obtained from kids who passed away a day to four months. I wonder what their actual injuries were.

We're talking about youth football. Not JV or Varsity football.

"The risk of actual injury for both tackle and flag football is a whopping 0.27%."

Last edited by aj1987 : 10-31-2019 at 05:49 AM.
aj1987 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-31-2019, 02:32 PM   #78
MaxFly
Stylin' on you
 
MaxFly's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Boston, MA
Posts: 10,174
Default Re: Even at the age of 6 years old...we are still athletically superior

Quote:
Originally Posted by aj1987
From the article you cited:

"Researchers examined the postmortem brains of four male athletes ages 17-18..."

Also, unless I'm completely misunderstanding your source, those brains were obtained from kids who passed away a day to four months. I wonder what their actual injuries were.

CTE develops over time. It requires repeated hits over time of both a concusive and subconcussive nature for brains to have and show the plaque buildup.

Quote:
"The risk of actual injury for both tackle and flag football is a whopping 0.27%."

We don't reliably measure sub concussive hits as injuries because they don't present as injuries on the field. The damage from those sorts of hits isn't perceptible, and they add up over time.
MaxFly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-04-2019, 02:30 AM   #79
aj1987
MH!
 
aj1987's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 21,953
Default Re: Even at the age of 6 years old...we are still athletically superior

Quote:
Originally Posted by MaxFly
CTE develops over time. It requires repeated hits over time of both a concusive and subconcussive nature for brains to have and show the plaque buildup.
Again, go back and read what I posted. We're talking about 6 year olds here. Also, try going through the research that I posted.


Quote:
Originally Posted by MaxFly
We don't reliably measure sub concussive hits as injuries because they don't present as injuries on the field. The damage from those sorts of hits isn't perceptible, and they add up over time.
Except for that fact that we do.

Read:

"The risk of actual injury for both tackle and flag football is a whopping 0.27%."

So, there's a 0.27% chance of ANY injury in youth football.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5305025/
aj1987 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-04-2019, 11:39 AM   #80
MaxFly
Stylin' on you
 
MaxFly's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Boston, MA
Posts: 10,174
Default Re: Even at the age of 6 years old...we are still athletically superior

Quote:
Originally Posted by aj1987
Again, go back and read what I posted. We're talking about 6 year olds here. Also, try going through the research that I posted.



Except for that fact that we do.

Read:

"The risk of actual injury for both tackle and flag football is a whopping 0.27%."

So, there's a 0.27% chance of ANY injury in youth football.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5305025/

Ok, so how do we measure sub-concussive hits. What scale do they use as an assessment when there is no noticeable dizziness or disorientation from a hit.
MaxFly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-04-2019, 05:04 PM   #81
aj1987
MH!
 
aj1987's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 21,953
Default Re: Even at the age of 6 years old...we are still athletically superior

Quote:
Originally Posted by MaxFly
Ok, so how do we measure sub-concussive hits. What scale do they use as an assessment when there is no noticeable dizziness or disorientation from a hit.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5305025/

READ. It really isn't that long.



"Contact injuries were defined as any injury sustained due to impact with another player, regardless of whether the injury occurred while playing flag or tackle football. An injury was considered noncontact if it occurred without an external force exhibited by another player, such as those experienced during a running drill. An injury was considered severe if it resulted in a concussion, fracture, or ligament tear. All other injuries were considered nonsevere. The leagues encouraged their teams to use the International Consensus Statement Guidelines for Sport-Related Concussion."

In short, even sprains, tears, and other possible non-contact relates injuries are considered overall.

Including all those, the probability of a kid injuring himself was .27%.

Among those injuries, 27%-35% of the injuries were fractures.

Another quote:

"...sprains, strains, and contusions, have suffered from more variability in reporting, with 9% to 69% of reported injuries being sprains, strains, and contusions."


Supporting my initial statement:

"Players in grades 7 and 8 have almost twice the injury risk when compared with players in grades 4, 5, and 6."

" In studies in which athlete-exposures were measured, the injury risk in older and more experienced athletes could be attributed to the more experienced players’ increased playing time."

"Additionally, Daniel et al recently reported on accelerometer-instrumented helmet-based measurements of collisions during youth football. Youth football players experienced fewer impacts per season. On average, these collisions were less forceful than those in high school and collegiate athletes. However, the top 5% of reported collisions were almost as forceful as the highest-force collisions seen in high school and collegiate players. Most of the highest-force impacts occurred during practice rather than during a game."


As I said in my initial post, it's basic science. A 6 year old kid is not going to have enough momentum to actually cause damage to his opponent.
aj1987 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-04-2019, 05:58 PM   #82
nightlight
I usually hit open layups
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 179
Default Re: Even at the age of 6 years old...we are still athletically superior

Quote:
Originally Posted by aj1987


As I said in my initial post, it's basic science.
You're a moron. There's nothing scientific about cherrypicking to support your predetermined conclusion.
nightlight is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-04-2019, 06:16 PM   #83
aj1987
MH!
 
aj1987's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 21,953
Default Re: Even at the age of 6 years old...we are still athletically superior

Quote:
Originally Posted by nightlight
You're a moron. There's nothing scientific about cherrypicking to support your predetermined conclusion.
Cherrypicking? What was I cherrypicking, you braindead subhuman cunt?
aj1987 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-05-2019, 04:29 AM   #84
MaxFly
Stylin' on you
 
MaxFly's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Boston, MA
Posts: 10,174
Default Re: Even at the age of 6 years old...we are still athletically superior

Quote:
Originally Posted by aj1987
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5305025/

READ. It really isn't that long.

"Contact injuries were defined as any injury sustained due to impact with another player, regardless of whether the injury occurred while playing flag or tackle football. An injury was considered noncontact if it occurred without an external force exhibited by another player, such as those experienced during a running drill. An injury was considered severe if it resulted in a concussion, fracture, or ligament tear. All other injuries were considered nonsevere. The leagues encouraged their teams to use the International Consensus Statement Guidelines for Sport-Related Concussion."

In short, even sprains, tears, and other possible non-contact relates injuries are considered overall.

Including all those, the probability of a kid injuring himself was .27%.

Among those injuries, 27%-35% of the injuries were fractures.

So I'm going to ask you again more directly. I'm just looking for a yes or no.

When a player gets hit during the course of a game, and gets up without showing signs of dizziness, disorientation, or any other injury, including a sprain, tear or fracture, is any injury recorded?
MaxFly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-05-2019, 05:18 AM   #85
MrFonzworth
Data Pagan
 
MrFonzworth's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Data Pagan
Posts: 10,633
Default Re: Even at the age of 6 years old...we are still athletically superior

This thread is about Asian women. Why are you talking about brain damage?
MrFonzworth is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-05-2019, 01:51 PM   #86
aj1987
MH!
 
aj1987's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 21,953
Default Re: Even at the age of 6 years old...we are still athletically superior

Quote:
Originally Posted by MaxFly
So I'm going to ask you again more directly. I'm just looking for a yes or no.

When a player gets hit during the course of a game, and gets up without showing signs of dizziness, disorientation, or any other injury, including a sprain, tear or fracture, is any injury recorded?


Since you obviously can't or won't read, yes.
aj1987 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-05-2019, 02:58 PM   #87
MaxFly
Stylin' on you
 
MaxFly's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Boston, MA
Posts: 10,174
Default Re: Even at the age of 6 years old...we are still athletically superior

Quote:
Originally Posted by aj1987


Since you obviously can't or won't read, yes.

No, I read. Maybe I missed something.

What injury is reported when a player suffers no noticeable injury and does not suffer from any dizziness or disorientation after a hit. So a player takes a good hit on 2nd down, but pops right back up and is ready for 3rd down right away. What injury do people on the sidelines record?
MaxFly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-05-2019, 07:33 PM   #88
Pushxx
Out here
 
Pushxx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Cape Cod, MA
Posts: 5,433
Default Re: Even at the age of 6 years old...we are still athletically superior

Quote:
Originally Posted by dude77
wtf would you have your 6 yr old doing this shit ? god damn people are ****ing stupid

I know what the **** how are there this many parents that don't give a **** about their children?
Pushxx is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-19-2019, 01:33 PM   #89
aj1987
MH!
 
aj1987's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 21,953
Default Re: Even at the age of 6 years old...we are still athletically superior

Quote:
Originally Posted by MaxFly
No, I read. Maybe I missed something.

What injury is reported when a player suffers no noticeable injury and does not suffer from any dizziness or disorientation after a hit. So a player takes a good hit on 2nd down, but pops right back up and is ready for 3rd down right away. What injury do people on the sidelines record?
Why don't you email them and ask them?

Here's the link to the article:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5305025/

I PROVED my statement to be a fact. Now, you can either hold the L and move on continue with shifting the goalposts.
aj1987 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-20-2019, 12:09 PM   #90
sd3035
Impartial NBA analyst
 
sd3035's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 7,814
Default Re: Even at the age of 6 years old...we are still athletically superior

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shogon
If you accept that there are athletic genetic differences, you must accept that there are intellectual genetic differences.

And yes, asians are smarter than whites.

However, I'm pretty sure that whites are more spatially aware, they're more athletic, and they have much higher levels of empathy.

People in China literally run people over repeatedly after accidentally hitting them with their cars... because it's cheaper.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U9h0mNzjSIk


Asians are not smarter, they just score better on math tests because they're forced to study like 7 hours per day outside of regular school

Asians are a close seconds behind whites though
sd3035 is offline   Reply With Quote
This NBA Basketball News Website Sponsored by:




Reply


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 06:36 PM.






NBA BASKETBALL FORUM KEY LINKS:

InsideHoops.com Home

NBA Rumors

Basketball Blog

NBA Daily Roundup

NBA Scores

NBA Stats

NBA Videos

NBA Free Agents

Fantasy Basketball

Basketball Sneakers

Search Site

STAY CONNECTED
Twitter
Facebook
Instagram
YouTube
















Powered by vBulletin Version 3.5.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd. Terms of Use/Service | Privacy Policy