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Old 09-12-2014, 09:08 PM   #16
NumberSix
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Default Re: McDonald's workers in Denmark make 20 am hour but big Mac price nearly same

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Originally Posted by secund2nun
McDonald's makes billion and billion a year, but because they don't pay their employees enough the employees get public assistance like welfare... So in other words the tax payers pay instead of McDonald's.... Hmmm let McDonald's spend the billions they make or make the tax payers pay the McDonald's employees because McDonald's doesn't want to pay them enough.

This type of mentality is why most American workers., not just min wage ones, are grossly underpaid and have no benefits. This applies to the middle class as well.
I would disagree.

In my opinion, the reason why some corporations are able to get away with paying employees BELOW market value is specifically because of things like government agreeing to subsidize the difference of what the corporation won't pay.

Think of it like this. If you got your below market value wage from McDonald's but then there was no benefit from the government, people would say to themselves "McDonald's doesn't pay enough. I'm not willing to work for that little money". That's market value. You have to pay what people are willing to work for. If people aren't willing to work for what you're offering, you have to offer more. Government agreeing to pay the rest is exactly why McDonald's can afford to pay employees less than they are worth.

If you started a business, and people were only willing to work for your business at $20 an hour, that's the market value. If I agreed to pay YOUR employees $8 an hour out of my pocket, you now only have to pay your employees $12 an hour. Because I'm stupidly giving away my money, you now get to pay your employees less than market value. If I take away my $8 an hour though, you now have to pay the the full $20, or lose your employees.

The government is just enabling businesses to pay less than market value.
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Old 09-12-2014, 09:13 PM   #17
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Default Re: McDonald's workers in Denmark make 20 am hour but big Mac price nearly same

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Originally Posted by secund2nun
Spot on. Most Americans have been raised to blindly worship the billionaires and corporations for some reason even though the billionaires and corporations rape them as well as the rest of us.

Poor and middle-class Americans who continually vote Republican epitomize the useful idiot.
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Old 09-12-2014, 09:13 PM   #18
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Default Re: McDonald's workers in Denmark make 20 am hour but big Mac price nearly same

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Originally Posted by KNOW1EDGE
If it were really "every man for himself" here in America, then there would be no welfare, we wouldn't be giving illegal aliens drivers licenses and better rights than legal citizens, there would be no assistance, I wouldn't be paying for everyone elses mistakes and laziness.

Sadly, America's being destroyed by the liberal agenda

What liberal agenda? We have corporatist who work for the big banks and big corporations on the right and more corporatists who work for the banks and corps on the left.

Just because the media labels these corporate puppet politicians as liberals doesn't mean it's true. It's an illusion. Obama voted to give trillions in hand out bailouts to the big banks and corps. A socialist would have given it to the people. A socialist would have made a free national health system. Obamas system forces you to buy ripoff poor quality health insurance from private for profit companies. Obama appoints high level corporate employees all through out the government like the Monsanto exec to run the FDA. That is corporatism or fascism.
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Old 09-12-2014, 09:16 PM   #19
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Default Re: McDonald's workers in Denmark make 20 am hour but big Mac price nearly same

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Originally Posted by KNOW1EDGE
If it were really "every man for himself" here in America, then there would be no welfare, we wouldn't be giving illegal aliens drivers licenses and better rights than legal citizens, there would be no assistance, I wouldn't be paying for everyone elses mistakes and laziness.

Sadly, America's being destroyed by the liberal agenda
Do you think the chump change spent on Welfare is actually a big part of our spending? Our government gives more to banks and shell corporations, and all the tax cuts and loop holes for the 1% result in more money lost than all the social programs combined.

"America is being destroyed by liberal agenda". Please, did those Welfare programs cause the 2008 collapse?
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Old 09-12-2014, 09:16 PM   #20
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Default Re: McDonald's workers in Denmark make 20 am hour but big Mac price nearly same

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Originally Posted by ThePhantomCreep
Poor and middle-class Americans who continually vote Republican epitomize the useful idiot.
It's the exact opposite.

Conservative minded people would gladly say "if you have a job, you can't collect welfare". Then it becomes McDonald's responsibility to pay employees a fair market value wage.

It's the democrats that constantly want to give people welfare handouts which specifically enables a corporation like McDonald's to pay an unfairly low wage.
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Old 09-12-2014, 09:18 PM   #21
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Default Re: McDonald's workers in Denmark make 20 am hour but big Mac price nearly same

College education is free there too WITH an allowance. Europe is where it's attt
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Old 09-12-2014, 09:21 PM   #22
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Default Re: McDonald's workers in Denmark make 20 am hour but big Mac price nearly same

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Originally Posted by Graviton
Do you think the chump change spent on Welfare is actually a big part of our spending? Our government gives more to banks and shell corporations, and all the tax cuts and loop holes for the 1% result in more money lost than all the social programs combined.

"America is being destroyed by liberal agenda". Please, did those Welfare programs cause the 2008 collapse?
No, but the government certainly did quite a bit of market rigging.

Honestly, if I was in the banking business and my bank was one that didn't fail, I would have sued the government for market rigging. If your bank does bad business and fails, you go out of business. The ones that do good business stay in business. If you are a bank that did good business and your competitors fail, it is absolutely market rigging for the government to step in and bailout your competitor who failed.
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Old 09-12-2014, 09:24 PM   #23
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Default Re: McDonald's workers in Denmark make 20 am hour but big Mac price nearly same

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Originally Posted by NumberSix
I would disagree.

In my opinion, the reason why some corporations are able to get away with paying employees BELOW market value is specifically because of things like government agreeing to subsidize the difference of what the corporation won't pay.

Think of it like this. If you got your below market value wage from McDonald's but then there was no benefit from the government, people would say to themselves "McDonald's doesn't pay enough. I'm not willing to work for that little money". That's market value. You have to pay what people are willing to work for. If people aren't willing to work for what you're offering, you have to offer more. Government agreeing to pay the rest is exactly why McDonald's can afford to pay employees less than they are worth.

If you started a business, and people were only willing to work for your business at $20 an hour, that's the market value. If I agreed to pay YOUR employees $8 an hour out of my pocket, you now only have to pay your employees $12 an hour. Because I'm stupidly giving away my money, you now get to pay your employees less than market value. If I take away my $8 an hour though, you now have to pay the the full $20, or lose your employees.

The government is just enabling businesses to pay less than market value.

The government and big business are certainly in bed together. They do work together and big business is subsided by the government in labor as you mentioned. The Alliance should
Be broken up, but removing safety nets would just result in a lower quality of life. Places that have little safety nets like India China Mexico still have Low wages and no benefits..... But only no safety net. As long as the corporations control the government they would still have the edge. In a true free market economy wages would be competitive but there is nothing that can prevent a capitalist economy from turning into corporatism as the economic winners will eventually start buying politicians.
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Old 09-12-2014, 09:27 PM   #24
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Default Re: McDonald's workers in Denmark make 20 am hour but big Mac price nearly same

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Originally Posted by Mr. I'm So Rad
You do realize that you benefit from other people's taxes, right?

People act like the only thing tax money goes towards is social welfare lol.

Um.

My point wasn't to prove that taxes don't benefit me. Or that ALL taxes go to benefit poor, lazy people.

My point is, America's motto is most certainly NOT "every man for himself" -welfare is a prime example that disproves that theory. Along with the other things I mentiones, amongst countless others.
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Old 09-12-2014, 09:30 PM   #25
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Default Re: McDonald's workers in Denmark make 20 am hour but big Mac price nearly same

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Originally Posted by secund2nun
The government and big business are certainly in bed together. They do work together and big business is subsided by the government in labor as you mentioned. The Alliance should
Be broken up, but removing safety nets would just result in a lower quality of life. Places that have little safety nets like India China Mexico still have Low wages and no benefits..... But only no safety net. As long as the corporations control the government they would still have the edge. In a true free market economy wages would be competitive but there is nothing that can prevent a capitalist economy from turning into corporatism as the economic winners will eventually start buying politicians.

Ever since the Supreme Court allowed unlimited spending by corporations in candidate elections I realized they have even them in their pocket.

The whole system has been corrupted.
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Old 09-12-2014, 09:34 PM   #26
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Default Re: McDonald's workers in Denmark make 20 am hour but big Mac price nearly same

Quote:
Originally Posted by secund2nun
The government and big business are certainly in bed together. They do work together and big business is subsided by the government in labor as you mentioned. The Alliance should
Be broken up, but removing safety nets would just result in a lower quality of life.
I didn't say no safety net. Just, you can't collect welfare if you have a job. This is exactly why McDonald's and Wal-mart are paying just exactly enough that their employees can collect from the government.

That needs to end. Tell these corporations "no more handouts. You wanna stay in business? Pay your employees out of your own pocket. You gotta spend money to make money. No workers, no business."

Quote:
In a true free market economy wages would be competitive but there is nothing that can prevent a capitalist economy from turning into corporatism as the economic winners will eventually start buying politicians.
Sure there is. Right now, the system is based on corporations sponsoring politicians that will keep the policies that enable their market rigging in place. In an actual free market, there is no benefit to a corporation sponsoring one candidate over another. Government tampering with the market is exactly what gives corporations a vested interest in sponsoring the candidates that uphold the market tampering practices.
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Old 09-12-2014, 09:35 PM   #27
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Default Re: McDonald's workers in Denmark make 20 am hour but big Mac price nearly same

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Originally Posted by NumberSix
It's the exact opposite.

Conservative minded people would gladly say "if you have a job, you can't collect welfare". Then it becomes McDonald's responsibility to pay employees a fair market value wage.

It's the democrats that constantly want to give people welfare handouts which specifically enables a corporation like McDonald's to pay an unfairly low wage.

Yeah, because McDonald's is just dying to step up to the plate and pay their employees a living wage. Uh huh, you bet. They'd pay less if they could.

Why is it that conservatives rarely bitch about corporate welfare? The top fortune 500 companies (McDonald's included) received a combined $63 billion in subsidies just last year, where's the outrage? Where's the call for their "personal responsibility"? Why are social programs LIKE SNAP always targeted? Programs that mostly benefit children and the elderly?
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Old 09-12-2014, 09:38 PM   #28
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Default Re: McDonald's workers in Denmark make 20 am hour but big Mac price nearly same

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Originally Posted by KNOW1EDGE
Um.

My point wasn't to prove that taxes don't benefit me. Or that ALL taxes go to benefit poor, lazy people.

My point is, America's motto is most certainly NOT "every man for himself" -welfare is a prime example that disproves that theory. Along with the other things I mentiones, amongst countless others.
I didn't mean LITERALLY "every man for himself", obviously there are some things government does to help those in need. But compared to most developed nations, we have the biggest wealth/income gap, the most homeless people, the most individuals in jails. Even percentage wise we are on top of the list.

The government does more for banks and corporations then they do their own citizens. Welfare is nothing compared to the spending on those two. You can't concentrate on the minority and miss the bigger picture.
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Old 09-12-2014, 09:40 PM   #29
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Default Re: McDonald's workers in Denmark make 20 am hour but big Mac price nearly same

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Originally Posted by ThePhantomCreep
Yeah, because McDonald's is just dying to step up to the plate and pay their employees a living wage. Uh huh, you bet. They'd pay less if they could.

No, that's the exact point. McDonald's wants to pay as little as possible. The government paying McDonald's employees is the exact reason why McDonald's can pay as little as they currently do.


Quote:
Why is it that conservatives rarely bitch about corporate welfare? The top fortune 500 companies (McDonald's included) received a combined $63 billion in subsidies just last year, where's the outrage? Where's the call for their "personal responsibility"? Why are social programs LIKE SNAP always targeted? Programs that mostly benefit children and the elderly?
The government paying McDonald's employees with taxpayer money IS corporate welfare. Because the government gives these workers money, McDonald's doesn't have to.

Corporations shouldn't see a single cent from the government. But because the government tampers with the market, companies have a vested interest in backing the candidates that will carry on the corruption.

The key is, the government should completely stay out of the market. No subsidies, no paying their workers so they don't have to, no interfering, no loopholes, no bailouts, etc.. Just stay out of it.

Last edited by NumberSix : 09-12-2014 at 09:44 PM.
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Old 09-12-2014, 09:41 PM   #30
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Default Re: McDonald's workers in Denmark make 20 am hour but big Mac price nearly same

right wingers are so incredibly dumb, they go balls deep defending capitalism when they don't have a ****ing clue what capitalism is.

McDonalds workers are part of a corporation that makes 3 billions of profit every 3 months, WHO DA **** CARES THEY DON'T HAVE DIPLOMAS!

How much revenue do public schools do? THIS IS ****ING CAPITALISM, if you work on some corporation that makes MORE money you should be paid MORE.

But right wingers retards are the first in line against raises when it goes 100% against what capitalism is all about.

Seriously i would prefer my son to turn out gay then be a right winger.
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