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Old 05-02-2019, 04:19 PM   #16
DaHeezy
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Default Re: Chiefs did a great job upgrading defense

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Originally Posted by Carbine
Frank is at the top of the list as a second tier edge player.

20 Million + the draft picks was a disaster though.

He's better than Dee Ford at 21 mill. Draft pick didn't hurt too much as I think they pick they wanted was available where they selected. Thornhill is definitely the guy and the perfect fit.
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Old 05-02-2019, 07:36 PM   #17
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Default Re: Chiefs did a great job upgrading defense

No, you traded Dee Ford for a future 2nd round pick in a deep draft next year. That was a good move, not paying Ford that money and getting that draft pick.

That was all taken away by the Clark signing.

Give me a 1st and two second rounders and all that cap savings vs having Clark. That is the ideal situation to build long term success around Mahones.

Colts are a great example. Two years ago our roster was awful. Now it's going to be one of the better ones in the league and we have an extra second rounder to boot in the deep draft next year.

This Chiefs team has potential to be a poor roster in a couple years. Picks are just picks but the good teams sustain their success through the draft. Chiefs had an amazing amount of draft capital for such a good team before the Clark deal. Then they entered the next two drafts with the second lowest draft capital. Meh
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Old 05-06-2019, 08:41 AM   #18
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Default Re: Chiefs did a great job upgrading defense

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Originally Posted by Carbine

Give me a 1st and two second rounders and all that cap savings vs having Clark. That is the ideal situation to build long term success around Mahones.

When I made my earlier posts in this thread, I had forgotten about the fact that this was a trade and not a free agent signing...

Giving Clark 20m/yr as a free agent is highly questionable... giving a 1st and two 2nds for the privilege of giving clark a brand new 20m/yr contract is preposterously idiotic
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Old 05-06-2019, 03:35 PM   #19
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Default Re: Chiefs did a great job upgrading defense

Coming from Vancouver we have a ton of exposure to Seahawk games (against my likings)
But I don't know which Frank Clark you guys are seeing. Because the one I've been watching is an impact defensive player who is coming into his own and the best Seahawk defensive player last season (even over wagner)
Was too much given up? On paper now yes, but the word is still out on how well he progresses. I think he can be a Khalil Mack level impact player, and nobody thinks Chicago gave up too much.
The Chiefs got what they wanted. Thornhill was the guy in the 1st. Mecole was the insurance plan for Hill, but it appears Hill may not be suspended afterall.
The Chiefs made the best moves by letting go of Houston and Berry and trading away Ford. All 3 are overhyped at this point of their careers and ate a ton of cap. We got Honey Badger and now Clark, along with Ogbah and Okafor. Stellar replacements. the plan for Spag D is now in place. THAT is building a team for Mahomes.
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Old 05-07-2019, 02:43 PM   #20
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Default Re: Chiefs did a great job upgrading defense

I agree the Chiefs made the right choices in letting go of those three. Nobody is denying Clark is a really good player. He's at the top of the second tier edge pass rushers in the league. That's a hell of a football player.

It's the fact of they could have stayed mute. I think the 1st, 2nd and 20+ million in cap space is a much better avenue for continued success than Frank Clark.

That's 3 pretty damn good bullets to use to bolster the team in a number of different areas, instead of just 1.
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Old 05-08-2019, 01:23 PM   #21
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Default Re: Chiefs did a great job upgrading defense

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Originally Posted by Carbine
I agree the Chiefs made the right choices in letting go of those three. Nobody is denying Clark is a really good player. He's at the top of the second tier edge pass rushers in the league. That's a hell of a football player.

It's the fact of they could have stayed mute. I think the 1st, 2nd and 20+ million in cap space is a much better avenue for continued success than Frank Clark.

That's 3 pretty damn good bullets to use to bolster the team in a number of different areas, instead of just 1.

FA was pretty slim pickings to find a pass rusher. Especially one suited for a 4-3 D. And all the ones in the draft that could compete now were gone early. KC is in win now mode so we can convince Mahomes to stay, especially with the division getting stronger. The way I see it is we sacrificed the 1st round, instead having selected Frank Clark. We got our guy in Thornhill and the backup plan to Tyreek in Mecole. I think we should just play out how Clark does in the season. I feel he can be as impactful as Mack. In which all that spending was worth it. Look what Mack did with the Chi D. That's what we're investing in here.
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Old 05-08-2019, 03:22 PM   #22
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Default Re: Chiefs did a great job upgrading defense

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Originally Posted by DaHeezy
FA was pretty slim pickings to find a pass rusher. Especially one suited for a 4-3 D. And all the ones in the draft that could compete now were gone early. KC is in win now mode so we can convince Mahomes to stay, especially with the division getting stronger. The way I see it is we sacrificed the 1st round, instead having selected Frank Clark. We got our guy in Thornhill and the backup plan to Tyreek in Mecole. I think we should just play out how Clark does in the season. I feel he can be as impactful as Mack. In which all that spending was worth it. Look what Mack did with the Chi D. That's what we're investing in here.

Is Clark enough of an upgrade over Dee Ford to be worth giving up that many assets to acquire him? 1st, 2nd and a 3rd swap is a lot.. especially for someone who cost significantly more to re-sign..

Quote:
Clark agreed with the Chiefs to a new five-year contract worth a whopping $105.5 million
Quote:
Ford's new contract in San Francisco is expected to be a five-year deal for $87.5 million

Chiefs did get a 2nd back for Ford so it cost them.. 1st, 3rd swap and $18mill extra over lifetime of deal
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Old 05-10-2019, 09:01 AM   #23
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Default Re: Chiefs did a great job upgrading defense

Quote:
Originally Posted by DaHeezy
FA was pretty slim pickings to find a pass rusher. Especially one suited for a 4-3 D. And all the ones in the draft that could compete now were gone early. KC is in win now mode so we can convince Mahomes to stay, especially with the division getting stronger. The way I see it is we sacrificed the 1st round, instead having selected Frank Clark. We got our guy in Thornhill and the backup plan to Tyreek in Mecole. I think we should just play out how Clark does in the season. I feel he can be as impactful as Mack. In which all that spending was worth it. Look what Mack did with the Chi D. That's what we're investing in here.



Mack is a NFL DPOY, 3x first team all-pro (4x if you give him credit for winning the award at two positions in the same year (the second time this has happened in history NFL after Lawrence Taylor in 1983)), and 4x pro bowler (in addition to tons of college awards)... meanwhile Frank Clark's only personal award in his entire fucking career is making second team "all-big ten" way back in 2013

Last edited by Nanners : 05-10-2019 at 09:13 AM.
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Old 05-12-2019, 12:00 PM   #24
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Default Re: Chiefs did a great job upgrading defense

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Originally Posted by Nanners


Mack is a NFL DPOY, 3x first team all-pro (4x if you give him credit for winning the award at two positions in the same year (the second time this has happened in history NFL after Lawrence Taylor in 1983)), and 4x pro bowler (in addition to tons of college awards)... meanwhile Frank Clark's only personal award in his entire fucking career is making second team "all-big ten" way back in 2013

I said as impactful. I didn't say he is comparable to Mack. Frank Clark is a game changer in the right environment. Especially a D designed for him to flourish
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Old 05-12-2019, 05:34 PM   #25
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Default Re: Chiefs did a great job upgrading defense

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Originally Posted by DaHeezy
I said as impactful. I didn't say he is comparable to Mack. Frank Clark is a game changer in the right environment. Especially a D designed for him to flourish
Saying he is as impactful as Mack is a direct comparison to Mack


I actually do think the chiefs should be in win now over the next 3 years so I can understand the Clark signing. The number KC fans who all of a sudden are downplaying Hills importance to the teams success is hilarious
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Old 05-13-2019, 07:20 AM   #26
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Default Re: Chiefs did a great job upgrading defense

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Originally Posted by DaHeezy
I said as impactful. I didn't say he is comparable to Mack.

You dont win DPOY and earn first team all-pro multiple times unless you make an enormous impact

Quote:
Frank Clark is a game changer in the right environment. Especially a D designed for him to flourish

Frank Clark has played for one team in his 4 year NFL career... how exactly do you know what he is capable of in the right environment?

The Chiefs typically use a 3-4 and the Seahawks use a 4-3... how does this new scheme help Clark flourish?
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Old 05-14-2019, 01:11 AM   #27
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Default Re: Chiefs did a great job upgrading defense

Bears defense had playmakers on it already before Mack got into town.


Mack put us over the hump into an elite defense. I'm not sure Clark can do that on KC. Was he even the focal point of offenses scheming when they played Seattle? Or was it Wagner, Thomas, Wright before it got to Clark?
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Old 05-16-2019, 03:46 PM   #28
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Default Re: Chiefs did a great job upgrading defense

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nanners
Frank Clark has played for one team in his 4 year NFL career... how exactly do you know what he is capable of in the right environment?

The Chiefs typically use a 3-4 and the Seahawks use a 4-3... how does this new scheme help Clark flourish?

Spagnuolo is bringing the 4-3 to KC. Which is why they went for Clark heavy. Clark had a break out year last year in sack and tackles, now is on a front line with Chris Jones and good jobbers like Ogbah and Okafor. They've completely rehashed the secondary and imporved with Matheiu and Breeland and can move Fuller back to slot cover. This D is coming along perfectly.
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