Saying MJ would average 40-50 ppg today is BS

[Ne 1]

With all the factors in his favor in the 1986/87 season, he averaged 37.1. Pace was in his favor, ppg was in his favor, fg% and fouls were also in his favor. Scoring was up, no defense was being played, and whistles were blowing and he never touched 40 ppg. And please don’t mention hand checking. Pre-hand checking stats (‘80s to 2003) were higher than post-hand checking stats (2003 and beyond).

The 1986/87 season had the highest pace (100.80) in the last 36 seasons including this season.

The 1986/87 season had the highest field goal percentage (48%) in the last 36 seasons including this season.

1986/87 season had the 6th highest ppg (109.9) in the last 36 seasons including this season.

1986/87 season had the most personal fouls (24.5) and free throws (30.5) per game in the last 36 seasons including this season.

MJ mythologists debunked!

[Ne 1]

“Oh but scoring is higher this year so he’d average more!”

That’s not how it works. Scoring is higher per possession because of 3’s made, not increased pace or other factors. Pace, free throws, and fg % is down. 3’s are the great equalizer which contributes to higher scoring output. Jordan was a horrendous 3 point shooter and only benefited from it when the line was shortened.

So these “extra points” only applies to guys who can shoot threes. His production would be the same if not marginally worse due to his 3 point shooting liability.

[Lebron23]

“Oh but scoring is higher this year so he’d average more!”

That’s not how it works. Scoring is higher per possession because of 3’s made, not increased pace or other factors. Pace, free throws, and fg % is down. 3’s are the great equalizer which contributes to higher scoring output. Jordan was a horrendous 3 point shooter and only benefited from it when the line was shortened.

So these “extra points” only applies to guys who can shoot threes. His production would be the same if not marginally worse due to his 3 point shooting liability.

Great posts

[Full Court]

OP still in damage control mode.

Jordan is still consensus GOAT.

Lebron is still fringe top ten and a net negative.

OP is a Bronie fluffer.

[Real Men Wear Green]

I am sick and tired of people saying that Dave DeBusshere would average 80. Stop saying it.

[FKAri]

He wouldn't. But that's because he would absorb enough defensive pressure to allow his teammates to get easier buckets. He wouldn't need to avg 40-50.

You're right that he would need to incorporate the 3 into his game more just like everyone else does. I don't understand these hypothetical anyways because are we time traveling him in or is he coming up in this era? Most anybody time traveling in would need an adjustment period.

[AlternativeAcc.]

He wouldn't. But that's because he would absorb enough defensive pressure to allow his teammates to get easier buckets. He wouldn't need to avg 40-50.

You're right that he would need to incorporate the 3 into his game more just like everyone else does. I don't understand these hypothetical anyways because are we time traveling him in or is he coming up in this era? Most anybody time traveling in would need an adjustment period.

Jordan's fragile ego couldn't handle the social media era

So he likely doesn't make the league as he faces far greater competition and a much more difficult climate for athletes.

Born in this era hed be taking orders In a McDonals drive thru in Charlotte. I'm sure he'd average a lot of orders per hour.

[tontoz]

MJ was the only guy averaging over 30 that year. He was 8 points ahead of the guy in 2nd place.

[3ba11]

.

League-Wide Field Goal Percentage on 2-pointers

2022....... 54.1%
1987....... 49.0%

Spacing makes 2-pointers easier

So Jordan's game would thrive just like Luka, SGA and Giannis (bad 3-point shooters)

In addition to easier 2-point scoring, Jordan would be having a lot of shrug games with today's wide open kickouts and higher 3-point volumes - Jordan always shot well on threes whenever he had volume (more than 1.5 attempts)

[AlternativeAcc.]

.

League-Wide Field Goal Percentage on 2-pointers

2022....... 54.1%
1987....... 49.0%

Spacing makes 2-pointers easier

So Jordan's game would thrive just like Luka, SGA and Giannis (bad 3-point shooters)

In addition to easier 2-point scoring, Jordan would be having a lot of shrug games with today's wide open kickouts and higher 3-point volumes - Jordan always shot well on threes whenever he had volume (more than 1.5 attempts)

Sounds like a huge talent difference

Guys back then sucked and couldn't shoot, making it easier to stand out and 'dominate'

Talent and skill is what creates the spacing in the first place.

[3ba11]

Sounds like a huge talent difference

Guys back then sucked and couldn't shoot, making it easier to stand out and 'dominate'

Talent and skill is what creates the spacing in the first place.

Previous eras had lower efficiency due to different offensive strategy that resulted in a tougher defensive setup/format, aka no spacing.

They didn't space the floor back then, so scoring was harder - the lower field goal percentage on 2-pointers simply shows how crowded the 2-point areas were, while today's 2-point areas are wide open.

Players in the 80's and 90's were experts at converting 2-pointers ON DEFENDERS because the lack of spacing required it - so everyone had to develop their own unique way of converting on defenders, such as Kareem's skyhook or the unique styles of Magic, Bird, McAdoo, Gervin, etc.. Accordingly, previous eras were far better at 2-pointers than today's era - they had the same advantage on 2-pointers that today's game has on 3-pointers..

[AlternativeAcc.]

Previous eras had lower efficiency due to different offensive strategy that resulted in a tougher defensive setup/format, aka no spacing.

They didn't space the floor back then, so scoring was harder - the lower field goal percentage on 2-pointers simply shows how crowded the 2-point areas were, while today's 2-point areas are wide open.

Players in the 80's and 90's were experts at converting 2-pointers ON DEFENDERS because the lack of spacing required it - so everyone had to develop their own unique way of converting on defenders, such as Kareem's skyhook or the unique styles of Magic, Bird, McAdoo, Gervin, etc.. Accordingly, previous eras were far better at 2-pointers than today's era - they had the same advantage on 2-pointers that today's game has on 3-pointers..

They were far worse at 2's and 3's because they sucked and lacked the skills today's players have.

You posted the numbers, not me

They sucked. Defenses sucked too.


You fell in love with a primitive form of the game. Brute stiffs who were somehow smaller and weaker than today's players.

Garbage.

[3ba11]

They were far worse at 2's and 3's because they sucked and lacked the skills today's players have.

You posted the numbers, not me

They sucked. Defenses sucked too.


You fell in love with a primitive form of the game. Brute stiffs who were somehow smaller and weaker than today's players.

Garbage.

Today's players are better at threes because teams choose to shoot them, and they're better with a live dribble because they're allowed to carry and travel

the NBA also mandates no defense, aka no impeding and contact-less perimeter defense (no hand-check)

that's why today's defenses allow 5 more points per 100 possessions (league-wide ORtg) than 1987 when Jordan averaged 37... So if Jordan played today, most of those 5 points would go directly to him, and keep in mind that 5 is the AVERAGE - good teams will be higher than this and might average 10 more points per 100 possessions - again, most of this goes to MJ (if he was on that team)

[StrongLurk]

No one is averaging 40ppg for a whole season in this era because no one is going to shoot enough AND play enough minutes.

Harden got close but that's because no one else can spam high-volume threes and insanely high free throw rates like he can.

[3ba11]

No one is averaging 40ppg for a whole season in this era because no one is going to shoot enough AND play enough minutes.

Harden got close but that's because no one else can spam high-volume threes and insanely high free throw rates like he can.

Luka and SGA are getting 33-34 without threes and they're nowhere near Jordan.

So Jordan could get 40 without threes or with threes... Whenever he shot above 1.5 attempts, he shot well on threes, while Luka is shooting like garbage at 7 attempts with high turnovers..