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Old 09-10-2012, 01:30 AM   #31
DatAsh
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Default Re: #4 NBA Player Peak Of All-Time According to InsideHoops

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Originally Posted by Hands of Iron
I think he was the best defensive center since the Merger. I won't go so far as to encroach on Russell and Chamberlain's keepsake titles and claims of being 1/2. I hate taking the numbers at face value too in terms of scoring and rebounding although I find it amusing Olajuwon was a superior scorer in the playoffs (to Chamberlain not Russell) but then again Olajuwon always elevated his game come playoff time. I see people say he was a 21 ppg career scorer. Not when it mattered.

I actually have Olajuwon above Chamberlain defensively. Wilt's defensive peak was greater, but Olajuwon was a defensive force out of college and had to build up his offense. Chamberlain was the opposite; he was an offensive wrecking ball from the get go and didn't really become a defensive superstar until 64.
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Old 09-10-2012, 02:11 AM   #32
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Default Re: #4 NBA Player Peak Of All-Time According to InsideHoops

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Originally Posted by DatAsh
I actually have Olajuwon above Chamberlain defensively. Wilt's defensive peak was greater, but Olajuwon was a defensive force out of college and had to build up his offense. Chamberlain was the opposite; he was an offensive wrecking ball from the get go and didn't really become a defensive superstar until 64.
Don't know about that. In his first meeting with HOFer Walt Bellamy (1961) he blocked his first 9 shots just because.
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Old 09-10-2012, 02:24 AM   #33
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Default Re: #4 NBA Player Peak Of All-Time According to InsideHoops

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Don't know about that. In his first meeting with HOFer Walt Bellamy (1961) he blocked his first 9 shots just because.

Blocking a lot of shots does not equal playing good defense.

He wasn't a bad defender when he entered the league by any stretch of the word, but he didn't become all time great until about five years later.
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Old 09-10-2012, 02:35 AM   #34
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Default Re: #4 NBA Player Peak Of All-Time According to InsideHoops

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Originally Posted by DatAsh
Blocking a lot of shots does not equal playing good defense.

He wasn't a bad defender when he entered the league by any stretch of the word, but he didn't become all time great until about five years later.
When its man to man defense, it means its good defense.
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Old 09-10-2012, 03:30 AM   #35
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Default Re: #4 NBA Player Peak Of All-Time According to InsideHoops

Hakeem Olajuwon
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Old 09-10-2012, 03:33 AM   #36
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Default Re: #4 NBA Player Peak Of All-Time According to InsideHoops

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Originally Posted by L.Kizzle
When its man to man defense, it means its good defense.

Man to man defense is one of the least important aspects of being a defensive anchor though. Wilt was always a prolific shot blocker; he became a prolific defensive anchor.

Last edited by DatAsh : 09-10-2012 at 03:41 AM.
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Old 09-10-2012, 03:38 AM   #37
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Default Re: #4 NBA Player Peak Of All-Time According to InsideHoops

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Man to man defense is one of the important aspects of being a defensive anchor though. Wilt was always a prolific shot blocker; he became a prolific defensive anchor.
I know, I'm just saying it was man to man coverage when he got those 9 blocks on Walt. Considering Walt was the center avg 32/19 coming into the game.
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Old 09-10-2012, 03:41 AM   #38
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Default Re: #4 NBA Player Peak Of All-Time According to InsideHoops

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I know, I'm just saying it was man to man coverage when he got those 9 blocks on Walt. Considering Walt was the center avg 32/19 coming into the game.

I'm not sure what you're arguing.
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Old 09-10-2012, 11:14 AM   #39
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Default Re: #4 NBA Player Peak Of All-Time According to InsideHoops

It's very hard for me to see Hakeem this high and make sense of it, especially when most of the voters are so young.

When it was happening I wasn't even thinking of it as one of the greatest oeaks I'd ever seen. Honestly it was more of, "oh he was the one who was second best (by a huge margin) to Jordan". I accept that I like many underrated him at the time, but I just don't see Hakeem, even at his best, having a superior impact to a peak Russell, Bird, Magic or Kareem, all much greater players when you consider all the elements that going into an all-time great.

U think people are infatuated with the wide array of skills Hakeem had and the lack of limitations he had. That is what made him a superstar, but the game being so new to him (even in 1994 he'd only been playing for about 12 years) and his naturally personality being one that is more private and reserved really prevented him from being the type of force those other guys (Kareem aside) were in big games, close games and most importantly the biggest moment. As good as Hakeem was, I'd take those other seven guys over him without hesitation.
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Old 09-10-2012, 12:47 PM   #40
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Default Re: #4 NBA Player Peak Of All-Time According to InsideHoops

Kobe.
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Old 09-10-2012, 01:03 PM   #41
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Default Re: #4 NBA Player Peak Of All-Time According to InsideHoops

These votes are unfortunately always about who has the most fans. At one point it becomes Kobe vs. LeBron and their fans, and after that one is decided the votes decrease significantly. I mean, I never watched Kareem, but LeBron and Kobe have 7 votes combined while Kareem has only 1?

OP, I think it may be better to just not count votes for those guys up till a certain point, because if either of them gets voted in over Kareem, that completely ruins the thread, and it's actually a good idea for a thread.
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Old 09-10-2012, 01:06 PM   #42
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Default Re: #4 NBA Player Peak Of All-Time According to InsideHoops

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Originally Posted by Dave3
These votes are unfortunately always about who has the most fans. At one point it becomes Kobe vs. LeBron and their fans, and after that one is decided the votes decrease significantly. I mean, I never watched Kareem, but LeBron and Kobe have 7 votes combined while Kareem has only 1?

OP, I think it may be better to just not count votes for those guys up till a certain point, because if either of them gets voted in over Kareem, that completely ruins the thread, and it's actually a good idea for a thread.

I watched Kareem.

I still think Kobe 06-09 was as unstoppable a scorer as the league's ever seen. The only two players who ever matched what he was doing, were Jordan and Wilt and they've both been voted above him already. He was also a great defender, great playmaker and led his team to the promised land.
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Old 09-10-2012, 01:13 PM   #43
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Default Re: #4 NBA Player Peak Of All-Time According to InsideHoops

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Originally Posted by lakerspng
I watched Kareem.

I still think Kobe 06-09 was as unstoppable a scorer as the league's ever seen. The only two players who ever matched what he was doing, were Jordan and Wilt and they've both been voted above him already. He was also a great defender, great playmaker and led his team to the promised land.
That right away makes me not believe you. LeBron 2008-2010 was at least arguably as good as Kobe from 2005-2007, yet you put Kobe on a pedestal with Jordan/Wilt, making him bypass players like Kareem, Hakeem, Bird, Magic, Russell, LeBron, Duncan, and Shaq. I've seen 3 of those players in their prime (LeBron, Shaq, and Duncan) and all of them are either arguably as good as prime Kobe, or clearly better, but you seem to completely neglect that, which tells me you're likely to either have not watched the majority of the players I've named, or you're just incredibly incredibly biased towards Kobe to the point of being blind to everyone else's talent. Either way it doesn't make me respect the opinion at all.

I'm a huge LeBron fan but I'm not blind to the point of thinking he was as good as Shaq for example. Don't let bias determine who you vote for, because it's clear that's how it's going.

Last edited by Dave3 : 09-10-2012 at 01:18 PM.
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Old 09-10-2012, 01:25 PM   #44
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Default Re: #4 NBA Player Peak Of All-Time According to InsideHoops

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Originally Posted by KG215
How is Kobe already getting votes? He's got a borderline top 10 peak at best. If I looked at it closer, he might be in the 12-15 range somewhere.

LMAO

Peak player??????

And trying to say Kobe at his peak is not top 10???

Oh God ISH peeps you guys are freaking reaching.
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Old 09-10-2012, 01:37 PM   #45
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Default Re: #4 NBA Player Peak Of All-Time According to InsideHoops

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave3
These votes are unfortunately always about who has the most fans. At one point it becomes Kobe vs. LeBron and their fans, and after that one is decided the votes decrease significantly. I mean, I never watched Kareem, but LeBron and Kobe have 7 votes combined while Kareem has only 1?

OP, I think it may be better to just not count votes for those guys up till a certain point, because if either of them gets voted in over Kareem, that completely ruins the thread, and it's actually a good idea for a thread.

Dave3 screaming "Raise the draw bridge the Fanboys are coming".
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