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Old 07-10-2007, 05:04 AM   #121
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Default Re: Official #19 NBA Player Of All Time According To ISH

Steeeeeeeevve Nash!!!!!!
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Old 07-10-2007, 10:35 AM   #122
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Default Re: Official #19 NBA Player Of All Time According To ISH

Isiah Thomas or David Robinson. Thomas was hyper-competitive, while Robinson is oft said to have lacked the killer instinct. Although, the Robinson who played with Tim Duncan was more competitive than the more youthful Robinson, I think. Thomas is one of the few great players who I rather dislike how he acted toward the game. But, at least Thomas was inspiring as a player, whether inspiring to dislike or whatever, while Robinson didn't do it for me. Anyhow, I'm not voting for either here.

---

A couple people have voted for Bob McAdoo already, which I consider a stretch. He had a good run where he put up numbers that would place him among the all-time great big men, especially in Buffalo and New York, but some of his attitude problems became more apparent after he left that state. He was bad for Boston and Detroit--is the reason why Dick Vitale is involved in collge basketball now instead of the pros--although he finally made good with the Lakers and was a member of a championship team. I guess, until the Lakers, he got used to being the center of attention on poor teams.

McAdoo's MVP is also one of the most questionable in the history of the award. As many have said, Rick Barry was robbed. Players voted for MVP then, and Barry was hated by many, which explains why he came in 4th despite being a more complete player than McAdoo, as well as probably Dave Cowens and Elvin Hayes (the other 2 with more votes than him).

Furthermore, McAdoo was a dud on defense. Look at all these other great bigs left who did play solid defense: Dave Cowens, Patrick Ewing, Kevin McHale, David Robinson, Willis Reed, Nate Thurmond, Bill Walton and Wes Unseld (or even Elvin Hayes). I think McAdoo is behind at least a good share of those guys. The NBA at 50 voters felt he was behind all of them, except maybe Hayes, who also missed the cut.
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Old 07-10-2007, 10:45 AM   #123
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Default Re: Official #19 NBA Player Of All Time According To ISH

Quote:
Originally Posted by wally_world
Steeeeeeeevve Nash!!!!!!
HE's not even top 3 active player.s Don't be a freaking homer. He doesn't deserve top 20

CHARLES BARKLEY
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Old 07-10-2007, 11:22 AM   #124
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Default Re: Official #19 NBA Player Of All Time According To ISH

I vote for Bob Cousy.

Here's what I wrote at #16 where I nearly voted for him:

Quote:
The next point guard on this list should be Bob Cousy--not Isiah Thomas, John Stockton, Walt Frazier, or anyone else at that position.

Cousy dominated his position in his era more than the others did. He won an MVP for the 1956-57 season and probably would have won another in 1953-54 if they had an MVP then (he led the league in 1st Team votes that season).

Cousy led the league in assists for 8 consecutive seasons. Often he did so by very convincing margins. In 1955-56 he averaged 8.9 APG to 2nd place Jack George with 6.4 APG. In 1959-60 he had 9.5 APG to Guy Rodgers 7.1 APG. Moreover, Cousy's assists numbers are deflated due to the era he played in, as the game was played differently and assists weren't as generously awarded.

Cousy was also a scorer. He was 2nd in the league in PPG twice and was within the top 10 in PPG 8 times, and he averaged at least 20 PPG in 4 different seasons.

In the 1950s the second best player who would be considered a point guard today was probably Bob Davies, who averaged 14.3 PPG, 4.9 APG and 2.9 RPG for his career to Cousy's 18.4 PPG, 7.5 APG and 5.2 RPG. He was finally dethroned as the unquestioned best guard in the NBA in the 1960s by Oscar Robertson and Jerry West. Cousy was about 32 to 33 years old and had about 1 or 2 full seasons left in his career of 14 seasons. Back then, that was especially old for an athlete.

Cousy was a member of 6 championship teams, and some (although many of them likely racists) even considered Cousy the best player on a few of those teams. Honestly, it was always Bill Russell's team, but it's not as though Cousy wasn't a leader of that team and usually it's second best player.

Cousy was more influential to the game than the other available point guards--combining showmanship and substance--being one of the game's first ball magicians. He was an outstanding and creative passer and an excellent ball handler and dribbler for any era. And, he ran the fast break better than anyone in those days.

Then, someone responded that Bob Cousy played with more hall-of-famers than any other point guard. That explains the multiple championships, but Cousy did fine otherwise without those hall of famers.

Bob Cousy began his pro career in the 1950-51 season. I think there was only one future hall of fame player on the Celtics that season other than Cousy, and that was Ed Macauley, who of those of you who know of him probably don't hold him in very high regard. Bill Sharman joined the team the following season. These two guys didn't make Cousy great.

Cousy was a passing and ballhandling wiz in his 6 seasons before Russell joined the Celtics; he had 20+ PPG seasons, led the league in assists consecutively, and ran the best fast break attack in the NBA. They just lacked rebounding and a defensive anchor.

Cousy is one of the most influential and historically important players in basketball history--making the game more entertaining, as well as one of the greatest winners in NBA history, and he dominated as a guard in his era more so than any other guard has dominated his.
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Old 07-10-2007, 11:33 AM   #125
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Default Re: Official #19 NBA Player Of All Time According To ISH

Controversy
In the 1985 NBA All-Star Game, Thomas was joined on the Eastern Conference squad by star rookie Michael Jordan. Jordan wound up attempting nine shots, a relatively low number for a starting player. Afterward, Thomas and his fellow veteran East players were accused of having planned to "freeze out" Jordan from their offense by not passing him the ball, supposedly out of jealousy over the attention Jordan was receiving. No player involved has ever confirmed that the "freeze-out" occurred, but the story has been long reported, and neither Jordan nor Thomas has publicly refuted it.[2]

In the Eastern Conference Finals of the 1991 NBA Playoffs, the two-time defending champion Detroit Pistons faced the Jordan-led Chicago Bulls for the fourth consecutive season in the playoffs. The Pistons had defeated the Bulls in each of the first three meetings, but this time they suffered a four-game sweep at the hands of Michael Jordan and his Chicago Bulls. The series was marked by a number of verbal, physical, and match-up problems confirming that the Bulls were the better team. With 7.9 seconds remaining in the fourth game, Thomas and eight of his teammates walked off of the court, refusing to shake hands with the members of the Bulls.[citation needed] In the 1991 NBA Finals, Michael led his team to the NBA Championship defeating the Los Angeles Laker team in five games winning the series 4-1.

In 1992 Thomas was passed over by the United States men's national basketball team (popularly known as the Dream Team). Rumors have swirled that Thomas was left off the team because Jordan did not want him as a teammate on account of their bitter rivalry, which had begun with the alleged "freeze-out" and had continued through their playoff battles. Thomas also believed that his place on the Olympic team had been stolen by Utah Jazz point guard John Stockton. An angered Thomas complained publicly, and later vented his frustration by having a high-scoring game against Stockton. The next game they played, on December 14, 1991, Karl Malone elbowed Thomas in the head as he drove to the basket. Thomas needed 5 stitches above his eye to close the wound. Malone was fined and suspended for the incident.[3]

On January 24, 2006, Thomas and Madison Square Garden were sued for sexual harassment and retaliation by Anucha Browne Sanders.[11] Thomas is alleged to have made demeaning statements to Sanders as well as making sexual advances and repeatedly telling her that he was in love with her. According to court documents filed by Sanders, Thomas told Knicks cheerleader Petra Pope to flirt with the refs before a game with the Nets in 2004[12]. She also alleges that Stephon Marbury had sex with one of Sanders' employees.[13]

How did this guy get a Kennedy citizenship award?

isiah thomas honors...
Honors:
Elected to Naismith Memorial Basketball Hall of Fame (2000);
NBA All Rookie Team (1982);
12-time NBA All-Star (1982-93);
NBA All-Star Game MVP (1984, '86);
All-NBA First Team (1984, '85, '86);
All NBA Second Team (1983, '87);
NBA Champion (1989, '90);
NBA Finals MVP (1990);
U.S. Olympian (1980);
J. Walter Kennedy Citizenship Award (1987);
One of the 50 Greatest Players in NBA History (1996).

David Robinson honors...
NBA champion (1999, 2003);
NBA MVP (1995);
Defensive Player of the Year (1992);
Rookie of the Year (1990);
All-NBA First Team (1991, '92, '95, '96);
All-NBA Second Team (1994, '98);
All-NBA Third Team (1990, '93, 2000, '01);
All-Defensive First Team (1991, '92, '95, '96);
All-Defensive Second Team (1990, '93, '94, '98);
10-time NBA All-Star;
NBA Sportsmanship Award (2001);
Olympic gold medalist (1992, '96);
Olympic bronze medal (1988);
One of the 50 Greatest Players in NBA History (1996).

Last edited by SsKSpurs21 : 07-10-2007 at 11:36 AM.
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Old 07-10-2007, 02:11 PM   #126
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Default Re: Official #19 NBA Player Of All Time According To ISH

Quote:
Originally Posted by John Starks
Stockton shot the ball, passed the ball and stole the ball better than IT. IT did score better than Stock. the rebounding was pretty lame on both sides.

Not to mention that Stock passed the ball and stole the ball better than anyone in NBA history.

So you tell me, how can IT be ranked over Stockton?

I'd put Cooz in over Stock, but D.rob over both.

So this vote is for D.rob.

No he didn't acrewing stats individually doesn't mean that your a better passer...and he wasn't neither was he a better decision maker...decision making and not pasing is the most important thing as a PG...

John stockton was more durable and stole more balls than Isiah...that's all he did better.
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Old 11-18-2007, 05:18 PM   #127
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Default Re: Official #19 NBA Player Of All Time According To ISH

kobe
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Old 11-18-2007, 05:21 PM   #128
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Default Re: Official #19 NBA Player Of All Time According To ISH

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Originally Posted by YAWN
kobe
Why did you bump such an old thread??
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Old 11-19-2007, 11:45 AM   #129
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Default Re: Official #19 NBA Player Of All Time According To ISH

i gotta give it to stockton...
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Old 11-19-2007, 11:49 AM   #130
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Default Re: Official #19 NBA Player Of All Time According To ISH

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Originally Posted by hito da god
i gotta give it to stockton...
Why are people still voting?
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