Margaret Thatcher RIP

[Balla_Status]

Actually, idiot, I identify myself as a Independent libertarian. Think small & constitution adhering government, free markets, and foreign peace.

No, Thatcher wasn't a perfect politician. But her vehement defending of liberty and the free market, essentials in a developed nation such as the UK, should not go unnoticed by people like you.

It's funny. He's trying to insult you by saying you watch Bill O' Reilly when he's using the same tactics (insults, inferred raising of voice) as Bill O' Reilly in this thread.

Also you can tell he's very ignorant with the Reagan and Fox News BS. But not after he tells you that you're ignorant.

All the people celebrating her death are those that have no jobs and do nothing as there are pictures of people celebrating during the day time.

[senelcoolidge]

England was a disgrace in the late 70s. Thatcher came in and took the country back from labor union thugs and made the UK relevant on the world stage again. She wasn't perfect by any means but she was so much better than what the left was offering at the time.

Very true. Future rep.

[UK-NJ]

As a working class northerner who's grown up around miners families directly affected by Thatcher's regime I find it very hard to believe I'm seeing people defend her. It genuinely beggars belief.

I think a lot of you would change your mind about her if you'd lived in England at the time. Well, that is unless you're all loaded & money's no object.

[FPJ]

WOW

Ive never seen anyone getting so much heat after passing away. In Liverpool they are giving free pints in bars, in Scotland and Ireland it looks like they just won the WORLD Cup. Argentina is celebrating too.

Funniest thing is that they wanted to give her a State funeral after all she did.

Fun fact: When she made that poll tax, the police later refused to arrest people cause 1 out of 3 people refused to pay it. A lot of people had it rough cause of her.

[rufuspaul]

As a working class northerner who's grown up around miners families directly affected by Thatcher's regime I find it very hard to believe I'm seeing people defend her. It genuinely beggars belief.

I think a lot of you would change your mind about her if you'd lived in England at the time. Well, that is unless you're all loaded & money's no object.

Sadly the mining and manufacturing industries in England, just like the US, were on their way out regardless of what Thatcher or any other PM did. The only reason they were still around was because the unions had the government by the balls. By standing up to the unions she helped speed up the demise but she also prevented the entire country from going down with them.

Thatcher haters are ranting like she was this autocratic despot who took power by force and ruled as a cruel dictator. If I recall correctly she was democratically elected 3 times by overwhelming majorities.

[UK-NJ]

[QUOTE]42 reasons to loathe Margaret Thatcher

1. She supported the retention of capital punishment.
2. She destroyed the country's manufacturing industry, creating the untenable situation Britain endures today whereby we import everything from either Germany, the USA, or China. Britain went from a world leader in manufacturing to an international joke.
3. She voted against the relaxation of divorce laws.
4. She abolished free milk for schoolchildren ("Margaret Thatcher, Milk Snatcher" being a popular slogan at the time).
5. She supported more freedom for business (and look how that has turned out).
6. She gained support from the National Front in the 1979 election by pandering to the fears of immigration.
7. She gerrymandered local authorities by forcing through council house sales, at the same time preventing councils from spending the money they got for selling houses on building new houses (spending on social housing dropped by 67% in her premiership).
8. She was responsible for 3.6 million unemployed - the highest figure and the highest proportion of the workforce in history and three times the previous government. Massaging of the figures means that the figure was closer to 5 million, and this still does not take into account those forced on to incapacity benefits.
9. She ignored intelligence about Argentinian preparations for the invasion of the Falkland Islands and scrapped the only Royal Navy presence in the islands.
10. The poll tax (an unfair tax levied equally on every member of society regardless of income)
11. She presided over the closure of 150 coal mines; we are now crippled by the cost of energy, having to import expensive coal from abroad.
12. She compared her "fight" against the miners to the Falklands War.
13. She privatised state monopolies such as energy and created the corporate greed culture that we've been railing against for the last 5 years.
14. She introduced the gradual privatisation of the NHS.
15. She introduced financial deregulation in a way that turned city institutions into avaricious money pits which led directly to the 2008 crash.
16. She pioneered the unfailing adoration and unquestioning support of the USA, prior to this support had been more bilateral and measured.
17. She allowed the US to place nuclear missiles on UK soil, under US control.
18. Section 28, a homophobic clause reading that a local council "shall not intentionally promote homosexuality or publish material with the intention of promoting homosexuality" or "promote the teaching in any maintained school of the acceptability of homosexuality as a pretended family relationship".
19. She opposed anti-apartheid sanctions against South Africa and described Nelson Mandela as "that grubby little terrorist".
20. She supported the Khmer Rouge in Cambodia and sent the SAS to train their soldiers.
21. She allowed the US to bomb Libya in 1986, against the wishes of more than 2/3 of the population.
22. She opposed the reunification of Germany.
23. She invented Quangos (shady government/private bodies with powers to influence policy but very little supervision)
24. She increased VAT from 8% to 17.5%, an evil flat tax on all.
25. She had the lowest approval rating of any post-war Prime Minister
26. Her post-PM job? Consultant to Philip Morris tobacco at $250,000 a year, plus $50,000 per speech
27. The Al Yamamah contract
28. She opposed the indictment of Chile's General Pinochet.
29. Social unrest under her leadership was higher than at any time since the General Strike.
30. She presided over interest rates increasing to 15%.
31. BSE (deregulation of what could be fed to farm animals).
32. She presided over 2 million manufacturing job losses in the 79-81 recession.
33. She opposed the inclusion of Eire in the Northern Ireland peace process, exacerbating the feeling of unrest amongst the Catholic population.
34. She supported sanctions-busting arms deals with South Africa during apartied.
35. Cecil Parkinson, Alan Clark, David Mellor, Jeffrey Archer, Jonathan Aitkin, corruption after corruption.
36. Crime rates doubled under Thatcher.
37. Black Wednesday – Britain withdraws from the ERM and the pound is devalued. Cost to Britain -

[rufuspaul]

It's very easy to talk about her policies favourably when you don't have any friends/family who were affected by them. There's a reason she had the lowest approval rating of any Prime minister since the war. 'There's no such thing as society' - yeah, and we're still paying the consequences of that single minded approach to this day. The further dismantling of the NHS by the current coalition is a nail in the coffin to one of the few remaining things that makes this country great.

How did she keep getting re-elected then? You blame her for the 79-81 recession but that was a world-wide event. Same for the 2008 crash. You blame her and everyone here blames Bush. The "manufacturing world leader" that Britain claimed to be was a facade. Do you honestly believe the industry would be a competitive world leader had Maggie bowed to the unions?

[Quote=George Will] She aimed to be the moral equivalent of military trauma, shaking her nation into vigor through rigor. As stable societies mature, they resemble long-simmering stews

[Rasheed1]

didnt she support the apartheid in South Africa?

I wont celebrate her death, but I won't mourn her because it doesnt seem to be much of a loss

edit:

She opposed anti-apartheid sanctions against South Africa and described Nelson Mandela as "that grubby little terrorist".

yep.. just as I remembered...

She is alot like Reagan with the way certain people worship him & try to revise history even though he did some pretty heinous things as president.

[rufuspaul]

didnt she support the apartheid in South Africa?

I wont celebrate her death, but I won't mourn her because it doesnt seem to be much of a loss

edit:



yep.. just as I remembered...

She is alot like Reagan with the way certain people worship him & try to revise history even though he did some pretty heinous things as president.

Reagan and Thatcher didn't support divestment in companies doing business in South Africa as a way to combat apartheid. The left seized on this as de facto support for apartheid. Turns out both were wrong.

[KevinNYC]

WOW

Ive never seen anyone getting so much heat after passing away. In Liverpool they are giving free pints in bars, in Scotland and Ireland it looks like they just won the WORLD Cup. Argentina is celebrating too.

Funniest thing is that they wanted to give her a State funeral after all she did.

Fun fact: When she made that poll tax, the police later refused to arrest people cause 1 out of 3 people refused to pay it. A lot of people had it rough cause of her.

Doesn't surprise me. I hadn't thought of this Elvis Costello song in probably 20 years, but it came back to me immediately. They are going to have to guard that grave. As vicious a song as I've ever heard.

Well I hope I don't die too soon
I pray the lord my soul to save
Oh I'll be a good boy, Im trying so hard to behave
Because there's one thing I know, I'd like to live
Long enough to savour
That's when they finally put you in the ground
Ill stand on your grave and tramp the dirt down

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9t4-zDem1Sk

[Rasheed1]

Reagan and Thatcher didn't support divestment in companies doing business in South Africa as a way to combat apartheid. The left seized on this as de facto support for apartheid. Turns out both were wrong.

it is support for Apartheid...


How do we generally show opposition to countries like Iran or Iraq?

we discourage people from doing any business with them and basically try to cripple them economically..

maybe they paid political lip service to denouncing it (maybe you produce proof of this because I havent seen it), but that doesnt fool anyone except those who want to be fooled..

even though I dont think calling Nelson Mandela a "grubby terrorist" is even giving off the pretense of being against Apartheid..

IMO she was a foul woman who gets idolized for her charisma at the expense of all the ugly things she did... She is alot like Ronald Reagan

[rufuspaul]

it is support for Apartheid...


How do we generally show opposition to countries like Iran or Iraq?

we discourage people from doing any business with them and basically try to cripple them economically..

maybe they paid political lip service to denouncing it, but that doesnt fool anyone except those who want to be fooled..

even though I dont think calling Nelson Mandela a "grubby terrorist" is even giving off the pretense of being against Apartheid..

IMO she was a foul woman who gets idolized for her charisma at the expense of all the ugly things she did... She is alot like Ronald Reagan

Oh yeah they were on the wrong side of history on that one. The congress actually overturned Reagan's veto on divestment (no small feat considering it takes a 2/3 majority vote). That angle just didn't jibe with their (Reagan's and Thatcher's) free market beliefs, and if there's one quality they both had it was sticking to their core beliefs no matter what public opinion at the time might be.

[KevinNYC]

Reagan and Thatcher didn't support divestment in companies doing business in South Africa as a way to combat apartheid. The left seized on this as de facto support for apartheid. Turns out both were wrong.

How was it not de facto support for apartheid? Their attempts to shield South Africa from international reproach allowed apartheid to continue for longer than would have occurred if had gotten on the right side.

Also Thatcher and Reagan overtly supported South Africa did they not? Reagan blocked UN sanctions against South Africa

[KevinNYC]

Oh yeah they were on the wrong side of history on that one. The congress actually overturned Reagan's veto on divestment (no small feat considering it takes a 2/3 majority vote). That angle just didn't jibe with their (Reagan's and Thatcher's) free market beliefs, and if there's one quality they both had it was sticking to their core beliefs no matter what public opinion at the time might be.

It had nothing to do with the free market. They saw South Africa as anti-communist and as, such, were willing to overlook other crimes.

See Pinochet.
See Mobutu Sese Seko
et al

[rufuspaul]

It had nothing to do with the free market. They saw South Africa as anti-communist and as, such, were willing to overlook other crimes.

See Pinochet.
See Mobutu Sese Seko
et al

Support for free markets would imply also being anti-communist don't you think?