Message Board Basketball Forum - InsideHoops



Go Back   Message Board Basketball Forum - InsideHoops > InsideHoops Main Basketball Forums > NBA Forum

NBA Forum NBA Message Board - NBA Fan Forum

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 07-20-2019, 04:20 PM   #31
3ball
NBA Legend and Hall of Famer
 
3ball's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 21,739
Default Re: When did Lebron elevate a team of unestablished/young players to a championship?

Quote:
Originally Posted by SouBeachTalents
You have the audacity to list Pierce, Curry & Durant when complaining about colluded titles
Again, non-ball-dominators have nearly all the rings, and most didn't need to collude

Otoh, ball-dominators have almost no non-colluded rings, and only 3 colluded

It's funny because you guys complain about comp when lebron was "compensated" for that by getting extra Finals chances via a weak conference, and his own super-teams .. it was on him to have the best teams of his era, yet 3/9.. so don't complain
3ball is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-20-2019, 04:22 PM   #32
SouBeachTalents
We aint, go-in nowhere
 
SouBeachTalents's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 15,333
Default Re: When did Lebron elevate a team of unestablished/young players to a championship?

Quote:
Originally Posted by 3ball
New top 15 based on the OP's logic and the notion that dominant wing > dominant big in modern era:


1. MJ
2. Bird
3. Kobe
4. Magic
5. Wilt
6. Kareem
7. Shaq
8. Russell
9. Duncan
10. Kawhi
11. Durant
12. Hakeem
13. Pettit
14. Moses
15. Dirk
How many times you gonna change your all time ranking list this year

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/sho...9&postcount=32
SouBeachTalents is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-20-2019, 04:28 PM   #33
3ball
NBA Legend and Hall of Famer
 
3ball's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 21,739
Default Re: When did Lebron elevate a team of unestablished/young players to a championship?

Quote:
Originally Posted by sdot_thadon
Boi, taking a team to the finals >>>>>>>>>a 1st round exit. I can't even begin to stress > enough. Mj elevated his team back to the lottery while lebron lifted his team to the point they couldn't get lotto picks. This is easy stuff, no need to twist your brain into a pretzel over.
MJ's 1st round losses happened in his first few seasons, when nearly all lottery picks like Lebron, Durant, and Kyrie REMAIN lottery by missing the playoffs

Also, you've said previously that the 80's Celtics = Spurs or Warriors

So lebron's Finals sweeps and blowouts prove that if he faced that caliber in the first round i.e. 80's Celtics, he would've lost in the first round instead of the Finals; he simply didn't have to face that caliber until the Finals, while MJ faced it in the 1st Round
3ball is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-20-2019, 04:29 PM   #34
RRR3
L3gacy
 
RRR3's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Yes
Posts: 25,946
Default Re: When did Lebron elevate a team of unestablished/young players to a championship?

3ball,


1. Why did you lie about retiring?

2. Why are you constantly changing your GOAT list? And not even minor changes either.
RRR3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-20-2019, 04:32 PM   #35
3ball
NBA Legend and Hall of Famer
 
3ball's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 21,739
Default Re: When did Lebron elevate a team of unestablished/young players to a championship?

Quote:
Originally Posted by RRR3
3ball,


1. Why did you lie about retiring?

2. Why are you constantly changing your GOAT list? And not even minor changes either.
It was a quick retirement and I bumped Wilt down below the goat perimeter players, but still goat of the bigs

It's always a fluid list as ongoing evolution tells us more about our past
3ball is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-20-2019, 05:00 PM   #36
Hey Yo
7-time NBA All-Star
 
Hey Yo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 12,130
Default Re: When did Lebron elevate a team of unestablished/young players to a championship?

Quote:
Originally Posted by 3ball
They were already stars, so lebron didn't have to develop their talent, or the team's teamwork to achieve favorite status (they were preseason favorites to win it all, and right before playoffs)
LOL @ not knowing the reg. season and postseason aren't comparable.
Hey Yo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-20-2019, 05:12 PM   #37
sdot_thadon
truth serum
 
sdot_thadon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 3,033
Default Re: When did Lebron elevate a team of unestablished/young players to a championship?

Quote:
Originally Posted by 3ball
MJ's 1st round losses happened in his first few seasons, when nearly all lottery picks like Lebron, Durant, and Kyrie REMAIN lottery by missing the playoffs

Also, you've said previously that the 80's Celtics = Spurs or Warriors

So lebron's Finals sweeps and blowouts prove that if he faced that caliber in the first round i.e. 80's Celtics, he would've lost in the first round instead of the Finals; he simply didn't have to face that caliber until the Finals, while MJ faced it in the 1st Round
You never seem to think any of these topics through bro. Mj led the bulls to lotto picks Lebron didn't as a matter of fact here's the picks each had after being drafted:

Mj:
11th pick in 85
9th pick in 86
8th AND 10th pick in 87
11th pick in 88
6th pick in 89

LBJ: 10th pick in 04 and never another pick in approaching top 10.

So basically your argument is mortally wounded on 2 fronts here. Mj not only couldn't elevate his teams higher than Lebron did in 07 but he also had much better draft talent added to his team.

Lastly just for shits and giggles if lebron were to have Mjs draft position in place of his own he'd have these guys available for the cavs to draft:

1 of :biedrens, telfair, humphires, al jefferson, jr smith, josh smith....or perhaps they take luke Jackson like they did that year with the 10th pick
1 of: bynum, granger
2 of: rudy gay and jj Reddick, sefolosha
1 of: thad young, nick young, belinelli
1 of: gallinari, eric gordon
sdot_thadon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-20-2019, 05:19 PM   #38
superduper
Le11th
 
superduper's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2018
Posts: 7,827
Default Re: When did Lebron elevate a team of unestablished/young players to a championship?

This might honestly be the best thread in ISH history
superduper is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-20-2019, 09:30 PM   #39
3ball
NBA Legend and Hall of Famer
 
3ball's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 21,739
Default Re: When did Lebron elevate a team of unestablished/young players to a championship?

Quote:
Originally Posted by sdot_thadon

You never seem to think any of these topics through bro. Mj led the bulls to lotto picks Lebron didn't as a matter of fact here's the picks each had after being drafted:

Mj:
11th pick in 85
9th pick in 86
8th AND 10th pick in 87
11th pick in 88
6th pick in 89

LBJ: 10th pick in 04 and never another pick in approaching top 10.

So basically your argument is mortally wounded on 2 fronts here. Mj not only couldn't elevate his teams higher than Lebron did in 07 but he also had much better draft talent added to his team.

Lebron beat his conference earlier because it was weak, but he couldn't beat the league earlier because he's inferior to MJ - the league is the proper barometer and it accounts for a weak conference

MJ dominated the league like lebron dominates the East because his skill allowed the best brand of ball movement basketball that yields the best teams.. So it didn't matter who MJ faced in the Finals - his Finals teams were juggernauts that would never be 3/9 regardless of opponent

Otoh, guys like Lebron/Nash/CP3 can't play the ball movement brand because they lack an adequate skillset to score or assist quickly in the midst of the ball moving... So they must dominate the ball to produce, which puts a lower ceiling on their teams.. This is why I rank players like Nash, CP3, and Lebron behind guys like MJ, Bird, and Kobe (the top 3 perimeter players of all time)
3ball is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-20-2019, 09:41 PM   #40
egokiller
The Mind Fvcker
 
egokiller's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Posts: 11,128
Default Re: When did Lebron elevate a team of unestablished/young players to a championship?

Quote:
Originally Posted by sdot_thadon
When did anyone else elevate a cast like the 07 Cavs to the finals?




oh the 2018 cavs......

Title of the thread says "championship" and you start talking about "showing up".

egokiller is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-20-2019, 11:16 PM   #41
sdot_thadon
truth serum
 
sdot_thadon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 3,033
Default Re: When did Lebron elevate a team of unestablished/young players to a championship?

Quote:
Originally Posted by egokiller
Title of the thread says "championship" and you start talking about "showing up".

i answered a stupid question with an equally stupid one tbfh. I'd have answered why'd you abandon your old account if you were the one asking. foh.
sdot_thadon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-20-2019, 11:19 PM   #42
sdot_thadon
truth serum
 
sdot_thadon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 3,033
Default Re: When did Lebron elevate a team of unestablished/young players to a championship?

Quote:
Originally Posted by 3ball
Lebron beat his conference earlier because it was weak, but he couldn't beat the league earlier because he's inferior to MJ - the league is the proper barometer and it accounts for a weak conference

MJ dominated the league like lebron dominates the East because his skill allowed the best brand of ball movement basketball that yields the best teams.. So it didn't matter who MJ faced in the Finals - his Finals teams were juggernauts that would never be 3/9 regardless of opponent

Otoh, guys like Lebron/Nash/CP3 can't play the ball movement brand because they lack an adequate skillset to score or assist quickly in the midst of the ball moving... So they must dominate the ball to produce, which puts a lower ceiling on their teams.. This is why I rank players like Nash, CP3, and Lebron behind guys like MJ, Bird, and Kobe (the top 3 perimeter players of all time)
You asked about elevation of a young team, well smart fella Mj was adding top 10 picks for damn near 5 years. Lebron just one. Let that sink in.
sdot_thadon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2019, 05:01 AM   #43
And1AllDay
College superstar
 
And1AllDay's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 4,521
Default Re: When did Lebron elevate a team of unestablished/young players to a championship?

Quote:
Originally Posted by sdot_thadon
When did anyone else elevate a cast like the 07 Cavs to the finals?




oh the 2018 cavs......


welp

issa wrap
And1AllDay is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2019, 05:02 AM   #44
And1AllDay
College superstar
 
And1AllDay's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 4,521
Default Re: When did Lebron elevate a team of unestablished/young players to a championship?

Quote:
Originally Posted by egokiller
Title of the thread says "championship" and you start talking about "showing up".



str8 alltin

dispickable garbage human
And1AllDay is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2019, 11:42 AM   #45
3ball
NBA Legend and Hall of Famer
 
3ball's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 21,739
Default Re: When did Lebron elevate a team of unestablished/young players to a championship?

Quote:
Originally Posted by sdot_thadon

When did anyone else elevate a cast like the 07 Cavs to the finals?

oh the 2018 cavs......

Lebron took 4 years to get that team to the Finals in 07'

And he didn't win the Finals - so he never elevated unestablished players to a championship, like the OP says

Whereas MJ elevated a group of raw, single-digit rookies to a three-peat.. two three-peats

So a pretty big difference
3ball is offline   Reply With Quote
This NBA Basketball News Website Sponsored by:






Reply


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 01:42 AM.






NBA BASKETBALL FORUM KEY LINKS:

InsideHoops.com Home

NBA Rumors

2019 FIBA World Cup

Team USA Basketball

NBA free agency

NBA free agents list

NBA Videos

Search Site

FOLLOW US
Twitter
Facebook
Instagram
YouTube
















Powered by vBulletin Version 3.5.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd. Terms of Use/Service | Privacy Policy