"I don't know my ceiling." -LeBron James

[Rose'sACL]

What facts have changed? Him winning a ring in a shortened season doesn't somehow erase all of his past failures.

it erased jordan's first round failures.

[Lebron23]

This

@Ripthekik's sock account aka IR Beast aka the douche bag from Taiwan.

LeBron is already a top 11 player of all time. If he wins his 2nd Finals MVP he will be a top 7-8 player of all time. And next season if he wins his 5th MVP and 3rd Finals MVP I'll put him above Shaq, Duncan, and Bird.

[ThatsGame]

What facts have changed? Him winning a ring in a shortened season doesn't somehow erase all of his past failures.

The season was shortened for all teams.

[Trollsmasher]

Lebron may not know his ceiling, however we pretty much have it figured out.

First off, he can not surpass Michael Jordan. Jordan's achievements, stats, global impact, what he did for the league, his iconic status, etc is just unobtainable for Lebron James. Lebron may have taken the Cavs to a NBA Finals, however he also got swept. This is something that the G.O.A.T would not have let happened. Jordan would of at least won one to three games versus the Spurs by himself. He might would of willed him teammates to play better and ultimately win the series. Who knows. What we do know is that he wouldn't have gotten swept, based on his past achievements/stats, etc.

Secondly, Lebron layed one of the biggest eggs versus the Mavericks in the 2011 NBA Finals. Certainly, for a player of his caliber, for someone wanting G.O.A.T status, this is highly unacceptable. Michael Jordan would of won that series by himself. He would of out played Dirk. He would of willed his teammates past the 2011 Mavericks. The trash talk would not have effected him. He would of played better. He would of showed the world why he is Michael Jordan, the greatest of all time.

Those two facts alone makes him lesser than Jordan. Not to mention the stats, championships, global impact, etc.

So, he will not and cannot eclipse Jordan.

Then we have the big men. Bill Russell, Wilt, etc. I wouldn't put him above those guys.

So, in the end, I think he'll end up above Kobe. It will be Lebron then Kobe, etc. But, that is if he can keep up his current progess, etc.

Jordan would be lucky to get that team into the playoffs.
Then he would proceed to get swept in the 1st round as was his good habit.

[bmd]

What facts have changed? Him winning a ring in a shortened season doesn't somehow erase all of his past failures.

Kobe, in one of his most statistically impressive seasons, barely made the playoffs when he was on a stacked team this year.

He failed.

He drops way down my list now.

[Doranku]

Kobe, in one of his most statistically impressive seasons, barely made the playoffs when he was on a stacked team this year.

He failed.

He drops way down my list now.

That "stacked team" put up historically bad numbers (2nd worst scoring output in playoff history) and got swept by an average of 15+ points per game. I think that's the opposite of stacked, actually.

But congratulations on bringing up something that has nothing to do with the topic at hand.

[HoopsFanNumero1]

What facts have changed? Him winning a ring in a shortened season doesn't somehow erase all of his past failures.

How does that disqualify the ring?

[chosen_one6]

Top 15-20 ever...needing wade and bosh to win a title hurts his case also choking with wade and bosh hurts his case. If he does get another ring with those 2 guys that also hurts his case. His efficiency will continue to be inflated as long as wade and bosh are around to take offensive load off of him, so that will help.... But i dont see him cracking top 5...top 10 maybe..small maybe.

Maybe not in your opinion but luckily this isn't a dictatorship where you're at the helm.

LeBron is 28 years old...he still has a good 6-7 years in him. That's A LOT of time for him to put in work. He's already top 15-20 now, what makes you think he's going to stay there?

A couple more rings, and he's vaulted into the top 10 regardless of what the doubters and naysayers opinions are. anything more than 3 rings and people will be talking about LeBron as a top 5 player.

His game is still evolving, he's still getting better, but these ni***'s can't take off their blinders to witness a great player when we have one.

[Rose'sACL]

Jordan would be lucky to get that team into the playoffs.
Then he would proceed to get swept in the 1st round as was his good habit.

that guy is a troll. he thinks lebron has same chance at improving rating as jordan. the fact is that last year's finals which ended 4-1 were the most watched finals since 2003 . keep in mind there was a celtics-lakers finals a few years ago. I don't have ratings for finals till 2003 so i can't comment on rating before that.

LeBron has helped NBA a lot in increasing viewership. During Jordan's time, market was a lot less saturated.

[DatAsh]

Except if you are gonna call them the same thing one would have to assume George Mikan would be the best center in the NBA. Which is just....absurd.

How good you are and where you are ranked are not the same thing. I guess you can call them the same...but then you need something else to describe who plays basketball the best.

I never saw Mikan play, but I've got no problem imagining that someone of his size and talent, born in 1980s, could be the best center in the league today. Mikan may have played in a different league than the guys that came 15 years later. The shot clock wasn't introduced until the very end of his career, guys like Sweetwater Clifton, Chuck Cooper, and Earl Lloyd were rare. Both of those are valid criticisms that should be taken into account when assessing his greatness, but ultimately, he still won 5 nba/baa championships as the best player in the league, averaging 23/13/3 on 40%

[Doranku]

How does that disqualify the ring?

When did I say that it did? Are you blind?

[HoopsFanNumero1]

When did I say that it did? Are you blind?

Then why the hell did you feel the need to mention it? It's obvious what you were implying.

[kamil]

Lebron may not know his ceiling, however we pretty much have it figured out.

First off, he can not surpass Michael Jordan. Jordan's achievements, stats, global impact, what he did for the league, his iconic status, etc is just unobtainable for Lebron James. Lebron may have taken the Cavs to a NBA Finals, however he also got swept. This is something that the G.O.A.T would not have let happened. Jordan would of at least won one to three games versus the Spurs by himself. He might would of willed him teammates to play better and ultimately win the series. Who knows. What we do know is that he wouldn't have gotten swept, based on his past achievements/stats, etc.

Secondly, Lebron layed one of the biggest eggs versus the Mavericks in the 2011 NBA Finals. Certainly, for a player of his caliber, for someone wanting G.O.A.T status, this is highly unacceptable. Michael Jordan would of won that series by himself. He would of out played Dirk. He would of willed his teammates past the 2011 Mavericks. The trash talk would not have effected him. He would of played better. He would of showed the world why he is Michael Jordan, the greatest of all time.

Those two facts alone makes him lesser than Jordan. Not to mention the stats, championships, global impact, etc.

So, he will not and cannot eclipse Jordan.

Then we have the big men. Bill Russell, Wilt, etc. I wouldn't put him above those guys.

So, in the end, I think he'll end up above Kobe. It will be Lebron then Kobe, etc. But, that is if he can keep up his current progess, etc.

Its 'Would have' , not 'would of'

[chosen_wun]

Ceiling is Karl Malone with PG skills.

[bmd]

That "stacked team" put up historically bad numbers (2nd worst scoring output in playoff history) and got swept by an average of 15+ points per game. I think that's the opposite of stacked, actually.

But congratulations on bringing up something that has nothing to do with the topic at hand.

It was a stacked team. Everybody was saying before the season that they should just hand the Lakers the title now.

Kobe couldn't be a leader and will his team to a title.

He drops way down my list now with that black mark on his record.