MJ was efficient because he was an elite midrange shooter

[3ball]

No, they aren't separated, so his true midrange superiority can mask and conceal the sloppy long two percentages, its not hard to understand.

We have the data by distance - and Jordan shot 39.6% from 20-24 feet in 1997, compared to 29.5% for Lebron this season.

take this L.. you have nothing left, and your argument was weak as hell to begin with

the stats are what they are - Jordan is the GOAT midrange shooter - best efficiency on BY FAR the most volume - it's simple.

[jstern]

Jordan's is the greatest mid range shooter that I've ever seen. And I wonder what percentage of them were fade aways. Which is why is probably the reason why his volume was so high.

[CuterThanRubio]

We have the data by distance - and Jordan shot 39.6% from 20-24 feet in 1997, compared to 29.5% for Lebron this season.

take this L.. you have nothing left, and your argument was weak as hell to begin with

the stats are what they are - Jordan is the GOAT midrange shooter - best efficiency on BY FAR the most volume - it's simple.

Yeah, according to data that wasn't collected until 97



I wasn't arguing his midrange efficiency in the first place you retard, I was nitpicking the stat skewing you were trying to pull by lumping long two percentages with true midrange numbers, get it together!

Also, MELTDOWN, LeBron has infected your mind, you purposely compared a poor shooter to MJ, conveniently ignoring Curry's midrange shooting from this past season, which was higher than anything Jordan has ever put up, FACTS!

[Hey Yo]

Not a coincidence that the "new 3pt line' was within MJ's range


"The 1995-96 Bulls are one of only three of the NBA's "All Time Great teams" who have a primarily perimeter oriented offense. The other teams were the 1989 the Detroit Pistons who won 63 regular season games & rolled through the '89 playoffs and the 1991-92 Bulls. Unlike the 96 Bulls the Pistons did not have a shortened 3 point line to help their outside shooting quartet of Joe Dumars, Vinnie Johnson, Mark Aguire and center Bill Laimbeer. The 1986 Celtics (Ainge, Bird & Wedman) would also have the potential to feast off a shortened 3 point line as would Byron Scott (1987 Lakers).

From 1994-95 to 1996-97 the NBA shortened the three point line to near the college level in an attempt to help offensive players score more.

A rule change like this would certainly bolster a perimeter oriented team that has the greatest shooting guard ever. In a great coincidence the new shorter line was just inside the outer rim of Michael Jordan's "respectable" shooting range. The Bulls' mega superstar (who had a career 3 point percentage in the mid 20's before the change) shot 43% from 3 point range in 1995-96.

Jordan also set career highs in 3-point attempts and made 3 point feld goals.

These career highs were nearly double Jordan's previous career highs. The shortened three point line was certainly an additional weapon to any team that had a perimeter based offensive attack and the 1995-96 Bulls used it big time. The Bulls' #2 star Scottie Pippen also had his 2 career best 3 point field goal percentage seasons with the shortened line. The increased 3 point accuracy of the Bulls' two brightest stars was also a help to the 1996-97 Bulls who won 69 games. The chart below shows an obvious correlation between Jordan's 3 point accuracy and the Bulls' win total.

3 point Field Goal Percentage:
Year Jordan 3 Pt. FG% Pippen 3 Pt. FG% Bulls Record
1995-96* .426 .374 72-10
1996-97* .374 .368 69-13
1997-98 .238 .318 62-20
_____

Plus add Kerr's 50% and Kukoc's 40% from 3 in 1996

Then add the league's best rebounder and 1st team All-Defense in Rodman

That my folks is a super stacked team who feasted on the "NEW" 3pt line

[CuterThanRubio]

Not a coincidence that the "new 3pt line' was within MJ's range


"The 1995-96 Bulls are one of only three of the NBA's "All Time Great teams" who have a primarily perimeter oriented offense. The other teams were the 1989 the Detroit Pistons who won 63 regular season games & rolled through the '89 playoffs and the 1991-92 Bulls. Unlike the 96 Bulls the Pistons did not have a shortened 3 point line to help their outside shooting quartet of Joe Dumars, Vinnie Johnson, Mark Aguire and center Bill Laimbeer. The 1986 Celtics (Ainge, Bird & Wedman) would also have the potential to feast off a shortened 3 point line as would Byron Scott (1987 Lakers).

From 1994-95 to 1996-97 the NBA shortened the three point line to near the college level in an attempt to help offensive players score more.

A rule change like this would certainly bolster a perimeter oriented team that has the greatest shooting guard ever. In a great coincidence the new shorter line was just inside the outer rim of Michael Jordan's "respectable" shooting range. The Bulls' mega superstar (who had a career 3 point percentage in the mid 20's before the change) shot 43% from 3 point range in 1995-96.

Jordan also set career highs in 3-point attempts and made 3 point feld goals.

These career highs were nearly double Jordan's previous career highs. The shortened three point line was certainly an additional weapon to any team that had a perimeter based offensive attack and the 1995-96 Bulls used it big time. The Bulls' #2 star Scottie Pippen also had his 2 career best 3 point field goal percentage seasons with the shortened line. The increased 3 point accuracy of the Bulls' two brightest stars was also a help to the 1996-97 Bulls who won 69 games. The chart below shows an obvious correlation between Jordan's 3 point accuracy and the Bulls' win total.

3 point Field Goal Percentage:
Year Jordan 3 Pt. FG% Pippen 3 Pt. FG% Bulls Record
1995-96* .426 .374 72-10
1996-97* .374 .368 69-13
1997-98 .238 .318 62-20
_____

Plus add Kerr's 50% and Kukoc's 40% from 3 in 1996

Then add the league's best rebounder and 1st team All-Defense in Rodman

That my folks is a super stacked team who feasted on the "NEW" 3pt line

Shortened three point line era NBA basketball is NOT legitimate!

72-10 was the result of a gimmick, the worst rule change the league had ever seen!

[3ball]

That my folks is a super stacked team who feasted on the "NEW" 3pt line

Anyone remotely competent knows that ALL teams used the shortened 3-point line, so there was no advantage to the Bulls.. So your argument is one of the dumbest...

Btw, a shortened 3-point line means there's less spacing - defenders cover less ground and contest shots better.. Less spacing means tougher basketball, which is why league-wide PPG and pace was slower during Jordan's 2nd three-peat than today's game.

Also, Jordan had to CARRY the Bulls offense while still being the best defender ever at his position - so the Bulls weren't stacked or a super-team.

You need 3 all-stars for a super-team and Jordan's Bulls never had that at any point in his career.. Rodman was 35 years old and his all-star days were long gone - he didn't make any all-defensive team in 1997 or 1998 and only averaged 4/8 in the entire 1997 playoffs, while not being a starter in 1998 playoffs.

[Hey Yo]

Anyone remotely competent knows that ALL teams used the shortened 3-point line, so there was no advantage to the Bulls.. So your argument is one of the dumbest...

Btw, a shortened 3-point line means there's less spacing - defenders cover less ground and contest shots better.. Less spacing means tougher basketball, which is why league-wide PPG and pace was slower during Jordan's 2nd three-peat than today's game.

Also, Jordan had to CARRY the Bulls offense while still being the best defender ever at his position - so the Bulls weren't stacked or a super-team.

You need 3 all-stars for a super-team and Jordan's Bulls never had that at any point in his career.. Rodman was 35 years old and his all-star days were long gone - he didn't make any all-defensive team in 1997 or 1998 and only averaged 4/8 in the entire 1997 playoffs, while not being a starter in 1998 playoffs.

1996 Bulls had the 3rd best 3pt%, 1st in scoring and the 2nd best defense.

2 All-NBA 1st team and 3 All-NBA 1st team defense with Rodman leading the league rebounds per game at 15.

SUPER STACKED after moving the 3pt line closer.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/...all_team_stats

[Dragonyeuw]

Not a coincidence that the "new 3pt line' was within MJ's range


"The 1995-96 Bulls are one of only three of the NBA's "All Time Great teams" who have a primarily perimeter oriented offense. The other teams were the 1989 the Detroit Pistons who won 63 regular season games & rolled through the '89 playoffs and the 1991-92 Bulls. Unlike the 96 Bulls the Pistons did not have a shortened 3 point line to help their outside shooting quartet of Joe Dumars, Vinnie Johnson, Mark Aguire and center Bill Laimbeer. The 1986 Celtics (Ainge, Bird & Wedman) would also have the potential to feast off a shortened 3 point line as would Byron Scott (1987 Lakers).

From 1994-95 to 1996-97 the NBA shortened the three point line to near the college level in an attempt to help offensive players score more.

A rule change like this would certainly bolster a perimeter oriented team that has the greatest shooting guard ever. In a great coincidence the new shorter line was just inside the outer rim of Michael Jordan's "respectable" shooting range. The Bulls' mega superstar (who had a career 3 point percentage in the mid 20's before the change) shot 43% from 3 point range in 1995-96.

Jordan also set career highs in 3-point attempts and made 3 point feld goals.

These career highs were nearly double Jordan's previous career highs. The shortened three point line was certainly an additional weapon to any team that had a perimeter based offensive attack and the 1995-96 Bulls used it big time. The Bulls' #2 star Scottie Pippen also had his 2 career best 3 point field goal percentage seasons with the shortened line. The increased 3 point accuracy of the Bulls' two brightest stars was also a help to the 1996-97 Bulls who won 69 games. The chart below shows an obvious correlation between Jordan's 3 point accuracy and the Bulls' win total.

3 point Field Goal Percentage:
Year Jordan 3 Pt. FG% Pippen 3 Pt. FG% Bulls Record
1995-96* .426 .374 72-10
1996-97* .374 .368 69-13
1997-98 .238 .318 62-20
_____

Plus add Kerr's 50% and Kukoc's 40% from 3 in 1996

Then add the league's best rebounder and 1st team All-Defense in Rodman

That my folks is a super stacked team who feasted on the "NEW" 3pt line

You act as though only MJ and Pippen took advantage of the shorter 3point line. Wouldnt that have benefitted other shooters as well? What you seem to be complaining about is the fact that the shortened 3point line gave another weapon to the most potent offensive player of his era. Had MJ only won titles in the shorter 3point line seasons it may be a point worth deliberating. Why it isn't is because MJ won 4 championships( the first 3peat) without reliance on the 3, an above average rebounder and defender in Grant, and just coming into Prime Pippen, and the 98 title was brought home by past Prime MJ with Pippen missing 38 games, and in the deciding game 6 against Utah complimented by the following 'super efforts':

Kukoc- 15 points
Kerr- 0 points
Rodman- 8 rebounds
Pippen- 8 points( injured back)

Why the amount of effort in bigging up the 96 Bulls for no other reason than to trivialize MJs greatness, when the 96 team isnt even the best version of the championship Bulls, the 92 squad IMO is and they by no means had superior talent to a handful of other contenders between 91-93, the difference above all else being that Chicago had the best player at his peak....and everyone else didnt.

[OldSchoolBBall]

Yes, Jordan is better than Curry at midrange. Why not show his 97-98 year?

43% from midrange.

Cracked knuckle and torn ligament on the index finger of his shooting hand ledd to him shooting horribly the first 15-20 games of the season from the field and the line until he adjusted his form to compensate. He shot ~41% FG/72% FT the first 15-20 games (the FT% especially is a dead giveaway for a guy who was a career 83+% FT shooter), and he shot 48% FG/83% FT the rest of the way

Why not his 01-02 season?

41% from midrange

Sliced ligament in his finger from a cigar-cutting incident just prior to his return with the Wizards (this is documented) coupled with both old legs/knees and not being able to get the spacing he once did due to diminished athleticism.

[/quote]

02-03 season

43% from midrange..

See above. But yeah, let's compare a 40 year old's percentages to a player's prime percentages.

There is ZERO doubt that 26-30 year old Jordan was at 46-50% FG from midrange annually.

[G-train]

19 feet is not midrange no matter how you want to spin it. Yes, Jordan is better than Curry at midrange. Why not show his 97-98 year?

43% from midrange.

Why not his 01-02 season?

41% from midrange

02-03 season

43% from midrange.

Oh, wait... it won't fit into the agenda.

Bringing up Grandpa Jordan stats?

[Locked_Up_Tonight]

Cracked knuckle and torn ligament on the index finger of his shooting hand ledd to him shooting horribly the first 15-20 games of the season from the field and the line until he adjusted his form to compensate. He shot ~41% FG/72% FT the first 15-20 games (the FT% especially is a dead giveaway for a guy who was a career 83+% FT shooter), and he shot 48% FG/83% FT the rest of the way



Sliced ligament in his finger from a cigar-cutting incident just prior to his return with the Wizards (this is documented) coupled with both old legs/knees and not being able to get the spacing he once did due to diminished athleticism.



See above. But yeah, let's compare a 40 year old's percentages to a player's prime percentages.

There is ZERO doubt that 26-30 year old Jordan was at 46-50% FG from midrange annually.

And other players haven't played through that sort of stuff? I mean, jut look at Dirk who has repeatedly had elbow issues throughout his career that has affected his shot some years. Just two years ago he had a stomach ailment that affected his shot for nearly half the year....Larry Bird's back that prevented him from shooting as well. Etc etc.

And he probably did shoot well from midrange. But you are just speculating from one year is all..... But let me throw a stat to you about Nash and Ray Allen one year.....

Nash can get a shot off from anywhere, at any time, and it will have a good chance of going in. Nash is “only” making 46% of his 16-23 foot shots, but he’s a master of the 10-15 foot range that most NBA players have no idea how to operate in: Nash averages one make from that area a game, and makes 56.7% of his attempts from the 10-15 foot range. I’ll also mention Ray Allen here — Allen’s shooting prowess is well-known, but the fact that he’s making 63% of his shots from 10-15 feet seems worth mentioning.

And that quote was not for the whole year... at the time of the article it was like 2 thirds of the games. Allen's took a dip I imagine but I doubt Nash's dropped that much..... by the end of the season.