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  1. #31
    Local High School Star Joey Zaza's Avatar
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    Default Re: Hakeem is not a top10 Player

    Just to address a few minor points (and just so everyone knows, Hakeem is at least as good as Shaq/Duncan and definitely better than Kobe)

    Quote Originally Posted by kizut1659
    In 1994, the Rockets barely beat the Knicks with already declining Ewing,
    Nothing declining abou tthat Ewing. That was prime Ewing at his very very best (which turns out was nowhere even in the same ball-park as Hakeem)

    Quote Originally Posted by kizut1659
    In 1995, the Rockets would have lost if Phoenix would not have chocked.
    This can be said about EVERY title--MJ wouldn't have win in '93 had C.Smith not choked, Dirk would not have won this year had LBJ and LAL not choked, and LAL wouldn't have won last year had Kendrick stayed healthy, and Bos wouldn't have won two years back if Bynym was healthy...give me a title and I'll give you the excuse.

    Quote Originally Posted by kizut1659
    Hackeem played great but i cannot say he outplayed 23-year old Shaq - it was pretty even i think.
    Even except that Hakeem outscored him and scored 30pts+ in every game (nice D) and also that Hakeem swept Shaq in pretty embarassing fashion. But otherwise, totally even.

  2. #32
    Clippers ALL DAY
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    Default Re: Hakeem is not a top10 Player

    Quote Originally Posted by Joey Zaza
    (and just so everyone knows, Hakeem is at least as good as Shaq/Duncan and definitely better than Kobe)
    Individual performance wise? Yes.
    Career wise? No.

  3. #33
    Local High School Star Joey Zaza's Avatar
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    Default Re: Hakeem is not a top10 Player

    Quote Originally Posted by GS1905
    Individual performance wise? Yes.
    Career wise? No.
    Shaq has 1 MVP, Kobe 1 MVP, Hakeem 1 MVP.
    Shaq has 3 Finals MVP, Kobe has 2, Hakeem has 2
    Shaq has 0 DPOY, Kobe has 0 DPOY, Hakeem has 2 DPOY

    Hakeem played in the golden era for Centers. Shaq played in the golden era for pfs. Kobe played in a dead era for sg's.

  4. #34
    Troll who tries to provoke you
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    Lightbulb Re: Hakeem is not a top10 Player

    Quote Originally Posted by GS1905
    Individual performance wise? Yes.
    Career wise? No.
    WTF do you mean career wise?

    Kobe won 1 MVP in 15 seasons. so much for career.

    Hakeem atleast got 1 MVP & 2 DPOY in 12 season.

    Individually & Career wise. Hakeem >>>>> Kobe.

  5. #35
    ThaSwagg3r
    Fan in the Stands (unregistered)

    Default Re: Hakeem is not a top10 Player

    Quote Originally Posted by Joey Zaza
    Shaq has 1 MVP, Kobe 1 MVP, Hakeem 1 MVP.
    Shaq has 3 Finals MVP, Kobe has 2, Hakeem has 2
    Shaq has 0 DPOY, Kobe has 0 DPOY, Hakeem has 2 DPOY

    Hakeem played in the golden era for Centers. Shaq played in the golden era for pfs. Kobe played in a dead era for sg's.
    Not true. Kobe just dominated every SG that existed except Wade because he never really went up to him head to head in the post-season.

    Kobe's competition at SG in the 2000s.

    Tracy McGrady
    Allen Iverson
    Vince Carter
    Dwyane Wade
    Ray Allen
    Michael Redd
    Rip Hamilton
    Brandon Roy
    Joe Johnson
    Manu Ginobili

    MJ played in a weaker competition of SG than Kobe did. I think you could very well argue that Kobe actually played in the golden era of shooting guards. Do you know any eras that had better SGs than those?

    Here are the top 10 SGs of all-time, IMO in no order

    Jordan - mid 80s/90s
    Kobe - 2000s
    West - 70s
    Wade - 2000s
    Gervin - 70s/80s
    Drexler - mid 80s/90s
    Iverson - 2000s
    Ray Allen - 2000s
    Dumars - 80s/90s
    Sam Jones/Hal Greer - 50s/60s.

    And then you could argue guys like Earl Monroe, Tracy McGrady, Vince Carter, Manu Ginobili, Pistol Pete, etc. .

    You have more 2000s players than any other player in that list.
    Last edited by ThaSwagg3r; 08-23-2011 at 04:32 PM.

  6. #36
    NBA rookie of the year Da_Realist's Avatar
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    Default Re: Hakeem is not a top10 Player

    He's better than everyone I saw play except Jordan and possibly Bird and Magic.

  7. #37
    2010-2020 AirTupac's Avatar
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    Default Re: Hakeem is not a top10 Player

    Quote Originally Posted by winwin


    Awful thread, awful poster.

  8. #38
    Local High School Star Joey Zaza's Avatar
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    Default Re: Hakeem is not a top10 Player

    Quote Originally Posted by ThaSwagg3r
    Not true. Kobe just dominated every SG that existed except Wade because he never really went up to him head to head in the post-season.

    Kobe's competition at SG in the 2000s.

    Tracy McGrady
    Allen Iverson
    Vince Carter
    Dwyane Wade
    Ray Allen
    Michael Redd
    Rip Hamilton
    Brandon Roy
    Joe Johnson
    Manu Ginobili

    MJ played in a weaker competition of SG than Kobe did. I think you could very well argue that Kobe actually played in the golden era of shooting guards. Do you know any eras that had better SGs than those?
    Yeah - MJ played v. Drex, Richmond, Miller who are > Redd, Hamilton, JJ, Manu, Carter.

    Carter, T-Mac, and Roy couldda been better but attitude and injuries have made them couldda beens.

    ..and none of the guys listed were better than D.Rob or Ewing (well Wade > Ewing).

  9. #39
    ThaSwagg3r
    Fan in the Stands (unregistered)

    Default Re: Hakeem is not a top10 Player

    Quote Originally Posted by Joey Zaza
    Yeah - MJ played v. Drex, Richmond, Miller who are > Redd, Hamilton, JJ, Manu, Carter.

    Carter, T-Mac, and Roy couldda been better but attitude and injuries have made them couldda beens.

    ..and none of the guys listed were better than D.Rob or Ewing (well Wade > Ewing).
    Kobe didn't necessarily play in a weak era of players either. Regardless, you said Kobe played in a dead era of shooting guards which is false. The shooting guard position is very weak now a days (2011) but it wasn't weak at all during the 2000s; It was actually very strong and productive. The SG position was probably the 2nd most productive position in the 2000s. The PF position was the only one more productive and deeper.

  10. #40
    owwwww
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    Default Re: Hakeem is not a top10 Player

    Even though this thread is dumb, anyone posting long cat picture needs to be fuking banned.

  11. #41
    Local High School Star Joey Zaza's Avatar
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    Default Re: Hakeem is not a top10 Player

    Quote Originally Posted by Fatal9
    Even though this thread is dumb, anyone posting long cat picture needs to be fuking banned.
    cosign!

  12. #42
    Great college starter
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    Default Re: Hakeem is not a top10 Player

    Quote Originally Posted by gengiskhan
    Fact 1: Hakeem owned & Butt raped every HOF centers (Parish, Ewing, D'Rob) including Shaq in Marquee match ups ('95 Finals sweep)

    Fact 2: In 1994, Hakeem "The Dream" delivered the single best NBA Season ever by a player in NBA History including GOAT Michael Jordan. A clean Sweep (NBA Reg Sea MVP + NBA Finals MVP + NBA DPOY)

    Fact 3: Hakeem has "true" "Legit" (unlike Kobe's & Shaq's) back-2-back Finals MVPs beating Marquee arch-rival at Center Position (Ewing in '94; O'Neal in '95)

    Fact 4: Hakeem the one of 3 centers ever to win Back-2-Back DPOY titles. (Lazy Shaq got ZERO)

    Fact 5: Hakeem is "underrated" & often "overlooked" because he did not play for NBAs winningest franchises like Lakers & Celtics & unlike Shaq ditching Magic franchise, he stayed truly loyal to Rockets franchise & never demanded a trade & now is the face of that franchise. A respect well deserved & well earned like GOAT MJ with Bulls.


    Fact 6: Only Reason why Hakeem Lost "Rookie of the Year" honor because he was drafted the same year as GOAT who had even better Rookie season than Hakeem with Bulls. (compare this to rookie kobe. )

    Fact 7: Nobody in the NBA History "inside the paint" has better hand-eye coordination & foot work than Hakeem (Not Kareem, not Shaq, not Charles, not wilt no one)


    Fact 8: Hakeem had the misfortune of playing the same era as Michael Jordan's Bulls dynasty, Bird's era & Magic's Laker's era. If Hakeem played in Shaq's '99-'04 Era, Hakeem could've easily had 5 consequitive Finals MVPs & 3 Reg Sea MVPs with no one to challenge him at center position in Finals (an easy finals MVPs Shaq accumulated)

    Fact 9: Kobe Bryant, Dwight Howard, Lebron James are Hakeem's loyal students & take lessons from Hakeem because All 3 knows, Hakeem is clearly better baller than they could ever be..

    Fact 10: No center in the NBA History has been so completely dominant offensively, defensively, efficiency, outside, mid-range, inside the paint, block shots, steals, superb passer from the post etc etc. than Hakeem. "The Dream" maybe the most complete center NBA has ever produced without single weakness.

    Hakeem "the Dream" Olayjuwon is NOT just Top 10 GOATs

    Hakeem " The Dream" Olayjuwon is GUARANTEED Top 8 GOATs to ever play the game. above duncan, above shaq & clearly above that overrated kobe.
    Good post. But Duncan and Shaq>Hakeem

  13. #43
    NBA rookie of the year
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    Default Re: Hakeem is not a top10 Player

    Quote Originally Posted by Butters
    Larry Bird sais hi.
    After Larry retired MJ won 4 championships, I meant during MJ's prime..

  14. #44
    I hit open 5-foot jumpshots with ease
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    Default Re: Hakeem is not a top10 Player

    Quote Originally Posted by Joey Zaza
    Just to address a few minor points (and just so everyone knows, Hakeem is at least as good as Shaq/Duncan and definitely better than Kobe)



    Nothing declining abou tthat Ewing. That was prime Ewing at his very very best (which turns out was nowhere even in the same ball-park as Hakeem)



    This can be said about EVERY title--MJ wouldn't have win in '93 had C.Smith not choked, Dirk would not have won this year had LBJ and LAL not choked, and LAL wouldn't have won last year had Kendrick stayed healthy, and Bos wouldn't have won two years back if Bynym was healthy...give me a title and I'll give you the excuse.



    Even except that Hakeem outscored him and scored 30pts+ in every game (nice D) and also that Hakeem swept Shaq in pretty embarassing fashion. But otherwise, totally even.

    Few points - i don't have time to respond to all of them. Ewing WAS declining in 1994 -compare 29 ppg on 55% in 1990 with 24.5 ppg. on 50% in 1994. In the playoffs in 1994, he averaged mere 22 ppg on .437% against the likes not only of Olajuwan, but Rick Smits and Luc Longley. At any rate, noone in 1993-1994 thought he was as good as Hackeem, Robinson, or 2nd year Shaq.

    1995 Finals - scoring is not everything - otherwise Allen Iverson would be top 15 GOAT. I call 33 ppg on 48% vs. 28 ppg on 57% when you are being slightly outrebounded and outassisted pretty much a draw. Houston swept Orlando because Houston's supporting cast played better and because Nick Anderson blew game 1.

    Hackeem being better than Kobe is almost as silly of an argument as Kobe being as good as Jordan (not quite but still). Kobe has more rings, more finals appearances, more 50+ win teams, more 1st team selections, more points, more playoff points, and it seems like even a longer prime (Hackeem was no longer top 10 in the league by 1997-1998). Careerwise, its really not that close.

  15. #45
    NBA rookie of the year
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    Default Re: Hakeem is not a top10 Player

    Quote Originally Posted by kizut1659
    Few points - i don't have time to respond to all of them. Ewing WAS declining in 1994 -compare 29 ppg on 55% in 1990 with 24.5 ppg. on 50% in 1994. In the playoffs in 1994, he averaged mere 22 ppg on .437% against the likes not only of Olajuwan, but Rick Smits and Luc Longley. At any rate, noone in 1993-1994 thought he was as good as Hackeem, Robinson, or 2nd year Shaq.
    Yes, since stats are everything?
    And honestly, you probably don't know enough about Olajuwon to start with so you shouldn't make silly statements about crap you don't know.

    It's a good start to actually spell the guys name right, his name is not HACKEEM OLAJUWAN..

    Quote Originally Posted by kizut1659
    1995 Finals - scoring is not everything - otherwise Allen Iverson would be top 15 GOAT. I call 33 ppg on 48% vs. 28 ppg on 57% when you are being slightly outrebounded and outassisted pretty much a draw. Houston swept Orlando because Houston's supporting cast played better and because Nick Anderson blew game 1.
    Ehm, you just wrote that that Ewing was out of his prime and the only reference you made was the fact that he scored less.. And regarding Houston's supporting cast playing better, Hakeem was everything for that team. Every single possession went through his hands and his supporting cast was nothing but mediocre without Hakeem.

    Rockets without Hakeem from '92-'96 won 7 games and lost 27 games which makes them a .20 % team without Hakeem.

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