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Old 09-10-2008, 07:30 PM   #16
Gifted Mind
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Default Re: The Best Players in the NBA: A Year-by-Year Analysis

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Originally Posted by Jimmy2k8
ahh..was just a lil curious. If this took you a while, then well typed. I don't think I've seen anyone type this much information.


and typical 33 23 posting in this thread...I knew he was going to post in this thread.

You would think that he would not post his nonsense in thread since there are no cross era comparisons.
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Old 09-10-2008, 07:31 PM   #17
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Default Re: The Best Players in the NBA: A Year-by-Year Analysis

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Originally Posted by 33 23
'70s was a talent-diluted era with a weak crop of centers. That explains why Kareem was the best player in the league for so long. Kareem in the '90s doesn't separate himself from a prime Olajuwon or Orlando Shaq.
i totally agree with this post. also factor in that jordan missed two prime seasons, and i feel he was the best player in 87 too. but not the most valuable.
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Old 09-10-2008, 07:34 PM   #18
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Default Re: The Best Players in the NBA: A Year-by-Year Analysis

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i totally agree with this post. also factor in that jordan missed two prime seasons, and i feel he was the best player in 87 too. but not the most valuable.

Jordan lacked the instinct in the Playoffs that both Magic and Bird had. He was swept out of the 1st round while playing below season level. He lacked experience in 1987. Jordan though has been considered the best player in the league more times than anyone in the history of the game. He most likely would have more points than Kareem had he played in 95 and 95. However, this is not a thread to say Kareem > Jordan. Obviously this is all relative to the era you played or otherwise Mikan would have a valid argument for being Top 10 ever. This is a thread to appreciate and take a look back at the best players in the NBA from the start to the finish.
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Old 09-10-2008, 07:40 PM   #19
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Default Re: The Best Players in the NBA: A Year-by-Year Analysis

I think Jason Kidd should be considered for 2002. He had his overall best year, leading the Nets to the finals, and IMO, should've won the MVP that year.
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Old 09-10-2008, 07:45 PM   #20
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Default Re: The Best Players in the NBA: A Year-by-Year Analysis

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I think Jason Kidd should be considered for 2002. He had his overall best year, leading the Nets to the finals, and IMO, should've won the MVP that year.

He was considered, but Jason Kidd had more of a MVP type season rather than him actually being better than any of the 3 players mentioned. He took his team to the NBA Finals, however that was in a very degenerated eastern conference. The East after Jordan retired was arguably at its worst stage since the 1950s. In the Finals also Kobe seemed as the better player.
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Old 09-10-2008, 08:05 PM   #21
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Default Re: The Best Players in the NBA: A Year-by-Year Analysis

I'm one of the few on this board that has seen the NBA for over 40 years and I have to say you have done an exceptional job in this thread. This might be the best thread I have ever seen on ISH or any basketball forum.
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Old 09-10-2008, 08:13 PM   #22
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Default Re: The Best Players in the NBA: A Year-by-Year Analysis

The condition of the conference shouldn't make a difference. You said yourself in your first post:

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This thread is dedicated to the best players in the NBA, from the first year in the NBA to the last. Not only is the best player in the NBA named year-by-year, but the 2nd and 3rd best are as well. Remember, these are the "best" players. Not most talented 3 (Players with the most skill), nor the most valuable 3 (MVPs). Talented players are the ones who have all the talent and skill in the universe, however it isn't applied correctly or isn't necessary in order to win. MVPs or valuable players are the ones who are good, however they also require a great situation teamwise. Furthermore, MVPs are given in the regular season, however the best players are made in the playoffs. This analysis concentrates strictly on the best players. So how do we define best? The player is the one who can lead any particular or average team to more wins than the other player. The objective of the game is to win, and the player who can win you more games on any particular team or average team is the better player. The year by year analysis is based on empirical evidence, objective data, observational judgment, balanced criteria, inducible reasoning, and respected opinion. Let's get started from the start.

The condition of the conference has no relevance in this situation. Kobe didn't lead anything. He was second fiddle to Shaq. If Kidd wasn't on that 02 Nets team, they would've won 20 games that year. He took that crap team to the finals.

You could've put any all-star behind Shaq that year and they would've gone to the WCF at least.

It should go

1. Shaq
2. Kidd
3. Pierce

Pierce gets number three for single handidly taking the C's to the ECF's.
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Old 09-10-2008, 08:18 PM   #23
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Default Re: The Best Players in the NBA: A Year-by-Year Analysis

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Originally Posted by Gifted Mind
Jordan lacked the instinct in the Playoffs that both Magic and Bird had. He was swept out of the 1st round while playing below season level. He lacked experience in 1987. Jordan though has been considered the best player in the league more times than anyone in the history of the game. He most likely would have more points than Kareem had he played in 95 and 95. However, this is not a thread to say Kareem > Jordan. Obviously this is all relative to the era you played or otherwise Mikan would have a valid argument for being Top 10 ever. This is a thread to appreciate and take a look back at the best players in the NBA from the start to the finish.
the instinct?????? do you remember the scrubs jordan took to the playoffs? his next best player was a young charles oakley. then a career role player in pax. and then it really gets bad.
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Old 09-10-2008, 08:19 PM   #24
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Default Re: The Best Players in the NBA: A Year-by-Year Analysis

In before Laker fans claiming that Magic was better than Jordan until 1991, if not until his retirement.
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Old 09-10-2008, 08:31 PM   #25
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Default Re: The Best Players in the NBA: A Year-by-Year Analysis

*waits for Shep to declare that Robinson was the best player every year during the 90's*
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Old 09-10-2008, 08:34 PM   #26
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Default Re: The Best Players in the NBA: A Year-by-Year Analysis



This is an excellent breakdown
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Old 09-10-2008, 09:07 PM   #27
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Default Re: The Best Players in the NBA: A Year-by-Year Analysis

Quote:
Originally Posted by 97 bulls
the instinct?????? do you remember the scrubs nowitzki took to the playoffs? his next best player was a young josh howard. then a career role player in jason terry. and then it really gets bad.

I agree. Seriously though, Dirk was top 3 in 2005 and 2006, over KG in 2005 and over LeBron in 2006.


Great list though, a terrific thread and very well thought out.
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Old 09-10-2008, 09:13 PM   #28
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Default Re: The Best Players in the NBA: A Year-by-Year Analysis

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Originally Posted by pete's montreux
The condition of the conference shouldn't make a difference. You said yourself in your first post:



The condition of the conference has no relevance in this situation. Kobe didn't lead anything. He was second fiddle to Shaq. If Kidd wasn't on that 02 Nets team, they would've won 20 games that year. He took that crap team to the finals.

You could've put any all-star behind Shaq that year and they would've gone to the WCF at least.

It should go

1. Shaq
2. Kidd
3. Pierce

Pierce gets number three for single handidly taking the C's to the ECF's.

So you consider Kidd and Pierce better than Duncan and Kobe in 2002? 2002 was arguably Duncan's best season in his career, yet Pierce and Kidd were better? I think you've misunderstood the criteria. It's not who "did" lead a certain team to a certain place, it's who "could" lead. Not all the players in the NBA were in the same situation to lead a certain team. If Kidd was on the Lakers he too would've been a 2nd fiddle, does that make him any worse as a player? It's completely illogical to say Pierce was a better player than Tim Duncan since he led his team to the ECF while Duncan lost to the eventual champions. Using the criteria I set as defining "best" player, and then putting Pierce over Duncan would basically imply that you believe if Pierce was on the Spurs they would have beat the Lakers or come closer to doing so.
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Old 09-10-2008, 09:13 PM   #29
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Default Re: The Best Players in the NBA: A Year-by-Year Analysis

I clearly sense a double-standard for the Wilt-Russell comparison compared to later similar comparisons. In 4 seperate cases (1960, 1961, 1963, 1965), you ranked Russell over Wilt, probably based on the better team record and the longer playoff run, but then you don't do the same for Kareem-Walton in 1977 or Jordan-Magic in 1988 or 1989 (I may give you 1989, because Magic missed the finals, although I'll still rank his season over Jordan's, since he won 10 games more, with Kareem on his last feet, his stats were pretty close, won the MVP and had an 11-0 vs 9-8 record through the first 3 rounds of the playoffs).
Nice to think about the Doctor in 1976 (GOAT ABA individual season), but it's still tough to compare an ABA to an NBA season. By the way, the Lakers should make the playoffs in 1976. Why didn't they? Blame it on the stupid system of the day, which required at least 2 teams from each division to advance to the playoffs, regardless of their records. This resulted in 2 of the 5 Western teams that made the playoffs having actually a worse record than the, also Western, Lakers...


Here's my personal list. Every season has two winners. The first is the player who I believe dominated more in the season (regardless of how well his team did) and the other is the player who achieved the better combination of individual dominance-team success. It doesn't nessesarily mean that he has to be the champion, but he has to play at least 1 playoff round less than the champion (or 0, i.e, be the finalist). I included only NBA seasons:

1947: Fulks-Fulks
1948: Fulks-Fulks
1949: Mikan-Mikan
1950: Mikan-Mikan
1951: Mikan-Mikan
1952: Mikan-Mikan
1953: Mikan-Mikan
1954: Mikan-Mikan
1955: Johnston-Schayes
1956: Pettit-Arizin
1957: Pettit-Pettit
1958: Russell-Pettit
1959: Russell-Russell
1960: Chamberlain-Chamberlain
1961: Chamberlain-Russell/Baylor
1962: Chamberlain-Chamberlain/Russell
1963: Chamberlain-Baylor
1964: Chamberlain-Chamberlain
1965: Chamberlain-Chamberlain/West
1966: Chamberlain-Russell
1967: Chamberlain-Chamberlain
1968: Chamberlain-Chamberlain
1969: Chamberlain-West
1970: Abdul-Jabbar-Reed
1971: Abdul-Jabbar-Abdul-Jabbar
1972: Abdul-Jabbar-Abdul-Jabbar
1973: Abdul-Jabbar-Havlicek
1974: Abdul-Jabbar-Abdul-Jabbar
1975: Abdul-Jabbar-Barry
1976: Abdul-Jabbar-Cowens
1977: Abdul-Jabbar-Abdul-Jabbar/Walton
1978: Abdul-Jabbar-Hayes
1979: Abdul-Jabbar-Abdul-Jabbar
1980: Abdul-Jabbar/M.Malone-Abdul-Jabbar
1981: M.Malone-M.Malone
1982: M.Malone-Magic
1983: M.Malone-M.Malone
1984: Bird-Bird
1985: Bird-Bird/Magic
1986: Bird-Bird
1987: Magic-Magic
1988: Jordan-Magic
1989: Magic/Jordan-Magic
1990: Jordan-Jordan
1991: Jordan-Jordan
1992: Jordan-Jordan
1993: Jordan-Jordan
1994: Olajuwon-Olajuwon
1995: Olajuwon/Robinson-Olajuwon
1996: Jordan-Jordan
1997: Jordan-Jordan
1998: K.Malone-Jordan
1999: S.O'Neal-Duncan
2000: S.O'Neal-S.O'Neal
2001: S.O'Neal-S.O'Neal
2002: S.O'Neal-S.O'Neal
2003: Duncan-Duncan
2004: S.O'Neal/Duncan-S.O'Neal
2005: S.O'Neal-Duncan
2006: Bryant/James-Wade
2007: Bryant-James
2008: James/Bryant-Bryant
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Old 09-10-2008, 09:26 PM   #30
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Default Re: The Best Players in the NBA: A Year-by-Year Analysis

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Originally Posted by 97 bulls
the instinct?????? do you remember the scrubs jordan took to the playoffs? his next best player was a young charles oakley. then a career role player in pax. and then it really gets bad.

It takes more than all the skill, talent, and even heart to be considered the best player in the NBA. There are intangibles such as experience which Jordan lacked in 1987 and which Magic and Bird were gifted with by 87. Jordan put up brilliant numbers in 87, but on a team that was under .500. They possibly would not have made the playoffs today. And in the playoffs, where the best in the NBA show their game, Jordan's performance level actually fell as his team was swept 3-0.

Jordan might've been the most skilled and talented in 87, however he was not the best and that was proven when his team was swept and his performance level dropped.
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