No way the Wolves do that second one. Hell, even the first one's a stretch considering they want young guys and small contracts, something that Caron and Antawn just don't have. But I'd do them both instantly. I don't care who you put around KG/arenas, that combos on par, if not better than TMac/Yao.
I wouldn't do that trade if the 1st round pick wasn't in the deal. The Wolves obviously get hit hard having to downgrade from KG to Jamison. And Caron Butler isn't any better than Ricky Davis so there's really no upgrade at the 2 or 3 spot. And Haywood is just your average center that the Wolves could use to help out KG, but being that KG wouldnt be here in Minnesota anymore, the trade wouldn't do him any good. If KG ever leaves Minnesota, u can bet it'll be for a teams best player. So unless the Wizards are willing to part ways with Arenas, your GM shouldn't even bother calling Kevin McHale. And with Mike James and Randy Foye around, I dont think Arenas would get you KG.
Butler is better than Davis, and I'm sure the Wolves would trade Garnett for Arenas, who is about 7 years younger.
Age means nothing when you're trying to get to the NBA Finals. KG is still in his prime and the Wolves are trying to get him a championship, even though it may not seem like it. I lost track, but KG has been the face of the Timberwolves franchise for years now (similar to AI in philly). You dont trade a top 5 player and improve your team, unless you get a top 5 or 10 guy in return. Not only would that proposed trade of Jamison, Butler, & Haywood be bad from a fan/marketing standpoint... It wouldn't improve the T-Wolves at all, so why do it?? You say that Butler is better than Davis and I dont really agree, i can't really say that one of them is really better than the other. They're both guys who will give you 19-20 pts a game. I havent been able to watch Butler all that much but i'm guessing he's probably the better defender, but i'm guessing Ricky Davis is the better passer. KG will NEVER end up in Washington unless Arenas is involved in the deal... and even then, who knows.
You guys even sure the Wiz would trade Gil for KG, even if it were straight up? Age does mean a lot jrt, when you're trying to build for the future. Let's just say the Wiz trade Arenas to the Wolves for KG straight up. Does that get KG any closer to the contender status that he wants. Hell no. The Wiz would still be a 4/5 seed at best, and they wouldn't be able to get past a team like Miami and Detroit.
Meanwhile, the Wolves would get a franchise player who's only 25. Five years less than KG. I'm not saying the Wolves would be any closer to contention either with Gil, but chances are, they would have a franchise guy for five years longer than the Wolves would if that 1 for 1 deal went down.
The point is, both of these teams are stuck in mediocrity. They are 6th seeds at best, and that's asking a lot, especially for the Wolves (in the West). Therefore, they must build for the future. And if you're stuck in mediocrity, and you know so, and you can choose between a 25 year old superstar, and a slightly better 30 year old, who would you pick? Obviously the 25 year old, because you'd have more time to build around him.
Minnesota would never give up Kevin Garnett, if they dont get a franchise guy in return. Not to mention the defensive/rebounding hit the T'Wolves would suffer.
I can't see Minnesota doing that deal but if they would, you gotta pull the trigger on that.
Basketball relies on individuals by far more than any other team sport. When you have the chance to add an individual who has years of prime left, solves every weakness your team has, and is top 5 in the league, you gotta do it. When you have 2 top 10 players filling up the most key positions that would click so well together, the rest will fall into place rather easily:
You have KG and Arenas. Scoring is taken care of. Rebounding is taken care of. Passing is taken care of. Now what do you need? Not much, right? A big body to fill up the middle... PJ Brown or Kelvin Cato. Hell, Etan Thomas could do. Roleplayers at the 2 and 3 are the easiest things to come by in this league. So just pick up a couple good off-ball guys who can play defense, hit shots, and mix it up a little... would Jarvis Hayes and Josh Childress not be enough? Get a shooter and a backup pointguard. And that's it, you've got yourself a team. None of those are challenging to get with half an MLE. And we could probably do better.
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Let's just say the Wiz trade Arenas to the Wolves for KG straight up. Does that get KG any closer to the contender status that he wants. Hell no.
yes it does. first of all it gets KG in the East where he's got a certain playoff berth regardless of his team. second it gives him a coach who likes and knows how to work with point forwards and will use him to the fullest extent.
not to mention the fact that Wash's supporting cast is way better than Minny's. the problem with the Wiz is that they suck at everything that KG is great at. I'm talking about passing, defense, rebounding, reliable post scoring. even without Arenas the Wizards still have the exact same strengths. well, KG would solve all of our serious issues and even without Gil we still don't have a lot of issues with clutch play, scoring, creating.
KG still wouldn't be in supporting cast Nirvana or anything but he'd be happier I think. there would still be team defense issues but it wouldn't be that bad, not with Etan Haywood and KG downlow and it's way easier for the perimiter guys to work when there's someone downlow worth fearing. there's still the issue of inconsistent shooting but Jamison and Hayes are far from bad at it, and better than anyone KG's got now except Mike James
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You say that Butler is better than Davis and I dont really agree, i can't really say that one of them is really better than the other.
Butlers better... trust me. I agree that Minny would be retarded to trade KG unless they're getting a "name" in return.. or a top 2 pick. But Arenas is a name. He's not heavily hyped or anything on a national level but when you think about it neither is KG anymore. DC is in love with Gil and despite the fact that their team plays the ugliest basketball that I have ever seen they're having no trouble selling tickets.
yes it does. first of all it gets KG in the East where he's got a certain playoff berth regardless of his team. second it gives him a coach who likes and knows how to work with point forwards and will use him to the fullest extent.
But that's what I'm saying. They might be better than they would be with Gil, but they would still only be a five seed at best. And that's just not enough. As weak as the East is, that's just depth. The top of the East is parallel with the top of the West. Miami and Detroit would still have to be beates. And even with a lineup of Danials, Butler, Jamison, KG, Haywood, I just don't think they could come close to defeating those two championship calibur teams. They'll get in the playoffs, but they'd be where say, Indi is right now. A solid team, but no real chance of upsetting a big dog. They just wouldn't be contenders.
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not to mention the fact that Wash's supporting cast is way better than Minny's. the problem with the Wiz is that they suck at everything that KG is great at. I'm talking about passing, defense, rebounding, reliable post scoring. even without Arenas the Wizards still have the exact same strengths. well, KG would solve all of our serious issues and even without Gil we still don't have a lot of issues with clutch play, scoring, creating.
Well those are some good points. And it might make us the 4-5 best in the East, but again, we wouldn't be at contender status. And clutch play would be a major issue. KG needs to be paired with a really good swingman, who can take the scoring pressure and clutch play pressure off of him. A combonation of Butler/Jamison just isn't enough to do that.
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KG still wouldn't be in supporting cast Nirvana or anything but he'd be happier I think. there would still be team defense issues but it wouldn't be that bad, not with Etan Haywood and KG downlow and it's way easier for the perimiter guys to work when there's someone downlow worth fearing. there's still the issue of inconsistent shooting but Jamison and Hayes are far from bad at it, and better than anyone KG's got now except Mike James
I dunno about that. I'd probably put Ricky above a guy like Hayes. And James is a VERY solid shooter. I know you've probably seen his Hot Zones chart, and this guy shoots the lights out. He's quite a bit of a better shooter than Jamison.
But anyways, I would definately do this deal straight up for the next two years. But what about after that? KG's 30, and he might have 2-3 more years of "superstar" status ahead of him. Gilbert on the other hand, has at least 6-7
more great years ahead of him, AND he's still improving. This guy will be top ten in the NBA with EASE once he develops that midrange jumper.
I just don't think trading away 6-7 more years of franchise guy for 2-3 more years of another slightly better franchise guy is worth it, when the new franchise guy won't even make you a true contender.
Not gonna happen! Wishful thinking on everyone's part... If KG ends up getting traded, its not gonna be to washington for a couple of guys like jamison and butler. And its not gonna be for someone like Arenas because the Wolves have already got the next great combo guard in Randy Foye. Maybe the Wiz can lure someone like... i dont know, Matt Bonner when he becomes a FA. He should solve all of the wizards problems and he'll be a huge hit with the fans.
