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Old 01-17-2009, 04:18 PM   #16
TakitoEspanoza
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Default Re: Nintendo is killing gaming in front of our eyes

Quote:
Originally Posted by DeuceWallaces
I'm a hardcore gamer and I love my Wii. I can play WoW for 10 hours and then sit down for 10 more with Mario Kart. I don't see the problem with that.

Well Im not arguing about games like Mario Kart because thats a great game. But see the problem with Nintendo, is I buy the same small handful of games each generation... a new mario or 2, a new zelda or 2, a new mario kart or 2, a donkey kong, a metroid. And then its like nothing else comes out except for maybe the rare gem like Eternal Darkness.
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Old 01-17-2009, 04:20 PM   #17
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Default Re: Nintendo is killing gaming in front of our eyes

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Originally Posted by LJJ
Games like Fallout have been around for a while. Don't tell me we wouldn't have Fallout without casual gamers. We had Morrowind. And that was a hardcore game geared towards the most LoTR PC fantasy geeks out there.
Before that we have long deep 3d games with high production values, like Shenmue and Ocarina of Time.

Right now is just really a turning point because Nintendo has been doing this **** for years. Mario Party, Mario Golf, but it was only successful as filler between the A titles. But right now, with games like Wii Fit, Brain Training, Wii Sports, Wii Music. Those are their A titles, their core business.
And they are having success with it, and the quality of games will suffer because of that.


Yea thats what im afraid of.
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Old 01-17-2009, 08:37 PM   #18
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Default Re: Nintendo is killing gaming in front of our eyes

The OP's point is a valid and real one. Before Wii, Sony and Microsoft were making huge money off flagship games which are critically acclaimed. This led to the PS2 having the most succesful console lives ever. During the span of the PS2, we get games like GTA, which started the whole sandbox thing, Xbox came up with Halo, the PS2 also had gems like viewtiful joe, devil may cry, ico, shadow of the colossus. That was the high point in gaming because the only way Sony and Microsoft is going to cut a profit is by selling great games.

Now since Nintendo has opened up pandoras box of the "casual gamer". How would you think Sony and Microsoft's CEO would react to seeing their companies' bottom line? They don't care if the PS3 had excellent games like MGS4, all they care about is the glaring red line
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Old 01-18-2009, 03:48 AM   #19
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Default Re: Nintendo is killing gaming in front of our eyes

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Originally Posted by gasolina
The OP's point is a valid and real one. Before Wii, Sony and Microsoft were making huge money off flagship games which are critically acclaimed. This led to the PS2 having the most succesful console lives ever. During the span of the PS2, we get games like GTA, which started the whole sandbox thing, Xbox came up with Halo, the PS2 also had gems like viewtiful joe, devil may cry, ico, shadow of the colossus. That was the high point in gaming because the only way Sony and Microsoft is going to cut a profit is by selling great games.

Now since Nintendo has opened up pandoras box of the "casual gamer". How would you think Sony and Microsoft's CEO would react to seeing their companies' bottom line? They don't care if the PS3 had excellent games like MGS4, all they care about is the glaring red line

Wait, what´s your point, you don´t think Sony and M$ cared about that before?

This is just like the NBA Forum where fans never understand that the NBA is a business first and foremost.

And no, they made money by selling popular games, not great ones. Ico is one of the most special games I´ve ever played but it sold lousy.
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Old 01-18-2009, 02:05 PM   #20
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Default Re: Nintendo is killing gaming in front of our eyes

Quote:
Originally Posted by TakitoEspanoza
Well Im not arguing about games like Mario Kart because thats a great game. But see the problem with Nintendo, is I buy the same small handful of games each generation... a new mario or 2, a new zelda or 2, a new mario kart or 2, a donkey kong, a metroid. And then its like nothing else comes out except for maybe the rare gem like Eternal Darkness.

Again, this is smart business, why should a company make something new if the majority of it's customers enjoy the same characters and gameplay?

Imagine if you only had to score 70% of the other teams points to win, makes it a bit easier to success, right?

It's the same thing here. If gamers want something new, try not buying the same things over and over again.
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Old 01-18-2009, 04:37 PM   #21
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Default Re: Nintendo is killing gaming in front of our eyes

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Originally Posted by sixerfan82
Again, this is smart business, why should a company make something new if the majority of it's customers enjoy the same characters and gameplay?

Imagine if you only had to score 70% of the other teams points to win, makes it a bit easier to success, right?

It's the same thing here. If gamers want something new, try not buying the same things over and over again.


I never said it was dumb business, in fact im saying its a great business model, which is why im scared Microsoft and Sony will go this route and ruin gaming.
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Old 01-18-2009, 10:11 PM   #22
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Default Re: Nintendo is killing gaming in front of our eyes

Quote:
Originally Posted by TakitoEspanoza
I never said it was dumb business, in fact im saying its a great business model, which is why im scared Microsoft and Sony will go this route and ruin gaming.

Ok then I misunderstood your original post. Are you angry there are no hardcore games or happy?

Oh and you never answered my previous questions
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Old 01-18-2009, 10:57 PM   #23
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Default Re: Nintendo is killing gaming in front of our eyes

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Originally Posted by biisak
Wait, what´s your point, you don´t think Sony and M$ cared about that before?

This is just like the NBA Forum where fans never understand that the NBA is a business first and foremost.

And no, they made money by selling popular games, not great ones. Ico is one of the most special games I´ve ever played but it sold lousy.

Point is, Sony and MS did care about that red line, but a few years ago the only way to cut a profit is to make good games and sell a lot of them.

Now, with this casual gamer crap out there, MS and Sony would just have to pattern their business approach to that of Nintendo's. And in a few years well see Ratchet and Clank Sports and Halo Boot Camp Fit
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Old 01-19-2009, 12:15 AM   #24
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Default Re: Nintendo is killing gaming in front of our eyes

So what exactly is a "hardcore gamer"?

Because where I stand, those people playing GTAIV, Halo, and Madden are NOT "hardcore gamers"

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Old 01-19-2009, 01:42 AM   #25
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Default Re: Nintendo is killing gaming in front of our eyes

I basically have been casual ever since I left highschool and decided to get in shape badly. Have not even bought another console since Xbox came out in 2001.
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Old 01-19-2009, 02:04 AM   #26
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Default Re: Nintendo is killing gaming in front of our eyes

from Wiki


Quote:
Hardcore gamer is a widely used term applied to describe a type of video game player. There is currently no unanimously agreed upon definition for the term (see Usage section). Some describe hardcore gamers as those whose leisure time is largely devoted to playing or reading about video games. This type of gamer prefers to take significant time and practice on games, in contrast to a casual gamer. Many hardcore gamers pride themselves on mastering the rules or use of a game, although this is not a strict requirement. Conflicting opinion argues that it is not so much the time spent on games however, as casual gamers can spend hundreds of hours on games without ever mastering them.

[edit] Usage

There is often confusion about what a hardcore gamer is. The term is often used to differentiate between types of hardcore gamers by such things as the amounts of time invested playing, how competitive the player is, preference for player versus player or player versus environment, game style or gameplay preference, or even the type of computer or console equipment used. Certain hardcore gamers are sometimes inaccurately labeled as casual gamers, often in a derogatory way, because of this differentiation even though they prefer playing games which are designed for hardcore gamers. This is common among MMORPG players where there is a demand for many different gameplay styles (e.g., solo play, quests, PvP, raid content, crafting) within a single game but limited developer ability to deliver all of them. The most important area in its usage is in the media relating to the games industry. It is a well noted success story of Games Publisher PR, that they were so easily able to persuade games journalists into accepting -undefined- the phrases 'hardcore' and 'casual'. Equivalent pairings to polarise consumers could have ranged from 'old-school' & 'mainstream', 'elitist' & 'easy-going' to 'dedicated' & 'uninformed'. However conjecture, based on the history of changes in the games industry, would suggest the choices of casual and hardcore were not arbitrary. Generally hardcore gamers take games seriously, but this does not necessarily mean they have to invest a lot of time in them.

link

sounds to me like the equivalent of a movie snob that will only watch independent stuff or certain directors.

if I have fun with the game i dont give a rats ass about much else.

Last edited by kentatm : 01-19-2009 at 02:07 AM.
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Old 01-19-2009, 02:47 AM   #27
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Default Re: Nintendo is killing gaming in front of our eyes

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonic R
So what exactly is a "hardcore gamer"?

Because where I stand, those people playing GTAIV, Halo, and Madden are NOT "hardcore gamers"

Well, if we went by your collection to qualify a hardcore gamer, I think you'd be the only one on the board

I'm more of a casual gamer now. I play maybe 2-3 hours a week at most. I'm the same as kentatm though. If I get a game i'm really into though, i'll sit through for hours and finish the whole thing. Like Mass Effect or GTA 4 for example.
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Old 01-19-2009, 03:06 AM   #28
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Default Re: Nintendo is killing gaming in front of our eyes

my definition....

hardcore gamer - one who plays 8 to 10 hours of video games a day, memorizes plots complete story lines and characters backgrounds, conquerors and achieves the entire game 100%, one who has no life
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Old 01-19-2009, 08:42 AM   #29
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Default Re: Nintendo is killing gaming in front of our eyes

Quote:
Originally Posted by sixerfan82
That's because you have something called common sense

People who believe the only games in existence are Gears of War, Fallout, or Fable and the only systems are Xbox360 and PS3 are media tools.

Guess what, there's this thing called the Odyssey that it ALL started with, and it only had maybe a handful of colors tops.

Now, as for my personal tastes. I consider myself on the middle ground, I'm not hardcore anymore, but I'm not casual. I play a lot of casual games if you wanted to categorize it.

Huh?

So, everyone with a 360/ps3 preference is a media tool? That's absurd. The reason my Wii sits on the shelf collecting dust isn't bc i lack common sense. I didn't think mario kart wii was the greatest racer ever made, twilight princess was a chore to finish, and ssbb didn't renew my interest in fighting games. (all 3 of these games have great reviews from ign, metacritic 1up, etc...)

Metroid Prime Corruption, Super Mario Galaxy, Tiger Woods, and House of the Dead(2 & 3) are really the only times I enjoy playing the wii. House of the Dead doesn't have "stunning" jaw-dropping graphics, but its a fun game.

I think you're underestimating the ps3 and 360 network. They offer greater statistical tracking which enhances the competition amongst friends (chasing one another's score) which adds depth to the overall gameplay.

As far as the OP, questhelper didn't slow down WoW.
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Old 01-19-2009, 01:06 PM   #30
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Default Re: Nintendo is killing gaming in front of our eyes

I'm not a fan of using labels (although sometimes they're appropriate), but if someone asked me what a hardcore gamer was, I would point out someone who put in a tremendous amount of their free time into gaming.

What does this have to do with content? Sometimes nothing. There are exceptions to every rule. I'm sure there are great video game players out there who love to play the Wii as well. They just enjoy video gaming period. Sonic R strikes me as one of these people.

But IMHO, the reason people associate hard core gamers with XBox and PS3, is because most 'casual' gamers, just plain aren't good with video games. They don't play enough to get good at it, so they can't handle a lot of the non party variety of games, or if you want to generalize a bit more, the types of stuff beyond what you'd find at a Dave and Busters.

So the hardcore gamer got generalized to the XBox and PS3, because they've played those other games, recognized them for what they are, and they prefer a more intense, longer game, such as a Gears of War, or a Metal Gear Solid, that you're not going to find on the Wii in the same quality as you would on a Playstation or XBox.

I take offense to the retards who say that this qualifies as someone who has no life. One of my buddies works third shift, and will drink beer and play video games almost non stop when he isn't working. He has the blockbuster thing where he can exchange games, whatever. The majority of his family is in Arizona. He has a live in girlfriend who is also a good friend of mine and her daughter lives with them. His is in Arizona with her mother because as with most guys, he couldn't get custody. Now that she is of age where she can choose which parent she wants to go with, all her friends are in Arizona and her mother has already spent years prepping her with a guilt trip. But my buddy is pretty damn knowledgable about any number of topics and he's a blast to hang out with. He's also always there for you when you need someone in a pinch.

Screw hard core gamers, I want to know what the definition of "having a life" is, because apparently there are certain requirements. And here I thought life was about doing what makes you happy. Guess I have a lot to learn about life, even at my age.

Mathius

Last edited by Mathius : 01-19-2009 at 01:10 PM.
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