Message Board Basketball Forum - InsideHoops

Go Back   Message Board Basketball Forum - InsideHoops > NBA Team Forums > Toronto Raptors Forum

Toronto Raptors Forum Toronto Raptors message board - Toronto Raptors forum

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 02-16-2009, 06:21 PM   #16
bokes15
Playoffs!
 
bokes15's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: New York City
Posts: 9,272
bokes15 is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterbokes15 is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterbokes15 is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterbokes15 is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterbokes15 is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterbokes15 is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterbokes15 is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterbokes15 is considered a brilliant InsideHoops poster
Default Re: Now that we have Shawn Marion, What would you rather???

Quote:
i hate to disapoint but the lottery is most likely, unlikely.

We have 27 games left, and would have to go 20-7 just to finish at .500. If we won half of our final remaining games we'd be at 35-47. So it's not just that we'd have to win half of our games or slightly above half. We'd have to finish off the season winning close to 3/4 of our remaining games to get in, so no I wouldn't call it likely. Possible yes. "Most likely" no.
bokes15 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-16-2009, 06:38 PM   #17
Skywalker
LFC|JAYS|RAPS|VIKES
 
Skywalker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Canada
Posts: 14,972
Skywalker is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterSkywalker is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterSkywalker is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterSkywalker is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterSkywalker is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterSkywalker is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterSkywalker is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterSkywalker is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterSkywalker is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterSkywalker is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterSkywalker is considered a brilliant InsideHoops poster
Default Re: Now that we have Shawn Marion, What would you rather???

I can see us reeling off 7 in a row at some point and being right back in it.

Wouldn't it be crazy if we got in first round and took out the Cavs or the Celts? I want them to make POs just so we have the chance.
Skywalker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-16-2009, 07:05 PM   #18
Dr.Funk
Decent college freshman
 
Dr.Funk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 2,926
Dr.Funk has decent reputationDr.Funk has decent reputation
Default Re: Now that we have Shawn Marion, What would you rather???

Quote:
Originally Posted by antonaki1
If we want a team that will attract quality free agents and players via exceptions, than tanking is no option. It's important the team makes the playoffs and puts in a decent show or we will go back to being considered the lower echelon of the league like a few years of past. The schedule is not really condusive the rest of the way to tanking anyways. Even an average team should play 500 the rest of the way, so i hate to disapoint but the lottery is most likely, unlikely. The best case is we have a great remainder of the season with Shawn being a major key, and than wanting to sign here for no more than 10Mil a year. Than attracting someone to come here under the bi-annual exception.


Bingo!

We have to make the playoffs and show that free agent that we are courting that he is the piece that will take us from playoff contender to legit contender.
Dr.Funk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-16-2009, 07:13 PM   #19
DJMason
High School JV MVP
 
DJMason's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 691
DJMason is considered somewhat coolDJMason is considered somewhat cool
Default Re: Now that we have Shawn Marion, What would you rather???

Quote:
Originally Posted by Qwyjibo
Not necessarily.

I still think this offseason is the last chance the Raptors have of building a good team around Bosh. Get a high draft pick, use that and any cap space wisely and you might have a team that Bosh will stay with. With the recent poor management decisions, the Raptors are in a bit of a hole but it's still possible to turn this into a talented team for now and the future.

My only concern is that obvious tanking makes attracting tallent this offseason even trickier than it is already given our "foreign" status and the ignorance of many NBA players (I'm looking at you Salmons). In a perfect world where Toronto was already a go-to destination ala New York or Boston, a tank for the rest of the year would be a no-brainer just like Boston did 2 years ago. I just think that based on TO's past difficulties with getting FA's we need to tread lightly. As bokes has said though, going somewhere around500 for the rest of the way still has us finish quite low in the East so even if we improve with Marion we're still likely to get a pretty good draft choice, hopefully without making a complete embarassment out of ourselves.
DJMason is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-16-2009, 07:26 PM   #20
Qwyjibo
Yankee.Hotel.Foxtrot
 
Qwyjibo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Canada
Posts: 12,399
Qwyjibo is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterQwyjibo is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterQwyjibo is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterQwyjibo is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterQwyjibo is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterQwyjibo is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterQwyjibo is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterQwyjibo is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterQwyjibo is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterQwyjibo is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterQwyjibo is considered a brilliant InsideHoops poster
Default Re: Now that we have Shawn Marion, What would you rather???

"Obvious tanking" doesn't really matter since it will never happen here. There should be no worry about that. We all know the current Raptors management and ownership would never allow tanking like Cleveland did before the Lebron draft or Boston did before the Oden draft.

When I say "tanking", I just mean I want the Raptors to lose and lose a lot the rest of the way this year. The only thing that will keep Bosh in Toronto is more talent being added around him. A higher draft pick gives the Raptors a better chance at that. As for free agency? Whether the Raptors miss the playoffs or get swept in the 1st round, does anyone really think THAT will make the difference in a free agents mind? The main driving force will be the same thing it has almost always been and always will be, money.
Qwyjibo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-16-2009, 08:12 PM   #21
new noise
madvillain
 
new noise's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Canada
Posts: 1,481
new noise has an OK reputation so far
Default Re: Now that we have Shawn Marion, What would you rather???

Quote:
Originally Posted by Qwyjibo
Whether the Raptors miss the playoffs or get swept in the 1st round, does anyone really think THAT will make the difference in a free agents mind? The main driving force will be the same thing it has almost always been and always will be, money.

I'm inclined to agree. If they're willing to spend the money, Toronto has as much chance to sign a big name this summer as anyone.

And maybe I'm wrong, but I think a lot of NBA players are smart enough to see the benefits of playing with a Chris Bosh, and more importantly a very good PG like Calderon. You offer a guy like Marvin Williams the right amount of money and a big role on a team with young talent and a good point guard, I think he jumps at it.

With so many teams banking the entire future of their franchises on the 2010 class, Colangelo could actually pull off something very significant in a few months. If he's able to ditch Kapono for another expiring deal, he could do something huge. Have to give him credit for not following the herd mentality.
new noise is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-16-2009, 08:30 PM   #22
Valliant13
NBA lottery pick
 
Valliant13's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 4,023
Valliant13 is considered somewhat coolValliant13 is considered somewhat coolValliant13 is considered somewhat cool
Default Re: Now that we have Shawn Marion, What would you rather???

What I want, and what I think is best for the team long term, are somewhat in opposition here. I wouldn't never want them to tank, as it teaches young players losing habits...but it they happened to finish near the bottom and snag a high lottery slot it would probably help towards building a long term contender.

As a fan, though, I want them to win every game. Even if that means they scrape into the playoffs and get annihilated by the Cavs or Celts. I think any kind playoff experience hugely helps player growth, and energizes the fan base. And given the way the economy is tanking it is hugely important to have season tickets buyers as full of hope as possible.
Valliant13 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-16-2009, 08:31 PM   #23
RaininThrees
Meats Don't Clash
 
RaininThrees's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Ontario, Canada
Posts: 4,997
RaininThrees is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterRaininThrees is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterRaininThrees is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterRaininThrees is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterRaininThrees is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterRaininThrees is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterRaininThrees is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterRaininThrees is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterRaininThrees is considered a brilliant InsideHoops poster
Default Re: Now that we have Shawn Marion, What would you rather???

Quote:
Originally Posted by bokes15
We have 27 games left, and would have to go 20-7 just to finish at .500. If we won half of our final remaining games we'd be at 35-47. So it's not just that we'd have to win half of our games or slightly above half. We'd have to finish off the season winning close to 3/4 of our remaining games to get in, so no I wouldn't call it likely. Possible yes. "Most likely" no.


The Raps finish the year off with a very favourable schedule. I say favourable knowing the Raps history this year against bad teams... something like 17 of 27 games against teams with records either below .500 or between them and the 8th playoff spot. I can see the Raps how the Raps could get to 38 or 39 wins by the end of the year, and that would be near a playoff spot.

Not advocating this, just saying its a real possibility, in my mind.
RaininThrees is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-16-2009, 08:40 PM   #24
RaininThrees
Meats Don't Clash
 
RaininThrees's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Ontario, Canada
Posts: 4,997
RaininThrees is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterRaininThrees is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterRaininThrees is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterRaininThrees is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterRaininThrees is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterRaininThrees is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterRaininThrees is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterRaininThrees is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterRaininThrees is considered a brilliant InsideHoops poster
Default Re: Now that we have Shawn Marion, What would you rather???

Quote:
Originally Posted by Valliant13
And given the way the economy is tanking it is hugely important to have season tickets buyers as full of hope as possible.


I personally this is a huge factor for the Raps. In Toronto, this is a pretty bleak year for sports teams with the Leafs rebuilding, Jays writing off 2009, Argos in last place, Bills tanking the end of the year. The Raps had a real chance to be "the team" in the TO sports market and the blew it, and you know Colangelo knows this.

In tough economic times, teams can't just start losing games for fear of losing revenues through season tickets.
RaininThrees is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-16-2009, 08:40 PM   #25
RapsFan
Great college starter
 
RapsFan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 3,659
RapsFan is a pretty well-respected posterRapsFan is a pretty well-respected posterRapsFan is a pretty well-respected poster
Default Re: Now that we have Shawn Marion, What would you rather???

I want as high a pick as possible, but I suspect we'll go all out for the playoffs. If we make the playoffs, at least our 1st round pick debt will be paid (outside of the lottery) to Miami in a weak draft class.
RapsFan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-16-2009, 10:06 PM   #26
Toni
The Clumsy Waiter
 
Toni's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Canada
Posts: 2,496
Toni is considered somewhat coolToni is considered somewhat coolToni is considered somewhat cool
Default Re: Now that we have Shawn Marion, What would you rather???

Quote:
Originally Posted by RapsFan
I want as high a pick as possible, but I suspect we'll go all out for the playoffs. If we make the playoffs, at least our 1st round pick debt will be paid (outside of the lottery) to Miami in a weak draft class.

What's going on with that conditional pick to Miami?

I keep hearing it's our first rounder and all this. What are the conditions?
Toni is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-16-2009, 10:31 PM   #27
RaininThrees
Meats Don't Clash
 
RaininThrees's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Ontario, Canada
Posts: 4,997
RaininThrees is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterRaininThrees is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterRaininThrees is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterRaininThrees is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterRaininThrees is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterRaininThrees is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterRaininThrees is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterRaininThrees is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterRaininThrees is considered a brilliant InsideHoops poster
Default Re: Now that we have Shawn Marion, What would you rather???

Quote:
Originally Posted by Toni
What's going on with that conditional pick to Miami?

I keep hearing it's our first rounder and all this. What are the conditions?

It's Miami's pick the first year the Raps make the playoffs after this year to2014, I believe.
RaininThrees is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-16-2009, 10:56 PM   #28
Toni
The Clumsy Waiter
 
Toni's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Canada
Posts: 2,496
Toni is considered somewhat coolToni is considered somewhat coolToni is considered somewhat cool
Default Re: Now that we have Shawn Marion, What would you rather???

Quote:
Originally Posted by RaininThrees
It's Miami's pick the first year the Raps make the playoffs after this year to2014, I believe.

Are you serious? Why the hell would Colangelo agree to that?

This trade is terrible! It better be a second round!?
Toni is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-17-2009, 07:42 AM   #29
RaininThrees
Meats Don't Clash
 
RaininThrees's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Ontario, Canada
Posts: 4,997
RaininThrees is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterRaininThrees is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterRaininThrees is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterRaininThrees is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterRaininThrees is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterRaininThrees is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterRaininThrees is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterRaininThrees is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterRaininThrees is considered a brilliant InsideHoops poster
Default Re: Now that we have Shawn Marion, What would you rather???

Quote:
Originally Posted by Toni
Are you serious? Why the hell would Colangelo agree to that?

This trade is terrible! It better be a second round!?


Nope... first rounder... it's not as bad as you might think. If the Raps make the playoffs, the pick Miami gets will be high enough that the player Miami would have the opportunity to pick would probably not be an impact player... if the Raps tank every year between now and 2014, they still get all their first round picks (and Colangelo definitely won't be the GM, so what does he care) in those years.

That $3 Mill the Raps got back as cash is also key to this, and would allow them to buy back a pick at a later date (and with some teams being pretty cash strapped this year, I think the opportunity to grab a 'free' $3 Mill is definitely a possibility)... provided they bank the cash.
RaininThrees is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-17-2009, 08:14 AM   #30
RAPSCANWIN
Keeping the Bench Warm
 
RAPSCANWIN's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: In a Field of Potatoes
Posts: 915
RAPSCANWIN has decent reputation
Default Re: Now that we have Shawn Marion, What would you rather???

Just a thought on Tanking....


Does a team purposely tank a season, literally go out every game with the mind set that what ever happens make sure we lose this game.

or

Does a team just get into a losing funk and basically doesnt give the effort to win games that they might otherwise win. Thinking that the season is a write off anyway so when the get down by 10 points or so they give up.

Its 2 different things morally.

To give up because of a defeatist attitude is bad.

But to lose on purpose for draft position is unbelievably bad.
RAPSCANWIN is offline   Reply With Quote
This NBA Basketball News Website Sponsored by:
Reply


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 12:03 AM.




NBA Basketball Forum Key Links:
InsideHoops Home
NBA Rumors
Basketball Blog
NBA Daily Recaps
NBA Videos
Fantasy Basketball
NBA Mock Draft
NBA Free Agents
All-Star Weekend
---
High School Basketball
Streetball
---
InsideHoops Twitter
Search Our Site













Powered by vBulletin Version 3.5.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd. Terms of Use/Service | Privacy Policy