Message Board Basketball Forum - InsideHoops

Go Back   Message Board Basketball Forum - InsideHoops > NBA Team Forums > Phoenix Suns Forum

Phoenix Suns Forum Phoenix Suns forum - Phoenix Suns message board

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 10-01-2006, 10:07 PM   #31
final.wrath
Banned
 
final.wrath's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 3,733
Default

no its not. you're saying if Kg went to the cavs thats not an auto championship? i understand that no championship is automatic but putting Kg on a team like the cavs, spurs, or maybe even lakers are damn near close to auto-championships.

i'd say that concept is alot more sound than saying Marion is better than KG.
final.wrath is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2006, 10:08 PM   #32
XxNeXuSxX
The Master Debater
 
XxNeXuSxX's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: UConn
Posts: 8,000
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by joni
Saying addition of ANY one player to ANY one team is an auto championship .... is even nearer.

No it's not, you are trying to say Kevin Garnett is WORSE than Marion? You are delusional, and I don't say that to Suns fans much, at all.
XxNeXuSxX is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2006, 10:55 PM   #33
joni
I hit open layups
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 181
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by final.wrath
no its not. you're saying if Kg went to the cavs thats not an auto championship? i understand that no championship is automatic but putting Kg on a team like the cavs, spurs, or maybe even lakers are damn near close to auto-championships.

i'd say that concept is alot more sound than saying Marion is better than KG.

If you check back and don't have a problem with reading comprehension, you'll see that I never claimed Marion was better than Garnett although I'm not sure I'd want the trade. My post to Knickfan4ever was pointing out the irony of a Knicks fan whose team finished 29th out of 30 dissing any other team in the league. Well, okay, he'd have a small degree of credibility if he went on the Blazer board to talk trash.

The addition of any one player to any one team can make a huge difference and could well make a mediocre team a contender or make a good team even better, but there are too many other factors involved to say it would be an "auto" championship. Take any one player from this year's champion team -- Wade, Shaq, whoever -- hell, take Kobe -- and send them to any one of the top tier teams in the league and it would not guarantee that team a championship.

You say you understand that there's no such thing as an "automatic" championship. That was my point.
joni is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2006, 11:52 PM   #34
final.wrath
Banned
 
final.wrath's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 3,733
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by joni
If you check back and don't have a problem with reading comprehension, you'll see that I never claimed Marion was better than Garnett although I'm not sure I'd want the trade. My post to Knickfan4ever was pointing out the irony of a Knicks fan whose team finished 29th out of 30 dissing any other team in the league. Well, okay, he'd have a small degree of credibility if he went on the Blazer board to talk trash.

The addition of any one player to any one team can make a huge difference and could well make a mediocre team a contender or make a good team even better, but there are too many other factors involved to say it would be an "auto" championship. Take any one player from this year's champion team -- Wade, Shaq, whoever -- hell, take Kobe -- and send them to any one of the top tier teams in the league and it would not guarantee that team a championship.

You say you understand that there's no such thing as an "automatic" championship. That was my point.

yeah but you're being kind of petty about it. everyone knows nothing is guaranteed in this world but despite that we should be able to say that lebron james and kevin garnett on the same team is an automatic championship. its inherently understood that nothing is truly automatic but the word is still used. thats like someone saying "see you tommorow"...and you sayng "there's no guarantee that tommorow will ever come to pass".

And it isn't ironic for a knicks fan to criticize another team. Since we're being so picky about words, you used ironic out of context. But besides that...no matter how good or bad his home team is he has the right to express his oppinion about any team he wants. You dont have to root for a good team to have a good oppinion or vice versa.

I think the Suns fans are just miffed that he said Stoudamire wouldn't be coming back himself. Haven't you guys realized that? His injury will stay with him for the rest of his career man. That doesn't mean he can't adapt and become a smarter player to compensate (a la Webber), but I think its fair to say that its questionable if he will ever be able to bang in the post like he used to.
final.wrath is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-02-2006, 12:35 AM   #35
joni
I hit open layups
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 181
Default

Okay, okay -- scratch "ironic" and go back to my original "hilarious."

BTW, there's only one "p" in opinion. Really there is ...........

So much for the grammar and spelling lesson.

I don't think Amare will be 100% until the end of next season -- if then. Supposedly it can take 18 months to 2 years to recover from that surgery. But on a happier note, we do think 80-85% of Amare is still better than 100% of most. We'll see how it goes.

Peace.
joni is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-02-2006, 12:58 AM   #36
04mzwach
NBA sixth man of the year
 
04mzwach's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 7,077
Default

KG's numbers would be better on the Suns or Nash team. Marion's numbers wouldn't be very good without Nash. KG would be shooting about 60% on a team like the suns because he'd have so many easy shots. KG creates his own shot almost everytime he shoots...I can't say the same thing about Marion so I don't really know how well he is at it but I know he's not a very consistent shooter around all parts of the floor like KG is. KG is just as good of a 3 point shooter as Marion, yet he doesn't take them so he's more efficient.

KG would be MVP next season if he played for the Suns easily. Marion shoots like 70% inside the paint because Nash gets him lay-ups and wide open dunks everytime. Basically KG destroys him in every aspect of the game. Plus I think KG will be productive just as long as Marion will still because he has the most passion to stay conditioned than anybody in the game. He's going to be good for at least 4 more years. There's nobody with his work ethic.

Last edited by 04mzwach : 10-02-2006 at 01:02 AM.
04mzwach is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-02-2006, 01:59 AM   #37
STATfan32
I hit open 5-footers
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 248
Default

i just wanna say that after reading all the comments and debates in this thread i have realized one thing......
the knicks fan that posted on here apparently has an IQ that is MUCH MUCH LESS THAN THAT OF A ROCK
STATfan32 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-02-2006, 02:06 AM   #38
Rab
Jared Dudley's #1 Fan
 
Rab's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: The Purple Palace
Posts: 2,869
Default

Wow, this got heated. Let's see, where to start? Maybe I'll take out the trash first.

Quote:
**** no you dumbass. God Dammit you are the stupidest poster on ISH.

Well, well, isn't this like the jackass calling the donkey "long ears" You have done nothing but show that you are the most worthless pile of dog crap on ISH....and that's not good considering the number of worthless piles of dog crap that exist here at times. Times are so incredibly bad in Knick town, that you feel a need to bash teams that will actually win games this year. It's so nice to see that silly New York pride come out to make you look like a fool.

Quote:
So you are agreeing with him? BRILLIANT! Seriously, the entire Suns fan population put together has the IQ of a rock.

This comes from the same moron who can't think of any other insults to sling at Amare than "soft as corn". Oh wait, there was one more..."soft as cheese". Neither of which make you sound like the brightest human being in the world. Also, the fact that you have claimed over and over that the Knicks will be good (not in this thread, but if you really want me to dig up instances, I will) proves your inability to comprehend much of anything other than swear words. You are truly a waste of space. If you want to speak of team population with IQ's of a rock, look no further than your beloved Knicks GM and head coach, Isaiah Thomas, since this is really the area where you'd like to have someone with a brain. Say what you want about fans, but basically when it comes down to it, the Suns organization has the brains, and the Knicks, well...it just goes without saying that they'll be bottom feeding again, even with all their "talent". Have fun watching your loser organization.

Quote:
Yeah right, the healed Amare is soft as corn like I said. Did you see him play in the summer league? I did. You were too busy picking your nose at day camp little boy. Amare has starting shooting jump shots instead of playing in the paint. He'll only be another Diaw now. You don't know what you are talking about kid, stop trying to be as dumb as Wally World.

Okay, if you think the healed Amare was the one in the summer leagues, than you really are an idiot. That was his first dose of competive play since he played in April. There is a huge difference in then and now. Fool. Maybe you should lay off the butt darts for a little while and pay attention to things for a change before you run your mouth like you know something.

Well, that's enough of that ree-ree for one night. Let's move on to the real topic at hand here.

Quote:
Come on, KG on your team is an auto championship, saying Marion gives you a better chance is near retarded.

I have to agree here...though the term "auto championship" is a little bit of a stretch for me. I do agree that the chances of a championship increase with the addition of KG in favor of Marion. We are talking about a former MVP of the league. A guy who despite being surrounded by mediocre talent, plays his heart out every night, and carries his teams. Even the year they had Spree and Sam, KG is the one that carried them. If they had Marion in the place of KG on that team, they're lucky to be a 6-8 seed. There really is no comparison between the two. Though numbers might be similar, I would feel much better with KG recieving the ball in the playoffs to create something than I would Marion.

I love Shawn, but there is nothing anyone can say that would prove to me otherwise that KG would be better here than Marion. He's not on KG's level....period.

Last edited by Rab : 10-02-2006 at 02:13 AM.
Rab is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-02-2006, 02:25 PM   #39
STATfan32
I hit open 5-footers
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 248
Default

Rab i laughed out loud several times while reading those comments they were great... i still just dont think i could bring myself to trade marion and i dont know why
STATfan32 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-02-2006, 03:45 PM   #40
joni
I hit open layups
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 181
Default Marion for KG

"I love Shawn, but there is nothing anyone can say that would prove to me otherwise that KG would be better here than Marion. He's not on KG's level....period."

Career-wise, Marion may not be the complete player Garnett is, but in my mind the key word in your comment is HERE. KG's always been the #1 option in Minny, their superstar who carries the team. Could he back off from that status even a little bit in Phoenix, and if not, how would that affect the chemistry and cohesiveness we had last year despite all the potholes along the road?

Shawn's been a Sun his whole career. He may grouse a little about lack of respect from the media, etc., but on the court he's all-out, doing exactly what they need him to do -- that being a little of everything. He's quick, his athleticism is sometimes amazing, and he's the glue that holds it all together game after game. Judging from his demeanor, he has a great time doing it.

I've seen a lot of comments that Marion's only good because of Nash. His stats are up the last 3-4 years (Nash came back two years ago, right?). From all reports, they've turned down offers for Marion on a regular basis so obviously other GMs see his value, and that with him being highest paid on the roster.

The window of opportunity for the Suns isn't that big a window right now. Regardless of where they each stand on the talent list, even a straight-up trade Marion for KG would be taking a chance. It might work, and it might be a negative. That, along with a 7-year attachment to our Suns "lifer" would lead me to vote no deal, even if that makes me a dumbass.
joni is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-02-2006, 05:11 PM   #41
Rab
Jared Dudley's #1 Fan
 
Rab's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: The Purple Palace
Posts: 2,869
Default

Quote:
Career-wise, Marion may not be the complete player Garnett is, but in my mind the key word in your comment is HERE. KG's always been the #1 option in Minny, their superstar who carries the team. Could he back off from that status even a little bit in Phoenix, and if not, how would that affect the chemistry and cohesiveness we had last year despite all the potholes along the road?

You bring up some valid points here. There is no doubt that the Suns with KG would have some chemistry issues. That's a given. No team can avoid that when bringing in new players. The team will face that with Amare coming back this season, but it's not something that teams couldn't adapt to. He has always been the #1 option yes, but KG is also a very unselfish players. In fact, some would say that's his downfall at times. Don't you think that type of player would thrive in this system? Someone who can score when called upon, yet has no problems giving the ball up at the right time? I think he might be willing to accept a lesser role here. He has played so hard in Minny, it has to be taking a toll on his health, and would be happy to defer to others for a change. I think only selfish players would not work that well here.

Quote:
Shawn's been a Sun his whole career. He may grouse a little about lack of respect from the media, etc., but on the court he's all-out, doing exactly what they need him to do -- that being a little of everything. He's quick, his athleticism is sometimes amazing, and he's the glue that holds it all together game after game. Judging from his demeanor, he has a great time doing it.

Dude, I love Shawn, and I love how he does a lot of little things that the Suns need. But, other than perimeter defense, what does he do that is so much better than KG? Not much if you ask me. Does KG not look like he has fun playing the game? The guy plays with more intensity than just about anyone in league. I would love for Shawn to be here until he retires, but this is a trade the Suns should make given the chance.

Quote:
I've seen a lot of comments that Marion's only good because of Nash. His stats are up the last 3-4 years (Nash came back two years ago, right?). From all reports, they've turned down offers for Marion on a regular basis so obviously other GMs see his value, and that with him being highest paid on the roster.

Co-sign. I have been one of the few that argue that Marion is good without Nash for a while now. His numbers reflect this. It doesn't hurt him to have Nash, but I wouldn't contribute his numbers soley to Nash. Marion has a lot of value to this team, no doubt, which is why they have spurned trade offers for him, but I guarantee that if anyone of the big 3 gets traded, it will be Marion, so obviously they are willing to listen, and if the right deal came along, I think they'd pull the trigger.

Quote:
The window of opportunity for the Suns isn't that big a window right now. Regardless of where they each stand on the talent list, even a straight-up trade Marion for KG would be taking a chance. It might work, and it might be a negative. That, along with a 7-year attachment to our Suns "lifer" would lead me to vote no deal, even if that makes me a dumbass

Sure it would be a risk, but for a player of KG's talent and ability, I would do it. I wouldn't say this for a lot of players, but in his case, yes. It doesn't make you a dumbass if you feel differently.

Last edited by Rab : 10-02-2006 at 05:30 PM.
Rab is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-03-2006, 09:00 PM   #42
PhxFanAtBirth
High School JV MVP
 
PhxFanAtBirth's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Placetown
Posts: 623
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by KnickFan4Life
Are you retarded? When did I say the Knicks were going all the way? Amare's injury made him a total pu$$y. He is scared of contact because he doesn't want to get any boo boo's. He will not be the dominant force he once was, and Suns fans will see the truth that they are o so blind to.

Listen up you little ****..... We want well informed and knowledgable fans on this forum that includes all fans. So either you wise up or get the **** out of our forum.
PhxFanAtBirth is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-04-2006, 10:47 PM   #43
mavsfan4zindagi
Decent college freshman
 
mavsfan4zindagi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 1,657
Default

I think Minnesota would be the one saying no to this.

Only delusional Suns fans wouldn't take KG, prime or not, for Marion.
mavsfan4zindagi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-07-2006, 04:35 PM   #44
KnickFan4Life
Banned
 
KnickFan4Life's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Amare32 is a snitch
Posts: 142
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Amare32
Says the guy who thinks the suns will only win 50 games and that Marion is the suns only other good player

moron
When did I say Marion was the only good other player? Stop smoking those joints. You are all probably having nightmares right now since Amare will never be the same.
KnickFan4Life is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-07-2006, 04:38 PM   #45
KnickFan4Life
Banned
 
KnickFan4Life's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Amare32 is a snitch
Posts: 142
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by STATfan32
i just wanna say that after reading all the comments and debates in this thread i have realized one thing......
the knicks fan that posted on here apparently has an IQ that is MUCH MUCH LESS THAN THAT OF A ROCK
Says the idiot with the name STATfan32. Ask any unbiased person like myself, Amare will never be the same. You sir are the smartest person with down syndrome I have ever met.
KnickFan4Life is offline   Reply With Quote
This NBA Basketball News Website Sponsored by:
Reply


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 09:14 PM.




NBA Basketball Forum Key Links:
InsideHoops Home
NBA Rumors
Basketball Blog
NBA Daily Recaps
NBA Videos
Fantasy Basketball
NBA Mock Draft
NBA Free Agents
All-Star Weekend
---
High School Basketball
Streetball
---
InsideHoops Twitter
Search Our Site













Powered by vBulletin Version 3.5.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd. Terms of Use/Service | Privacy Policy