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Old 03-19-2009, 04:06 PM   #16
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Default Re: Are you letting the Nets down?

thanks for introducing yourselves, guys.

if you have a moment, answer these questions about your nets history and stuff:
http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=93607
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Old 03-19-2009, 04:17 PM   #17
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Default Re: Are you letting the Nets down?

I am a die hard nets fan even when they move i will be a nets fan i just dont post here...i love them so much i work for them as a camera man at the izod center. Not tv just the jumbo screens
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Old 03-20-2009, 01:49 AM   #18
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Default Re: Are you letting the Nets down?

I wanted to reply to this thread a while ago but you know how long it can take to get your account activated.

I am not letting the Nets down even though I live in San Francisco where nobody has ever heard of the team. Except one crazy guy at a bar, but I digress. I have gone to three games this year- one at Arco, one at Izod against the Bulls, and one at Oracle. That last horrible game in Oakland was the worst sporting event I have ever attended. To put a long story short, the Nets do not have enough athletic wings to compete with a team like that.

The Warriors game totally dispirited me. I just took it as a sign that this year it is not meant to be. Devin getting hurt just confirmed it. I can't bring myself to openly root against my Nets but a better draft position has crossed my mind a few times. Everybody should be watching the NCAA tournament mining for the next Nets gem.

I know a lot of fans are discouraged since the RJ trade. I love RJ but I think the Nets have been making all the right moves. Instead of focusing on the negative and whining about Lawrence Frank I am looking forward to:

1) Brook Lopez finishing the season strong enough to come in the top 2 in ROY voting. He should win it outright, and the 8 assists last night helps, but Rose will probably be the award's recipient.

2) Vince Carter and Yi finish strong. VC so he can be traded for good "assets" and Yi because I think they were right about him. I know, you think I am crazy? Yi has improved on defense and showed flashes of playing with passion. I think he needs a full off-season with Kiki and he will be much improved. He and Brook playing efficient basketball is enough to get us back to the playoffs in April 2010.

3) Hopefully Frank will realize they have already missed the playoffs. He should ignore match-ups and play more of Yi, Anderson, and CDR.

4) And lastly Sean Williams and Josh Boone get some mental counseling. What is up with these dudes?

What do you guys think of my crazy views on the Nets? Glad I have some fellow fans to gab with.
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Old 03-20-2009, 03:43 PM   #19
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Default Re: Are you letting the Nets down?

great post, and welcome.
thanks for signing up.

re: lopez,
i haven't been following the other rookies much, but with harris out lopez now has a chance to make a real run for ROY.
i love that fact that dave d reported thorn or vandy saying that 'in the future the offense is going to run through lopez'. that is the right way to do it IMO since PG-driven offenses generally don't work.

re: carter,
i don't mind trading carter but with the size of his contract and his age it's hard to imagine getting anything much for him. but even past his peak he'll be an above-average SG for the next couple years we have him, so i can live with that.

re: yi,
it's good to know someone out there is optimistic about him.
when it comes to the team i'm a very patient person (except for this thread, heh), but i just don't know what to think about yi. it's also discouraging that the chinese association demands that their players go back to china during the offseason, because yi still seems to need lots of work which he could have gotten if he was to stay in the states.

re: frank,
i think he only knows one way to coach, and that is always to try to win. i believe that is exactly how thorn thinks, also.
remember that there are near-daily scrimmages and it's not like bench players only watch film and get no court experience. anderson and CDR can improve quite a lot even if they stay stuck on the bench provided IF they work hard in practice and scrimmages.

re: williams and boone,
agree. and from the last article it sounds like if williams refuses to get counselling then it will be a factor in how much PT he gets. and as much as the guy has frustrated me at times with his immaturity and such, he does seem to be someone who really cares about his team, for example as seen in his profuse apology about the denver incident. so my guess is that he does take the counselling.
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Old 03-21-2009, 07:10 PM   #20
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Default Re: Are you letting the Nets down?

Quote:
re: lopez,
i haven't been following the other rookies much, but with harris out lopez now has a chance to make a real run for ROY.
i love that fact that dave d reported thorn or vandy saying that 'in the future the offense is going to run through lopez'. that is the right way to do it IMO since PG-driven offenses generally don't work.

Can't agree more! I have been following the rookie class closely and Lopez is the clear choice if you really look at it. I think the Nets decline since the early part of the season is the result of the dribble drive. It worked in the beginning when teams were out of sync and Harris and Carter were healthy. However, over the season's course it has placed too much of the offensive load on the guards. Next year Lopez and Harris will both serve as offensive anchors for a potent attack.

Quote:
re: carter,
i don't mind trading carter but with the size of his contract and his age it's hard to imagine getting anything much for him. but even past his peak he'll be an above-average SG for the next couple years we have him, so i can live with that.

No idea how that one will play out. I like Carter but they should cut ties with him if they can.

Quote:
re: yi,
it's good to know someone out there is optimistic about him.
when it comes to the team i'm a very patient person (except for this thread, heh), but i just don't know what to think about yi. it's also discouraging that the chinese association demands that their players go back to china during the offseason, because yi still seems to need lots of work which he could have gotten if he was to stay in the states.

It is really hard to be patient with Yi and not worth it if the Nets don't get him for most of each summer. Yi has looked good on defense, you can see the skill set, and it doesn't appear that he has focus or motivation issues. I think he needs to play and the learning curve is just going to be steeper than most players. I can say this: they are better today with Simmons and Yi in the lineup than if RJ was still here. I just don't like Richard's game anymore.

Quote:
re: frank,
i think he only knows one way to coach, and that is always to try to win. i believe that is exactly how thorn thinks, also.
remember that there are near-daily scrimmages and it's not like bench players only watch film and get no court experience. anderson and CDR can improve quite a lot even if they stay stuck on the bench provided IF they work hard in practice and scrimmages.

Frank is so unappreciated by Nets fans it drives me crazy. In a league filled with incompetent men he is a brilliant mind. Nobody is better prepared or as well liked by his players. He has his limitations but firing him would be a stupid move by the Nets franchise.

Quote:
re: williams and boone,
agree. and from the last article it sounds like if williams refuses to get counselling then it will be a factor in how much PT he gets. and as much as the guy has frustrated me at times with his immaturity and such, he does seem to be someone who really cares about his team, for example as seen in his profuse apology about the denver incident. so my guess is that he does take the counselling.

I certainly hope SWill gets some counseling- he is in obvious need of help processing his emotions. I am a Uconn fan so it is hard to say this:JBoone needs a change of scenery.

Well the Nets have gone and won two in a row hurting their draft position. It has been worth it to see the emergence of CDR though. Nice talkin' gigantes.
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Old 03-22-2009, 02:01 PM   #21
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Default Re: Are you letting the Nets down?

Quote:
Originally Posted by BrooklynNets
I can say this: they are better today with Simmons and Yi in the lineup than if RJ was still here. I just don't like Richard's game anymore.
i became soured on RJ's game his last season here.
IMO he changed from the ultimate do-it-all guy and strong defender to someone looking too much for his jump shot.

Quote:
Frank is so unappreciated by Nets fans it drives me crazy. In a league filled with incompetent men he is a brilliant mind. Nobody is better prepared or as well liked by his players. He has his limitations but firing him would be a stupid move by the Nets franchise.
i mostly agree, although i'm not sure about the 'brilliant' part. i would tend to reserve that word for PJ, pop, and maybe a sloan or larry brown.

but yea, he's a very competant coach IMO.
true, i could stand to see him replaced by a saunders, jordan or fratello mostly because changing coaches is a way of re-motivating players when they've become too complacent. but otherwise i've always liked him and would not have a problem with him staying.

Quote:
I certainly hope SWill gets some counseling- he is in obvious need of help processing his emotions. I am a Uconn fan so it is hard to say this:JBoone needs a change of scenery.
boone, i'd like to see him get one more offseason and one more chance, mainly because he's been such a solid guy and really came through in the clutch last year. unfortunately his contract is up this year IIRC, so making a decision on him could be very tricky. if he took it, i might want to give him a one year deal.

re: williams, this story is not encouraging. not encouraging at all.
how many more incidents are we going to have to deal with while this kid grows up?
http://www.nj.com/nets/index.ssf/200..._says_new.html

Quote:
Well the Nets have gone and won two in a row hurting their draft position. It has been worth it to see the emergence of CDR though. Nice talkin' gigantes. :cheers:
same. anytime. :D
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Old 03-22-2009, 05:00 PM   #22
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Good comments. I stand by the Frank being brilliant part. I would put him way ahead of Saunders and Fratello (especially the Czar he seems too anachronistic for today's nba). I would also put him ahead of Brown- Frank has the same basketball mind without all the baggage. Yes Brown has the experience but some day so will Frank. I love EJ and think he is a great coach. To me Frank and EJ are interchangable: EJ is a better offensive coach that can motivate players, Frank is better at defense and keeping the locker room together.

The motivation thing is a tricky problem. First you have to determine if the Nets' sporadic and sometimes lethargic play is due to lack of motivation or fatigue. I just think an offense that requires constant cuts by VC, KD and Harris with everybody else standing around is flawed. Frank to a certain extent has realized the limitations of the dribble drive. Think about it: how much better would Yi be if we were still running the Princetown offense all the time? He would be perfect executing the back cuts and screen and rolls rather than waiting on the wings to hit a 3.

I think when you can a coach to motivate players you have to be careful. Sometimes it can work out like when the Nets won 13 straight after Byron was fired. Too often it just serves to undermine the front office and take accountability away from the players.

When evaluating this season I feel like the Nets are ahead of schedule. They have repeatedly been overmatched and reliant on young, inexperienced players to pick up heavy minutes. Yet through it all they still remain about the middle of the pack in the NBA. I think the Nets will have a legitimate shot at finishing around .500 next year and fighting for the playoffs. Given all this it just becomes inappropriate to fire Frank now. Plus canning him now would just create chaos so close to the regular season's end.

I am happy about this year as it has been much more enjoyable to follow than the last few years. I don't want the Nets to make the playoffs unless they are an above .500 team. It doesn't seem like an accomplishment to me to back into the playoffs.

Oh well, I love talking with other passionate NJ fans! Let's keep it up. Time to go watch Lebron.
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Old 03-22-2009, 08:00 PM   #23
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Default Re: Are you letting the Nets down?

ah well, can't beat the cavs when your 3pt shooting is off so badly..

Quote:
Originally Posted by BrooklynNets
I stand by the Frank being brilliant part.
okay, but why specifically?
assuming you don't throw that term around lightly then it would seem to mean that you think frank is a lot better than most coaches out there.

so what is it that he does that you think makes him so special?
(not trying to be confrontational, but i'm curious...)

Quote:
I just think an offense that requires constant cuts by VC, KD and Harris with everybody else standing around is flawed. Frank to a certain extent has realized the limitations of the dribble drive.
agreed.
teams adjusted to it pretty quickly and it's turned the nets into too much of an AI-style offense with harris overhandling and not getting people involved enough.

Quote:
Think about it: how much better would Yi be if we were still running the Princetown offense all the time? He would be perfect executing the back cuts and screen and rolls rather than waiting on the wings to hit a 3.
i don't know, but he certainly has been a disappointment as a set shooter.
more motion certainly couldn't make him any worse...

Quote:
Given all this it just becomes inappropriate to fire Frank now. Plus canning him now would just create chaos so close to the regular season's end.
yea, i fail to see what firing frank right now would accomplish. did you hear a rumor or something?

if i was thorn i would definitely wait til the offseason if i was going to change coaches.

Quote:
I am happy about this year as it has been much more enjoyable to follow than the last few years.
yea, this has been an underrated season.
almost no pressure at all and at least two huge pleasant surprises. hopefully CDR keeps getting burn and he can turn into the 3rd huge pleasant surprise.
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Old 03-23-2009, 09:07 PM   #24
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Default Re: Are you letting the Nets down?

Quote:
Originally Posted by gigantes
ah well, can't beat the cavs when your 3pt shooting is off so badly...


okay, but why specifically?
assuming you don't throw that term around lightly then it would seem to mean that you think frank is a lot better than most coaches out there.

so what is it that he does that you think makes him so special?
(not trying to be confrontational, but i'm curious...)

First, let me state that I think most of the NBA is a joke. I feel like its run by people who are ruining the league and has a lot of owners/front office people that don't know what they are doing. Exhibit A1) David Stern A2) the New York Knicks (Dolans, Thomas). I mean how many former great players have ruined franchises lately- Mchale, Jordan, Kerr just to name a few. No other sport seems to do this at such a rate as basketball.

But I still love it! Thankfully the Nets are not one of these organizations. Since Thorn has run the show everything has gone pretty smoothly. Yeah, there have been bumps in the road but Thorn has pulled this franchise through the tumultuous times of Ratner and the Kidd saga. So when Rod Thorn says a little red haired guy in his 30's who never played a lick is one of the brightest minds and most prepared individual in basketball I believe him.

But you can also see it if you look beyond his inability to market himself. The guy will go on and on after a loss. It drives everyone nuts. And yet if you listen he understands every facet of why they lost. He is committed to every little detail and he can do so without driving his players (if not the fans) mad.

Frank has had his challenges. Last year was a disaster and I was almost ready to throw in the towel. Almost. My chief complaint was that Frank was always going to be the anti-Byron. He wouldn't understand what it's like to play and how to motivate.

And then this year happened. Frank has brought along a roster filled with too many young kids who play the same position. He has adapted his offense to fit Harris and then adapted it again to incorporate Brook. He has benched his two stars for not playing with passion. He has offered sometimes blunt criticism of players even calling them out by name.

In summation, Frank has shown an adaptability and and willingness to learn to go along with his smarts and work ethic. I just don't see that from many coaches. In a sense he is just like Avery Johnson except he has avoided the stubbornness that got AJ canned. + Frank is so young he will only get better with more experience.

Quote:
agreed.
teams adjusted to it pretty quickly and it's turned the nets into too much of an AI-style offense with harris overhandling and not getting people involved enough.

Yeah. You can tell things are changing because Brook's assists are skyrocketing lately.

Quote:
i don't know, but he certainly has been a disappointment as a set shooter.
more motion certainly couldn't make him any worse...
ha ha. Be patient the dude is gassed. Plus they have a whole year before the "summer of 2010" to evaluate the guy.

Quote:
yea, i fail to see what firing frank right now would accomplish. did you hear a rumor or something?

if i was thorn i would definitely wait til the offseason if i was going to change coaches.

No. But the screaming for his head never ceases. They will be going into next season with him as their coach. If the plan progresses he stays. If the motivation issue/perception still lingers it may finally be the year he gets axed.

Quote:
yea, this has been an underrated season.
almost no pressure at all and at least two huge pleasant surprises. hopefully CDR keeps getting burn and he can turn into the 3rd huge pleasant surprise.
Wow, CDR is great! Glad to see him getting some chances.

Was my defense of Frank good enough? Am I magnifying his strengths or do I need to be more specific? Until next post...
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Old 03-24-2009, 12:31 PM   #25
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Default Re: Are you letting the Nets down?

well you and i are on very different pages about some things, galen. (galen is it?)

it's basically either say that or else write a book explaining in detail.
i don't feel like writing a book ATM, but maybe some other time. :P
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Old 03-25-2009, 03:08 PM   #26
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Default Re: Are you letting the Nets down?

Quote:
Originally Posted by gigantes
well you and i are on very different pages about some things, galen. (galen is it?)

it's basically either say that or else write a book explaining in detail.
i don't feel like writing a book ATM, but maybe some other time. :P

Yup, Galen it is! Don't blame you I got a little carried away bashing the NBA but they make me so frustrated some times!

I still think in 20 years when Frank is still at least a decade from retirement people will look back on this thread and laugh. I really believe he has special things coming in his career- especially if the Nets still have a shot at Lebron.

In other news, is Yi letting the Nets down. Did you read the blog post on NetsDaily about his schedule. Let's just hope the guy is gassed and not as awful as he has looked at times the last two years.
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Old 03-25-2009, 03:25 PM   #27
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Default Re: Are you letting the Nets down?

Quote:
Originally Posted by BrooklynNets
...especially if the Nets still have a shot at Lebron.
as of the current situation, i don't think lebron is going anywhere. because the situation is a superb one in cleveland.

he can make the most salary by staying put and has infinitely greater chances of winning a championship with the cavs.

so the nets and knicks and whoever else can keep dreaming...

Quote:
In other news, is Yi letting the Nets down. Did you read the blog post on NetsDaily about his schedule. Let's just hope the guy is gassed and not as awful as he has looked at times the last two years.
yea, read it.
"netincome" is the most dutiful and intelligent nets watcher i know of, other than dave d.

not that i buy the idea of yi being 'gassed', but at the very least his schedule is indeed demanding.

IIRC, netincome also defended yi very effectively in this raging dispute:
http://www.netsdaily.com/forum/viewt...d 932104ea803
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Old 03-26-2009, 11:44 PM   #28
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Default Re: Are you letting the Nets down?

Sorry guys to not posting often here in the team's forum. I was just so busy the last couple of weeks.
I'm a huge Nets fan simply because of Vince... and of course with the addition of Devin in the middle of last season it became a more interesting team.

I like the fact that Brook has been improving every game, he adds every game to his learning experience to become one of the best center or if not the best in the league. I like the fact that CDR has been playing well the last couple of games and Keyon is contributing well also.

I was just wondering what happened to Yi after his injury. He was playing good prior to his injury. Did he lost all his confidence or he is just an inconsistent player?

ANd also Vince and Devin is the heart and soul of team, Devin's injury is also hurting the team. ANd is age really catching up Vince? Can he really not be an elite player now in the league?

Thank you Gigantes for making thread like this, we can here every Nets fans voice out their opinions, thoughts and comments about our team.
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Old 03-27-2009, 02:10 AM   #29
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Default Re: Are you letting the Nets down?

hey k-vil, check it out- deep thoughts from the mind of yi jianlian:
http://www.netsdaily.com/blog/?p=669
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Old 03-28-2009, 10:28 AM   #30
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Default Re: Are you letting the Nets down?

Quote:
Originally Posted by gigantes
hey k-vil, check it out- deep thoughts from the mind of yi jianlian:
http://www.netsdaily.com/blog/?p=669
thanks man!
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