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Old 06-01-2009, 03:27 PM   #31
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Default Re: News on Lance Stephenson courtesy of Yahoosports

Quote:
Originally Posted by A.M.G.
Lance is going to have a rude awakening once he gets to the NBA. If he gets to the NBA. Teams will not take his ****, even if he is that good, which he isn't.
Lance gets to the NBA unless he suffers a debilitating injury or commits a serious crime.

Quote:
And he should damn well choose a school, or go to Europe (I think he seriously might be considering this, otherwise why wait this long). And his father needs to **** off.
They've already ruled out Europe, and Lance's father has done his best to shield Lance away from outsiders who could ruin him.
He promoted Lance better than I can remember of a player being promoted, He brought him down to the Rucker when he was 12 or 13.

Quote:
I've seriously never heard of a circus act like this kid, from what I've seen he isn't even a lottery type talent, yet he seems to have more ego and arrogance than any top recruit in recent memory. Hopefully he just flames out ala Derrick Caracter, a similar idiot.
Nobody in 2010 is a surefire lottery type talent until 3/4 through the season.

What makes you think hes an arrogant, egotistical person?
I've been following this kid for years(no stalking), at worst he has the speech of 13 year old.

Derrick Caracter is a sad story, he began to flame out in HS and it continued on to Louisville.
Latest I've heard is hes working this summer to play for UTEP later this year.
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Old 06-01-2009, 03:30 PM   #32
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Default Re: News on Lance Stephenson courtesy of Yahoosports

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Old 06-01-2009, 03:43 PM   #33
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Default Re: News on Lance Stephenson courtesy of Yahoosports

Watch Lance end up at Mississippi State.

Lance going to Europe would be a complete train wreck of a decision and he'd get no playing time in any of the better leagues with the exception of the French league.

Once he gets to college and can longer bull his way into the lane, he'll be exposed and is definitely not a one and done, sure fire superstar that he's being made out to be.
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Old 06-01-2009, 03:47 PM   #34
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Default Re: News on Lance Stephenson courtesy of Yahoosports

Quote:
Originally Posted by Interminator
OK.Sure.
Im sure Jordan, Wilt, Magic, and Bird are also referred to as the top high school basketball players ever.
No, they aren't. But Alcindor is.


Quote:
Felipe Lopez btw is my All-Time favorite player, but Lopez' accomplishments are not on par with what BR has accomplished as a HS player.
And Michael Jordan's college accomplishments aren't on par with Tyler Hansbrough's, by your way of defining accomplishment. The question is who the better player was, and team accomplishments aren't always the best definition of that.

Quote:
That has nothing to do with this, its completely irrelevant.

Sergio & Marcus were never on the level of player that Stephenson is, Im struggling to even take this seriously because BR is clearly one of the Top 3 HS basketball players in the class of 2009, while Sergio & Marcus were....
If it's so clear that Stephenson- please, quit calling him "BR," you sound like a jackass- is one of the top three players in '09, then why doesn't one single scouting service of note rank him as such? Only one had him ranked higher than 4th before his stock dropped with the postseason re-rankings.

Something being clear to fanboy cheerleaders and something being clear to level-headed people with strong basketball sensibilities remain, of course, two different things.

And obviously Stephenson is a better player than Sergio McClain or Marcus Griffin. That's kind of my point. In terms of team success, Sergio and Marcus were Stephenson's equal, if not better: they won four state championships in one of the best states of high school basketball, and a national championship. Sergio and Marcus were each individually accomplished; Serg was Mr. Basketball and Marcus was a McDonald's All-American. (As an aside, the best player on the team obviously was Frank Williams, who was a year younger.)

So, again, a list of accomplishments that are team-oriented doesn't necessarily tell us who the better player was, or else- and I hate to use him as an example again, but it's another easy one- you have to say Tyler Hansbrough was a better college player than Tim Duncan.

In high school basketball, individual stats don't necessarily tell much of the story either, because so many factors can be mitigating in that regard to much greater degree than even college basketball, which has plenty of such mitigating factors itself.

What this comes down to, then, is simply deciding who was better at playing basketball. You're talking about a bunch of guys who were all highly accomplished teamwise and individually, to the point where it's almost a wash. I've never, before you and all your infinite wisdom came along, seen anyone put Stephenson ahead of Lopez, Anderson or Marbury in the canon of New York basketball, let alone LEW F-CKING ALCINDOR, THE GREATEST PLAYER IN THE HISTORY OF HIGH SCHOOL BASKETBALL.


Quote:
Its getting to the point now where I'm starting to think you just flat out dont like Lance Stephenson as a player, think hes overrated, overhyped, etc. Can we just get this confirmed so I can stop wasting my time arguing with a biased person with a biased agenda.
I think you're overrating him. I don't think people with good basketball sensibilites are. He's considered one of the 15 best players in the nation, and he probably is. He's considered to have a massive attitude problem, which he pretty clearly does, along with being saddled by criminal and academic troubles.

I don't have an agenda, because there's nothing I'm trying to accomplish. I don't have a bias against him, and you'd be well-served by growing up and ditching this adolescent "anyone who doesn't adore my favorite player is a hater" line of thought. I'm fully capable of offering what I feel is an honest criticism about someone I don't have something personal against. Lance Stephenson never did anything to me, or to offend my basketball world, because a teenager with an attitude problem isn't exactly a new thing. I'm more than willing to see if he grows up, behaves himself and lets his talent shine in college and beyond, and I hope he does.

But right now, it's not hard to see why coaches would be- or, more likely, already have- shied away despite his immense talent. After all, guys with his kind of talent don't just get left off the USA team for no reason.

Even if I was trying to tear him down- I'm not; that's something I have no interest in- everything that could be said about him, most of it probably true, some of it perhaps not, already has been said.

Last edited by TheGame414 : 06-01-2009 at 03:49 PM.
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Old 06-01-2009, 03:56 PM   #35
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Default Re: News on Lance Stephenson courtesy of Yahoosports

Quote:
Originally Posted by Interminator
Wrong on what?
Because I simply judge talent and am willing to give a player praise if hes not receiving any from most so-called experts although hes a very good player.

I never said he was not a good player, but calling anyone the best player ever to come from NYC is going to be a very criticized statement. Especially in a place where there has been so much talent coming from it. This isn't Montana or South Dakota, this is New York. It's has a very deep and profound history of basketball talent. You can't expect everyone to agree with you when you go ahead and claim Lance Stephenson as the best player to come out of there.

Quote:
I said DJ Augustin should be a Top 5 Pick, considering how good of a PG he was on the college level and how there were players with less talent at PG being ranked above him.

Specifically Russell Westbrook in 08.

Does that make me somehow right that Jrue Holiday should be a Top 5 Pick because others rank him in the Top 5 on potential, when clearly he isnt even one of the 15 best players available.

No it doesn't make you right. Top 5 potential and top 5 pick are two different things. If by Top 5 you mean potential, then you should say 'potential', but if you mean pick you should say 'pick'. DJ was my favorite college player that year and I didn't have him in the top 5 pick.

Quote:
Am I wrong for considering Donte Greene a Top 5 pick back in like December of 07' where he was consistently ranked among the Top 5 picks on most Mocks before he went on a downward spiral through the 2nd half of the season to the pre-draft workouts.

I don't remember anyone saying he was a Top 5 pick. But what I do see is a guy who was caught up in the moment when he was playing well and not taking the time to break it down.

Quote:
Am I wrong for creating a talent evaluation of Javale McGee as if the Minnesota T'Wolves had the #1 pick?

Yes.

Quote:
Am I wrong for wondering why Tyler Hansbrough, in the context of college and individual success, would not be a Top 5 Pick?

Yes. Be the same as if you were to argue JJ Redick into a Top 5 pick slot.

Quote:
Your guys either dont exist or clearly dont know what they are talking about, you actually have Marbury over BR and then claimed Lamar Odom is over BR which is so comical from my point of view thats its out of pure respect for you on other topics I didnt drop this awhile ago.

Odom played out of state, but to many (and I'm sure he would identify himself as) he is considered a NYC talent. Same with Charlie V when he went to Blair Academy. These days it is common for a lot of inner-city talents to go on Prep routes, but to a lot of them they still define themselves as New Yorkers, and where they went to school is still rather irrelevant to me if they identify themselves as New York talent.

Regardless, like I said before, if you're going to claim someone to be the best player out of NYC you better know someone will challenge it because there has been so much talent in this city. This isn't Akron where the clear cut is LeBron. This isn't This is New York City. Don't act surprised if people are going to disagree with you.
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Old 06-01-2009, 03:59 PM   #36
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Default Re: News on Lance Stephenson courtesy of Yahoosports

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheGame414
No, they aren't. But Alcindor is.


And Michael Jordan's college accomplishments aren't on par with Tyler Hansbrough's, by your way of defining accomplishment. The question is who the better player was, and team accomplishments aren't always the best definition of that.

If it's so clear that Stephenson- please, quit calling him "BR," you sound like a jackass- is one of the top three players in '09, then why doesn't one single scouting service of note rank him as such? Only one had him ranked higher than 4th before his stock dropped with the postseason re-rankings.

Something being clear to fanboy cheerleaders and something being clear to level-headed people with strong basketball sensibilities remain, of course, two different things.

And obviously Stephenson is a better player than Sergio McClain or Marcus Griffin. That's kind of my point. In terms of team success, Sergio and Marcus were Stephenson's equal, if not better: they won four state championships in one of the best states of high school basketball, and a national championship. Sergio and Marcus were each individually accomplished; Serg was Mr. Basketball and Marcus was a McDonald's All-American. (As an aside, the best player on the team obviously was Frank Williams, who was a year younger.)

So, again, a list of accomplishments that are team-oriented doesn't necessarily tell us who the better player was, or else- and I hate to use him as an example again, but it's another easy one- you have to say Tyler Hansbrough was a better college player than Tim Duncan.

In high school basketball, individual stats don't necessarily tell much of the story either, because so many factors can be mitigating in that regard to much greater degree than even college basketball, which has plenty of such mitigating factors itself.

What this comes down to, then, is simply deciding who was better at playing basketball. You're talking about a bunch of guys who were all highly accomplished teamwise and individually, to the point where it's almost a wash. I've never, before you and all your infinite wisdom came along, seen anyone put Stephenson ahead of Lopez, Anderson or Marbury in the canon of New York basketball, let alone LEW F-CKING ALCINDOR, THE GREATEST PLAYER IN THE HISTORY OF HIGH SCHOOL BASKETBALL.


I think you're overrating him. I don't think people with good basketball sensibilites are. He's considered one of the 15 best players in the nation, and he probably is. He's considered to have a massive attitude problem, which he pretty clearly does, along with being saddled by criminal and academic troubles.

I don't have an agenda, because there's nothing I'm trying to accomplish. I don't have a bias against him, and you'd be well-served by growing up and ditching this adolescent "anyone who doesn't adore my favorite player is a hater" line of thought. I'm fully capable of offering what I feel is an honest criticism about someone I don't have something personal against. Lance Stephenson never did anything to me, or to offend my basketball world, because a teenager with an attitude problem isn't exactly a new thing. I'm more than willing to see if he grows up, behaves himself and lets his talent shine in college and beyond, and I hope he does.

But right now, it's not hard to see why coaches would be- or, more likely, already have- shied away despite his immense talent. After all, guys with his kind of talent don't just get left off the USA team for no reason.

Even if I was trying to tear him down- I'm not; that's something I have no interest in- everything that could be said about him, most of it probably true, some of it perhaps not, already has been said.
OK.
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Old 06-01-2009, 04:04 PM   #37
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Default Re: News on Lance Stephenson courtesy of Yahoosports

OK, I'll bite. What's "BR" stand for?
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Old 06-01-2009, 04:11 PM   #38
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Default Re: News on Lance Stephenson courtesy of Yahoosports

LOL.

When is this 'Interminator' poster gonna realize that the hype over Lance Stephenson is just not there anymore???

Ya 2 years ago you could say he's a sure fire NBA prospect, but not anymore.
Let alone coming out after 1 year???? hahahahahahahahaa.


There aint to many 6'3/4 2 gaurds in the league that cant shoot and dribble, and are well below average athletes as far as NBA standards.
This is not even considering the fact that he is a locker room nightmare and as a coach/GM you know your gonna have to put up w/ his bullsh!t. And his dad.

Lance peaked as a HS Fr/Soph because his body matured way faster then the other recruits.
This happens every year.

At this point, he is not an elite prospect. We all witnessed that at the MCdonalds game. The more other members of this class continue to catch up as far as physical development is concerned, the less Stephenson’s ability to overpower his way to the basket works.

Its funny how you mentioned "O wait till he gets onto a real weightlifting program."
No. Wait till all the other players in his class get on a weightlifting program. Lance is already maxed out physically, seeing as how he's had the same body since soph year. This is gonna inhabit his ability to bulldoze his way to the basket even more



Bottom line-
Lance Cannot play above the rim what so ever. Not only that, he is slow going side to side as well (lateral movement).
He takes bad shots, selfish play, terrible body language, cheap shots to the opposition, plenty of turnovers, predictably followed by him visibly blaming others for his own mistakes.


Forget about the NBA being a rude awakening, next year in college is going to be a rude awaking.


He has a lot of catching up to do if he wants to have even a shot at getting drafted.

Last edited by lukeridnour08 : 06-01-2009 at 04:13 PM.
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Old 06-01-2009, 04:11 PM   #39
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Default Re: News on Lance Stephenson courtesy of Yahoosports

Quote:
Originally Posted by InspiredLebowski
OK, I'll bite. What's "BR" stand for?
Born Ready.
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Old 06-01-2009, 04:12 PM   #40
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Default Re: News on Lance Stephenson courtesy of Yahoosports

Quote:
Originally Posted by InspiredLebowski
OK, I'll bite. What's "BR" stand for?

Born Ready.
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Old 06-01-2009, 04:13 PM   #41
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Default Re: News on Lance Stephenson courtesy of Yahoosports

Quote:
Originally Posted by lukeridnour08
LOL.

When is this 'Interminator' poster gonna realize that the hype over Lance Stephenson is just not there anymore???

Ya 2 years ago you could say he's a sure fire NBA prospect, but not anymore.
Let alone coming out after 1 year???? hahahahahahahahaa.


There aint to many 6'3/4 2 gaurds in the league that cant shoot and dribble, and are well below average athletes as far as NBA standards.
This is not even considering the fact that he is a locker room nightmare and as a coach/GM you know your gonna have to put up w/ his bullsh!t. And his dad.

Lance peaked as a HS Fr/Soph because his body matured way faster then the other recruits.
This happens every year.

At this point, he is not an elite prospect. We all witnessed that at the MCdonalds game. The more other members of this class continue to catch up as far as physical development is concerned, the less Stephenson’s ability to overpower his way to the basket works.

Its funny how you mentioned "O wait till he gets onto a real weightlifting program."
No. Wait till all the other players in his class get on a weightlifting program. Lance is already maxed out physically, seeing as how he's had the same body since soph year.



Bottom line-
Lance Cannot play above the rim what so ever. Not only that, he is slow going side to side as well (lateral movement).
He takes bad shots, selfish play, terrible body language, cheap shots to the opposition, plenty of turnovers, predictably followed by him visibly blaming others for his own mistakes.


Forget about the NBA being a rude awakening, next year in college is going to be a rude awaking.


He has a lot of catching up to do if he wants to have even a shot at getting drafted.
OK.

Lance is a legit 6'4-6'5, 6'3 is the smallest I've ever seen someone list him
Lance is not a SG anymore, hes a SF, a more natural position for him.
Lance can handle the ball, where you believe he has no handles from is irelevant.

How was this realized at the McDonalds All American Game?

He scored 12 points, he wasnt earth shattering but hes still one of the Elite players in this class.

The mention about him not being able to get stronger in the weight room is comical, considering the goal for him is to possibly get stronger, and physically hes dominate against the HS and AAU level, Im assuming he'll be on an even playing field in college.

Last edited by Interminator : 06-01-2009 at 04:25 PM.
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Old 06-01-2009, 04:15 PM   #42
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Default Re: News on Lance Stephenson courtesy of Yahoosports

Quote:
Originally Posted by Interminator
Born Ready.

What a douche.
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Old 06-01-2009, 04:18 PM   #43
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Default Re: News on Lance Stephenson courtesy of Yahoosports

Quote:
Originally Posted by Interminator
OK.

Is that all your gonna say??

haha then you must agree w/ me.

Its kind of funny how you thought he was a legitemnt prospect until the game141 just dominated you.

Then you cnage your mind and think he's not a prospect??
o the irony
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Old 06-01-2009, 04:26 PM   #44
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Default Re: News on Lance Stephenson courtesy of Yahoosports

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Originally Posted by InspiredLebowski
What a douche.
The nickname was given to him while playing streetball.
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Old 06-01-2009, 04:33 PM   #45
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Default Re: News on Lance Stephenson courtesy of Yahoosports

Quote:
Originally Posted by lukeridnour08
Is that all your gonna say??

haha then you must agree w/ me.

Its kind of funny how you thought he was a legitemnt prospect until the game141 just dominated you.

Then you cnage your mind and think he's not a prospect??
o the irony
I just didnt feel like typing up extended responses to the other post and yours.

I dont agree with you at all, practically your an idiot, I know this because I actually remember you as a poster not sure where you blabbered idiocy over but I dont feel like looking for it.

Regarding Lance your claims are completely inaccurate, I mean you could've honestly looked at Youtube to avoid embarassing yourself the way you just did.

I responded to most of your claims, and the aspect of him being a below average athlete compared to NBA standards is so far false.

Lance lacks the explosiveness a prospect like John Wall has, but that doesn't mean hes not a good athlete.

Lance's game reminds me of Paul Pierce, of course Pierce polished his game and improved at Kansas but Lance & Pierce have an almost identical skillset and how they show their emotion on the court.

Last edited by Interminator : 06-01-2009 at 04:37 PM.
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