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Old 06-28-2009, 06:57 PM   #16
Xiao Yao You
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Default Re: 2009 Draft

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No its not. The 2 and 3 are deeper (Brewer, Korver, AK, Harpring, Miles).

Depends on how you define depth I guess. Only AK above played with consistency at both ends while the only 3 players on the team that did all play the 4.

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At the four we have a possible Boozer, and Millsap. Maybe Koufos if he isn't playing 5 or for the Flash.

Koufos is a 4 til he gets stronger as is AK as is Okur. Deep. They need a center. They need a combo guard cuz almost everyone except the Jazz can play small in the backcourt and it doesn't make much sense to waste a 1st round pick on a pure pg to play at best limited minutes behind Deron. Though it might look good when Deron leaves for greener pastures in 3 years.


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And young 4's.
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Millsap will get his minutes.

Assuming Boozer or Okur are gone that is.

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Brewer and Miles shouldn't be sacrificing minutes for yet another rookie.

They should if they can't play at both ends of the court consistently and someone else can. They're already losing minutes to Sloan's boys. Also they are going to have a hard time covering a small guard and someone is going to need to most nights.

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It took a few drafts to find those two talented swingmen, and that is the talent we should be developing into 24+ mpg guys.

Sure but until someone is a 24+ minute guy you keep looking cuz maybe they will never be those guys. That' why they mistakenly took Almond over Splitter cuz CJ wasn't playing yet. How is taking a young pg or PF make more sense when unlike the 2/3 they already have established players there?

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who...not what.

I don't know who. I only see NBA and CBA and no one from the CBA was available.

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Hopefully the Jazz don't re-sign Knight or Brewer and he's forced to give him a chance.

Price would seemingly be gone with that pick. They need a veteran back-up though not a rookie.
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Old 06-28-2009, 06:58 PM   #17
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Default Re: 2009 Draft

I hear Maynor is a whiz kid when it comes to pick and roll IQ. He executes and controls pace well and is mentally tough.

But, I also hear he's not much of a shooter or defender.
---------------------------

Goran sounds a bit like Memo. Can spread the defense but rebounds well on both ends of the floor. Doesn't finish, not athletic, but skilled.
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Old 06-28-2009, 07:00 PM   #18
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Default Re: 2009 Draft

the not being much of a defender could be a problem, being the sort of pg he is, he should be a perfect backup for dwill when williams hits the bench, a guy who can keep the team going, if he was a better defender that would be nice...
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Old 06-29-2009, 12:33 PM   #19
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Default Re: 2009 Draft

Maynor has some serious point guard skill. They guy can really lead a team and he isn't intimidated by anyone, see his tournament presentation in 2007 when he led VCU over "powerhouse" Duke.
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Old 06-29-2009, 05:52 PM   #20
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Default Re: 2009 Draft

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Goran sounds a bit like Memo. Can spread the defense but rebounds well on both ends of the floor.

Okur is weak on the boards.
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Old 06-29-2009, 06:00 PM   #21
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Default Re: 2009 Draft

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Originally Posted by Xiao Yao You
Okur is weak on the boards.

No is ins't. He often comes up with offensive boards, especially off of free throws. Good team rebounder that keeps bigger players boxed out.
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Old 06-29-2009, 06:05 PM   #22
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Default Re: 2009 Draft

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Originally Posted by Xiao Yao You
Koufos is a 4 til he gets stronger as is AK as is Okur. Deep.


AK is a 3 with the possibility of playing the 4. Okur plays the 5 for us and enjoys the mismatches.

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They need a combo guard cuz almost everyone except the Jazz can play small in the backcourt and it doesn't make much sense to waste a 1st round pick on a pure pg to play at best limited minutes behind Deron. Though it might look good when Deron leaves for greener pastures in 3 years.

Price + Williams works fine for small lineups. Brewer can handle a lot of combo guards anyway, especially if they want to let him elevate above them in the paint on the other end of the floor. I'll take it.

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They should if they can't play at both ends of the court consistently and someone else can. They're already losing minutes to Sloan's boys. Also they are going to have a hard time covering a small guard and someone is going to need to most nights.

Drafting someone at that position will make them lose minutes. Are you talking about Korver and Harpring as "Sloan's boys"?

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Sure but until someone is a 24+ minute guy you keep looking cuz maybe they will never be those guys. That' why they mistakenly took Almond over Splitter cuz CJ wasn't playing yet. How is taking a young pg or PF make more sense when unlike the 2/3 they already have established players there?

Brewer is that 24+ deserving guy. He has finaly started to get those minutes. You don't screw it up with a combo guard. I got so sick of seeing Fisher play the 2. We have real 2s now, lets enjoy it.

Price would seemingly be gone with that pick. They need a veteran back-up though not a rookie.[/quote]
No, Hart is seemingly gone with that pick. The rookie isn't going ot play much time at backup anyway. Reserve pgs should have a shot and play good d. I value those qualities for a backup 1 more than execution.
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Old 06-29-2009, 07:14 PM   #23
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Default Re: 2009 Draft

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No is ins't. He often comes up with offensive boards

7.7 a game in 33.5 minutes is about as weak as you can get outside the Collins brothers and 1.7 offensive is not coming up with many on the offensive glass. Jaron at least hits the offensive glass as pathetic as he is.


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AK is a 3 with the possibility of playing the 4.

The 3 consistent players on the team all play PF as I said.\

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Okur plays the 5 for us and enjoys the mismatches.

Too bad he can't defend the quicker or taller guys at the other end.

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Price + Williams works fine for small lineups.

Price rarely played the 2 last year and again he doesn't pass and can't shoot. Too many quality little men out there that can do those things to stick with Price especially having to give him a pay raise.

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Brewer can handle a lot of combo guards anyway, especially if they want to let him elevate above them in the paint on the other end of the floor. I'll take it.

Didn't see Brewer or anyone ouside AK playing much D on the perimeter. Haven't for years actually.

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Drafting someone at that position will make them lose minutes.

The draft is for the D-league. They need a vet. Looking at the list I'd go after Flip Murray. He's in his prime.

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Are you talking about Korver and Harpring as "Sloan's boys"?

Who else? They can do no wrong in his eyes. Very bad for the team.

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Brewer is that 24+ deserving guy.

Too inconsistent still.

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You don't screw it up with a combo guard.

Sure you do. Too many big time little guys out there that need to be covered. How much worse could they screw it than last year? Lottery?

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I got so sick of seeing Fisher play the 2.

Well that was your boy Sloan falling in love again. Fisher would have been fine at the 2 off the bench.

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We have real 2s now, lets enjoy it.

Not one of them outside AK played consistently. How do you enjoy that? Would be one thing if Sloan went with a hot guy or played them based on the game situation but he doesn't.

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No, Hart is seemingly gone with that pick.

Hart?

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Reserve pgs should have a shot and play good d.

Price doesn't have a shot in case you hadn't noticed. Seems to think he does though.
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Old 06-29-2009, 07:42 PM   #24
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Default Re: 2009 Draft

[quote=Xiao Yao You]7.7 a game in 33.5 minutes is about as weak as you can get outside the Collins brothers and 1.7 offensive is not coming up with many on the offensive glass. Jaron at least hits the offensive glass as pathetic as he is.
Why did you insist on not quoting the most relevant part of my post: "team rebounder." High individual numbers are often a sign of a poor rebounding team. Memo does well on the boards.

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The 3 consistent players on the team all play PF as I said.\
You can't count secondary positions as depth. If that is the case, we are the deepest at the 2: Williams, Brewer, Miles, Korver, Kirilenko.

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Too bad he can't defend the quicker or taller guys at the other end.
He does fine against taller guys. Its the athletic/speedy ones you have to worry about. But you want to count him as a 4 so he can face more of them?

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Price rarely played the 2 last year and again he doesn't pass and can't shoot. Too many quality little men out there that can do those things to stick with Price especially having to give him a pay raise.

Price/Williams can cover small backcourts just fine. Plus, covering a small lineup isn't a pressing concern.

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Who else? They can do no wrong in his eyes. Very bad for the team.
Both have experienced limited minutes and had big moments in that abbreviated playing time.

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Not one of them outside AK played consistently. How do you enjoy that? Would be one thing if Sloan went with a hot guy or played them based on the game situation but he doesn't.
Brewer has played with consistency when given mintues. So has Korver. Roleplayers have big nights once in a while. It doesn't mean they are inconsistent. Miles needs time to develop, and he is worth the investment. Drafting more guys to not play at those positions would be foolish.

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Hart?
Yeah, I meant Knight. I'm hoping for a Williams, Price, Maynor lineup.

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Price doesn't have a shot in case you hadn't noticed. Seems to think he does though.
It isn't that bad. We have shooters (Korver, Williams, Okur). A Price/Williams lineup does a lot of the combo-guard stuff you are looking for does. I don't really see why that lineup is such a focus of your more recent posts. Like I said, let them go small. Brewer will check that undersized 2 and make him pay on the other end by finishing in the paint.

Last edited by Luigi : 06-29-2009 at 07:44 PM.
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Old 06-30-2009, 06:26 PM   #25
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Default Re: 2009 Draft

Quote:
Originally Posted by El Kabong
Brewer? Do you mean Ronnie Price? I'd be very pissed if they let Brewer walk.
Yes, Price. I always mix their names together.

Brewer is not even a free agent until 2010.
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Old 07-02-2009, 06:46 AM   #26
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Default Re: 2009 Draft

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You can't count secondary positions as depth.

You can't? Didn't realize their were rules. Some would argue AK's best position is the 4. Okur's could be in the right situation too and Koufos it is Koufos' best position right now. They are stacked at the 4. The other positions they have 1 guy they can count on.

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you want to count him as a 4 so he can face more of them?

Count him there because he can play there depending on who he's playing with. He'd look good at the 4 next to Dwight Howard for example.

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Price/Williams can cover small backcourts just fine. Plus, covering a small lineup isn't a pressing concern.

Williams doesn't do much covering of anyone. It's a concern isince Price can't play offense and Sloan didn't play him much at the 2 anyway.

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Both have experienced limited minutes and had big moments in that abbreviated playing time

And they've also sucked plenty and still got their minutes regardless. Big problem.

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Brewer has played with consistency when given mintues. So has Korver.

No they haven't they dissapear.

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Miles needs time to develop

Don't necessarily see him behind the others. He had as many moments as any of the others outside AK.

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he is worth the investment

As is Brewer as I've said. While you wait for their potential to be realized you look for better players.

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Drafting more guys to not play at those positions would be foolish.

Like drafting your strongest position or a back-up for your young star isn't? LMAO! Combo guard and center are where they most need an upgrade. That's where you draft.

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Yeah, I meant Knight. I'm hoping for a Williams, Price, Maynor lineup.

You'll probably get it knowing the Jazz. Yikes!

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It isn't that bad.

38% with the current rules for pg is pathetic. 31% from 3. Only numbers that look good for him are rebounds and steals.

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A Price/Williams lineup does a lot of the combo-guard stuff you are looking for does.

Except Sloan rarely played Price there and he can't play at the offensive end.

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I don't really see why that lineup is such a focus

Because almost every team in the league plays a small line-up and you need to be able to match-up. I realize the Jazz have never been that versatile but that doesn't mean they should't be.

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Brewer will check that undersized 2 and make him pay on the other end by finishing in the paint.

Well that's the problem with the Jazz. Trading hoops isn't going to take you far.
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Old 07-02-2009, 07:45 PM   #27
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Default Re: 2009 Draft

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You can't? Didn't realize their were rules. Some would argue AK's best position is the 4. Okur's could be in the right situation too and Koufos it is Koufos' best position right now. They are stacked at the 4. The other positions they have 1 guy they can count on.

Count him there because he can play there depending on who he's playing with. He'd look good at the 4 next to Dwight Howard for examp

If you insist on counting backup positions as depth, you have to count them all. Don't act stupid Xaio, I showed you that already.

Plenty of guys would look good playing the 4 next to Howard.

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Don't necessarily see him behind the others. He had as many moments as any of the others outside AK

You always bang on Brewer and Korver for consistency...Miles is significantly more flighty.

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Like drafting your strongest position or a back-up for your young star isn't? LMAO! Combo guard and center are where they most need an upgrade. That's where you d
Drafting by position regularly fails. You take talent first, then position. Plus, you have the wrong idea of what positions Utah needs help at. Not to mention a rookie pg isn't going to contribute at all. This all came from a Hansborough discussion...at 20 he would have been the best choice if he was available.

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You'll probably get it knowing the Jazz. Yikes!

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Because almost every team in the league plays a small line-up and you need to be able to match-up. I realize the Jazz have never been that versatile but that doesn't mean they should't be.
Well that's the problem with the Jazz. Trading hoops isn't going to take you far
A few teams like playing combo guards. Brewer isn't going to "trade hoops." Where did you get that from? I said Brewer would check him defensively and crush him offensively. Aggregate gain/
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Old 07-03-2009, 04:30 AM   #28
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Default Re: 2009 Draft

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Plenty of guys would look good playing the 4 next to Howard.

Yeah and Okur could play the 4 with certain guys besides him. One example.

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You always bang on Brewer and Korver for consistency...Miles is significantly more flighty.

Didn't see that myself. I seen he's 5th in Sloan's mind but his opinion means little to me.

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Drafting by position regularly fails. You take talent first, then position.

Sure you do but you also try to trade up and down for positions you need.

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you have the wrong idea of what positions Utah needs help at.

Don't think so. Price and Fesenko are the young guys where they need an upgrade at from what I see.

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Not to mention a rookie pg isn't going to contribute at all.

And even if he ever does it will be in limited time(assuming Deron doesn't leave town which is looking more and more likely). Why waste a first round pick on a back-up when a combo guard could someday not only play back-up minutes at the one but also at the 2?

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This all came from a Hansborough discussion...at 20 he would have been the best choice if he was available.

Time will tell but if PF is the best position I'd look to trade. They have 5 guys who could start at the 4 and another guy in Europe. Makes no sense to take another.

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A few teams like playing combo guards.

Almost every team plays small in the backcourt. Off hand Lakers and Orlando didn't. Most do.

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I said Brewer would check him defensively and crush him offensively.

He has a hard enough time with bigger slower guys. He's going to check a smaller quicker player?
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