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Old 06-29-2009, 06:55 PM   #16
lakerfreak
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Default Re: Artest

Nice post bladefd.

It isn't Artest's fault they lost, but there were things he could have done better. For example in the first youtube provided by gts, he went to the ref to plead his case. That seemed to be well and good. They would have probably reviewed that tape and would have done something to Kobe.
The problem is, he decided to push it when he ran to Kobe. I would have just stopped after going to the ref.

The truth is Artest is looked at more for these types of incidents, so while the 2 ejections were unfair in my opinion, they were expected. It was Artest that had done them after all.

Artest would slightly improve I am sure as a laker. However, if I have the option between Ariza and Artest, I will go for Ariza.

Only if ariza leaves is when I would pursue artest to replace him.
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Old 06-29-2009, 07:07 PM   #17
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Default Re: Artest

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Old 06-29-2009, 07:39 PM   #18
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Default Re: Artest

Quote:
Originally Posted by bladefd


Anyways, this was a mad long post. At the end of the day, I think if the Lakers are willing to use up their MLE and if Artest is willing to sign for MLE, I would have no problem with Artest coming to the Lakers. FIRST priority is still signing BOTH Odom and Ariza. I would still take both Odom and Ariza at this point over Artest without a question. Secondary priority is trying to possibly get rid of Vujacic or Farmar's contract with some trade. The third and final priority could be to try and acquire Artest. I personally do not see it happening because the Rockets will probably give Artest more money than MLE, and the Lakers really do not want to go too far into the luxury tax.

That was my thought. Most of Artest's negatives would either be a none factor or mitigated by the Lakers atmosphere. LO and Ariza are definitely priorities, but if we can't sign them both or even if we do and Artest will play for the MLE I would take the chance.

Last edited by OldTerp : 06-29-2009 at 07:42 PM.
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Old 06-29-2009, 07:41 PM   #19
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Default Re: Artest

Quote:
Originally Posted by lakerfreak
Nice post bladefd.

The problem is, he decided to push it when he ran to Kobe. I would have just stopped after going to the ref.


Agreed, but he respects Kobe and LO so either of them could pull him away from a situation and calm him down. Who could have done that on any of his other teams?
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Old 06-29-2009, 07:47 PM   #20
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Default Re: Artest

Quote:
Originally Posted by OldTerp
Agreed, but he respects Kobe and LO so either of them could pull him away from a situation and calm him down. Who could have done that on any of his other teams?

Well you'd think someone like Shane Battier would have tried. Yao couldn't even.

The best way is to give Artest a talk in every practice. Who's going to be willing to do that?
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Old 06-29-2009, 07:52 PM   #21
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Default Re: Artest

Quote:
Originally Posted by lakerfreak
Well you'd think someone like Shane Battier would have tried. Yao couldn't even.

The best way is to give Artest a talk in every practice. Who's going to be willing to do that?

LO and Phil? I am sorry, but I find it hard to believe that Artest would really listen to Shane or Yao. There are very few coaches/players that I think he would really take what they said to heart. Kobe is one of those players and Phil one of the coaches. He will listen to LO because they grew up playing together and are friends.

I am not saying we should actively pursue him, but if the opportunity presented itself I think it should be considered.
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Old 06-29-2009, 07:54 PM   #22
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Default Re: Artest

Quote:
Originally Posted by OldTerp
LO and Phil? I am sorry, but I find it hard to believe that Artest would really listen to Shane or Yao. There are very few coaches/players that I think he would really take what they said to heart. Kobe is one of those players and Phil one of the coaches. He will listen to LO because they grew up playing together and are friends.

I am not saying we should actively pursue him, but if the opportunity presented itself I think it should be considered.
it's out there. he's a free agent looking for a 9 to 10 million dollar payday.
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Old 06-29-2009, 07:58 PM   #23
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Default Re: Artest

Quote:
Originally Posted by LA.MJ&KB#1
adfaefewfffsf

did you copy my avatar? lol im sure i was the only one who was using that one. hence why i chose it :P
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Old 06-29-2009, 08:15 PM   #24
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Default Re: Artest

I would not take Artest over Ariza and/or Odom, plain and simpel and that is the decision that would have to be made here. He is not as good as everyone is saying as his play has declined and his attitude would be potentially destructive.
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Old 06-29-2009, 08:30 PM   #25
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Default Re: Artest

Quote:
Originally Posted by WiltTheStilt
I would not take Artest over Ariza and/or Odom, plain and simpel and that is the decision that would have to be made here. He is not as good as everyone is saying as his play has declined and his attitude would be potentially destructive.

I would have to agree. SoCalMike has that same opinion. Im sure you both would be great friends
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Old 06-29-2009, 08:43 PM   #26
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Default Re: Artest

Quote:
Originally Posted by WiltTheStilt
I would not take Artest over Ariza and/or Odom, plain and simpel and that is the decision that would have to be made here. He is not as good as everyone is saying as his play has declined and his attitude would be potentially destructive.

I think we all agree with that.
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Old 06-29-2009, 08:51 PM   #27
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Default Re: Artest

Quote:
Originally Posted by gts

Let me ask you a question, GTS. What would you have done if somebody took a beer bottle and threw it at your face? Would you just sit back and watch or would you go directly at that person in defense? First of all, if you look at the replay of that fight(bottom of this post), you can clearly see that Artest was not the guy that started the whole thing. He did a hard foul on Wallace (not even a flagrant if you look at 1:12 in video) and Ben runs to Artest and shoves him across the floor. Artest started back-pedaling and does not physically retaliate. Stephen Jackson and Ben Wallace kept trying to go at each other. While that is happening, Artest is lying down on the scorer's table. Look at 1:40 - you will see a green bottle being thrown at Artest while he is just lying there. Right away, he runs DIRECTLY to the fan that threw it at him to retaliate. People are throwing stuff at him, kicking him from the back, punching him from the sides, pulling/pushing him around. Stephen Jackson goes in there and starts to beat the crap out of the fans trying to hit Artest; Artest slowly backs away and goes back onto the court afterwards.

Second of all, one can make the argument that it wasn't actually Artest that escalated the whole crowd fight, but it was actually the person who threw the beer bottle at Artest that took it to a whole new level (while Artest was lying down on the scorer's table cooling down). I guess if you were in Artest's shoes, you would let some fan take a bottle and throw it at your face while you are just lying down doing nothing? Even if that bottle hurts you and rips part of your skin apart with blood streaming down your face - you would just back away and do absolutely nothing to that fan? I mean crap, Artest could have been hurt there by that bottle. He wasn't saying or doing anything while on the scorer's table and some unknown guy throws it at him..... So once again, I have no clue what point you are trying to make with that post (if there is a point).

Here is the video. Watch it again:
www.youtube.com/watch?v=JoH-XAc8H14

Last edited by bladefd : 06-29-2009 at 08:55 PM.
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Old 06-29-2009, 09:00 PM   #28
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Default Re: Artest

Ron is going to command more than he is worth or more than I would be willing to spend on him. He is always so highly touted bc of his defensive versatilty while being a offensive threat. I think he still is living off a bad rep. He has controlled himself better than in previous years, but still I would not be at ease that he would make the correct decision in the heat of the moment.

I am not sure how much Lakers need him. He takes ill-advised shots and even without him shooting, I am not satisfied with how many touches Pau gets some games. Pau is our most efficient player, and for some reason he ends up with under 10 shots some games. Artest would certainly command some shots, and I am not willing to give up possessions that Pau should get. And as we have seen in the playoffs, he is capable of making mental mistakes when a call doesnt go his way. Thats something I doubt he will ever learn to control.

I much prefer Ariza bc of his poise, youth and ability to effect the game in a big way without the ball. Artest is going to disrupt the chemistry the Lakers have built all season long. Its not necessary to get a big name player. Artest is going to frustrate us if he were on the Lakers. I love his D and aggressiveness, but I just think he is not the best fit on this team.
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Old 06-29-2009, 09:24 PM   #29
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Default Re: Artest

Quote:
Originally Posted by lakerfreak
Even if his attitude changed and hes professional from now on, from a basketball standpoint he takes terrible shots.

the last thing we need right now is chemistry problems. I'd rather pay Ariza an extra few million than get artest for the MLE.


This
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Old 06-29-2009, 09:47 PM   #30
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Default Re: Artest

Quote:
Originally Posted by bladefd
Let me ask you a question, GTS. What would you have done if somebody took a beer bottle and threw it at your face?
Artest was wrong. No matter how you look at it, no matter how many excuses you make, no matter how you slice it. he was wrong. A player never ever ever goes into the stands PERIOD. Stop making excuses for the guy.

If that had been a one time incudent then you might say OK the guy made a mistake blew his top and it's over. But Prior to that and many more times after that he has shown a complete lack of self control, bad judgement and a disregard for his team and others outside of the league.

A Brief History in Ron.

January 4, 2003 Fined $35,000 and suspended for three games for his actions on Jan 3 against New York.

January 29, 2003 Suspended for four games by the NBA for his actions on Jan 27 against Miami.

February 11, 2003 Missed 4 games (suspension).

February 26, 2003 Suspended by the Indiana Pacers for disciplinary reasons.

March 9, 2003 Suspended for one game by the NBA for exceeding the maximum number of flagrant foul penalty points.

March 11, 2003 Missed 1 game (suspension).

March 26, 2003 Missed 1 game (suspension).

April 3, 2003 Fined $20,000 by the NBA.

March 19, 2004 Suspended by the NBA without pay for hitting Portland's Derrick Anderson in the head with his forearm.

March 20, 2004 Missed 1 game (suspension undiclosed).

April 19, 2004 Suspended by the NBA for one game for his actions on Apr 17 against the Boston Celtics

April 23, 2004 Missed Game Two of Round One against the Boston Celtics (suspension).

November 21, 2004 Suspended by the NBA for the rest of the season for his actions on Nov 19 against the Detroit Pistons.

December 15, 2005 Fined $10,000 for making public statements detrimental to the NBA.

April 24, 2006 Suspended by the NBA for one game for his actions on Apr 22 in Game 1 of Round One against the San Antonio Spurs.

February 25, 2007 Personal reasons, day-to-day.
February 26, 2007 Missed 1 game (personal reasons).

March 6, 2007 Personal reasons, sidelined indefinitely.

March 11, 2007 Missed 2 games (personal reasons).

March 22, 2007 Personal reasons, day-to-day.

March 25, 2007 Missed 1 game (personal reasons).

July 14, 2007 Suspended by the NBA for the first seven games of the 2007-08 season.

November 14, 2007 Missed 7 games (suspension).

November 21, 2007 Personal reasons, day-to-day.

November 23, 2007 Missed 1 game (personal reasons).

Injuries

October 10, 2001 Finger surgery, late December.
December 20, 2001 Missed 23 games (finger surgery).
February 16, 2002 Left pinkie tendinitis, day-to-day.
February 22, 2002 Missed 2 games (left pinkie tendinitis).
April 8, 2002 Sore left heel, day-to-day.
October 20, 2002 Finger injury, day-to-day.
April 10, 2002 Missed 1 game (sore left heel).
December 1, 2003 Back spasms, day-to-day.
December 3, 2003 Missed 1 game (back spasms).
December 5, 2003 Back spasms, day-to-day.
December 7, 2003 Missed 1 game (back spasms).
February 9, 2004 Thumb injury, day-to-day.
February 20, 2004 Left hand injury, injured list.
March 2, 2004 Missed 5 games (left hand injury).
November 25, 2005 Wrist injury, day-to-day.
November 27, 2005 Missed 1 game (wrist injury).
December 8, 2005 Wrist injury, day-to-day.
January 27, 2006 Missed 26 games (wrist injury).
November 4, 2006 Strained lower back, inactive list.
November 25, 2006 Missed 1 game (strained lower back).
December 2, 2006 Sore back, day-to-day.
December 7, 2006 Missed 3 games (sore back).
December 21, 2006 Knee injury, day-to-day.
December 27, 2006 Missed 2 games (knee injury).
April 11, 2007 Hamstring, day-to-day.
April 13, 2007 Missed 1 game (hamstring).
December 28, 2007 Elbow injury, day-to-day.
January 16, 2008 Missed 9 games (elbow injury).
March 5, 2008 Sore right foot, day-to-day.
March 9, 2008 Missed 2 games (sore right foot)
March 22, 2008 Sore right elbow, day-to-day.
March 24, 2008 Missed 1 game (sore right elbow).
April 5, 2008 Thumb injury, day-to-day.
April 6, 2008 Missed 1 game (thumb injury).
April 8, 2008 Thumb injury, day-to-day.
April 12, 2008 Missed 2 games (thumb injury).
April 14, 2008 Thumb injury, day-to-day.
April 16, 2008 Missed the last 2 games of the regular season (thumb injury).
December 8, 2008 Sprained right ankle, day-to-day.
December 9, 2008 Missed 1 game (sprained right ankle).
December 11, 2008 Ankle injury, day-to-day.
December 16, 2008 Missed 2 games (ankle injury).
December 26, 2008 Ankle injury, day-to-day.
December 27, 2008 Missed 1 game (ankle injury).
January 3, 2009 Sore right ankle, day-to-day.
January 7, 2009 Missed 2 games (sore right ankle).
anuary 9, 2009 Right ankle injury, day-to-day.
January 25, 2009 Missed 7 games (right ankle injury).









Last edited by gts : 06-29-2009 at 10:16 PM.
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