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Old 11-27-2009, 05:11 PM   #16
Phong
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Default Re: Cuban Agrees; Stop sending NBA players to Olympic Basketball.

Good for Dirk. If he can't sustain playing all year round he should just go on vacation over the summer.

Others have played 2 years straight, won the NBA title, Olympic gold or silver medals, European Championship, etc...
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Old 11-27-2009, 05:12 PM   #17
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Default Re: Cuban Agrees; Stop sending NBA players to Olympic Basketball.

Whats the difference between the Olympics and the World Cup? Both are every 4 years. So whats the advantage to creating a WC when we already have the same thing in the Olympics?

I'm not opposed to having under 21 players play BTW, college and NBA. I think that would be pretty cool.
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Old 11-27-2009, 05:20 PM   #18
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Default Re: Cuban Agrees; Stop sending NBA players to Olympic Basketball.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Phong
Good for Dirk. If he can't sustain playing all year round he should just go on vacation over the summer.

Others have played 2 years straight, won the NBA title, Olympic gold or silver medals, European Championship, etc...
But certain guys like Dirk and Yao are the only hope their country has. Other guys like Kobe and Gasol have much deeper teams that don't require them to carry the team every night.
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Old 11-27-2009, 05:38 PM   #19
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Default Re: Cuban Agrees; Stop sending NBA players to Olympic Basketball.

the olympics are only once every 4 years .. cuban needs to stop b*tchin its not like i see any of the players complaining ...
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Old 11-27-2009, 06:59 PM   #20
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Default Re: Cuban Agrees; Stop sending NBA players to Olympic Basketball.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Arti
But certain guys like Dirk and Yao are the only hope their country has. Other guys like Kobe and Gasol have much deeper teams that don't require them to carry the team every night.
In 2008, the Mavs lost in the first round of the play-offs (5 games). By the end of April Dirk was already on vacation. He had 2 month and a half to chill before he had to play 5 games for Germany in the FIBA World Olympic Qualifying Tournament (1 week in mid-July) and then 5 more games during the Olympics (1 week in mid-August). He only played 10 games total for Germany and spent less than a month with his national squad. After that he had another month to chill before training camp started.

So please, it's not like those 10 games Dirk played during the summer will hinder his performance the following season. Are Cuban or Dirk gonna whine if they have to play 16+ games in the playoffs?

That same year, Kobe and Gasol averaged 39 and 36 minutes a games, played an entire post season (20 games), went all the way to the Olympic finale (8 games), and came back the following season and still played a lot of minutes: 36 and 38 minutes. And in the case of Gasol, he went an entire post-season again and followed it with the European championship.

Yao at least has the excuse of having a freakishly huge body that will always cause him to be injury prone.

Last edited by Phong : 11-27-2009 at 07:07 PM.
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Old 11-27-2009, 07:09 PM   #21
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Default Re: Cuban Agrees; Stop sending NBA players to Olympic Basketball.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bdreason
As I've stated before (with lots of backlash), having NBA players playing all year is ridiculous.
Completely agree. I've believed for a long time that a team of NDBL-level talent should be formed specifically to play in international tournaments, such as the Olympics.

Keep the team together, let them play overseas year round to get used to the style of play. You would then have an actual team, not a collection of superstars.

It would reduce the level of glitter around the Olympics, but there would be a solid US squad filled with talented players who represent well, and have the country behind them.

The benefits: no premature hate for the team, no superstars risking their careers & getting fatigued, no backlash if a loss should happen. Its a win-win, but the Olympic committee wants as much "bling" as possible, so they won't adopt a sensible plan.
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Old 11-27-2009, 07:12 PM   #22
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Default Re: Cuban Agrees; Stop sending NBA players to Olympic Basketball.

I wouldn't watch Olympic basketball if the NBA players don't play lol. But it's better for them if they don't play probably. Especially for guys that have deep playoff runs every year. I don't really care either way. I'd get over it. Plenty of other things to watch in the Olympics.
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Old 11-27-2009, 07:38 PM   #23
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Default Re: Cuban Agrees; Stop sending NBA players to Olympic Basketball.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Phong
In 2008, the Mavs lost in the first round of the play-offs (5 games). By the end of April Dirk was already on vacation. He had 2 month and a half to chill before he had to play 5 games for Germany in the FIBA World Olympic Qualifying Tournament (1 week in mid-July) and then 5 more games during the Olympics (1 week in mid-August). He only played 10 games total for Germany and spent less than a month with his national squad. After that he had another month to chill before training camp started.

So please, it's not like those 10 games Dirk played during the summer will hinder his performance the following season. Are Cuban or Dirk gonna whine if they have to play 16+ games in the playoffs?

That same year, Kobe and Gasol averaged 39 and 36 minutes a games, played an entire post season (20 games), went all the way to the Olympic finale (8 games), and came back the following season and still played a lot of minutes: 36 and 38 minutes. And in the case of Gasol, he went an entire post-season again and followed it with the European championship.

Yao at least has the excuse of having a freakishly huge body that will always cause him to be injury prone.
Spare me. It doesn't matter one bit whether YOU think it affects their performance. It matters if the PLAYERS and COACHES (i.e. the people who actually matter) think it does. And they do.

Do you think Manu Ginobili's playing in the Olympics in 2008 affected his 2009 season?

Last edited by Arti : 11-27-2009 at 07:40 PM.
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Old 11-27-2009, 08:21 PM   #24
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Default Re: Cuban Agrees; Stop sending NBA players to Olympic Basketball.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bdreason
I've made a couple threads about how Olympic Basketball is bad for the NBA, and it's players. Recently, Dirk Nowitzki came out and said that not having to play for his home country Germany during the summer has improved his NBA game. Similar statements were made by Carmelo Anthony earlier in this season.

Apparently, European Soccer leaders have agreed that they will not be sending any of their top players to the Olympics in the future, and will instead send only their under 21 players. This was actually already the case in the last Olympics, where you saw very few Soccer stars playing for their Country in Beijing.

Cuban takes a slightly different angle on the arguement, claiming that Olympic organizers are greedy bastards; only concerned with the BILLIONS in revenues they make off of having NBA stars perform in the Olympics for free. He also touches on my main point, that fans of the NBA want to see NBA players from all countries playing at 100% during the NBA season.

Cuban goes on to state that we should develop an independent World Competition for Basketball (like the World Cup), where competetive fairness would be placed above profit, and the profits that are made will be shared amongst the contestants (instead of the Olympic Commitees reaping all the rewards).

As I've stated before (with lots of backlash), having NBA players playing all year is ridiculous. Every summer there is practice for the Olympics, practice for the World Championships, practice for your franchise... it's all just too much. Eliminate NBA players playing in the Olympics and World Championships, and let the young players (under 21) represent their Countries. If we really want a stage to display the elite Basketball Players from each country, let's organize something like the World Cup every 4 years.

Here is a link to Cuban's Blog;

http://blogmaverick.com/2009/11/27/t...o-go-under-21/

The football tournament in the Olympics has been a U21 competition forever, that was recently softened up, so every country can nominate three senior players above the age limit.

And there already is a tournament like the World Championships in basketball. Itīs played every four years and it is called the WORLD CHAMPIONSHIPS. Are there more brilliant ideas where that one came from, like building a medal cage with an engine and four tires and call it a car?
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Old 11-27-2009, 08:49 PM   #25
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Default Re: Cuban Agrees; Stop sending NBA players to Olympic Basketball.

Quote:
Originally Posted by R.I.P.
The football tournament in the Olympics has been a U21 competition forever, that was recently softened up, so every country can nominate three senior players above the age limit.

And there already is a tournament like the World Championships in basketball. Itīs played every four years and it is called the WORLD CHAMPIONSHIPS. Are there more brilliant ideas where that one came from, like building a medal cage with an engine and four tires and call it a car?


You're right, the Olympics are every 4 years, and the World Championships are every 4 years... and those years are ALTERNATING. Which means that every 2 years there is an International competition... which means that NBA players will be either competing, or practicing for an International event EVERY SUMMER.

That's the whole point of this thread. One or the other needs to go (or both). Asking NBA players to compete all year, every year, with no breaks inbetween is ridiculous... and directly effects the quality of the NBA (the real World Championship).
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Old 11-27-2009, 08:57 PM   #26
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Default Re: Cuban Agrees; Stop sending NBA players to Olympic Basketball.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Juges8932
I wouldn't watch Olympic basketball if the NBA players don't play lol. But it's better for them if they don't play probably. Especially for guys that have deep playoff runs every year. I don't really care either way. I'd get over it. Plenty of other things to watch in the Olympics.

what else are you gonna watch? only thing that holds me back from watching them are the odd hours they're on.
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Old 11-27-2009, 09:04 PM   #27
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Default Re: Cuban Agrees; Stop sending NBA players to Olympic Basketball.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Arti
Spare me. It doesn't matter one bit whether YOU think it affects their performance. It matters if the PLAYERS and COACHES (i.e. the people who actually matter) think it does. And they do.
Spare you what? That Dirk complains because of 10 measly games he played, and only having 3 months and a half to rest that summer in stead of 4 and a half? If he's not physically and mentally tough enough to play an extra 10 games during the summer he'll never be ready to win it all.

A champ bites more than he can chew, chews it and swallows it like it's nothing. When you have other players who have incredible games while being sick or play injured, you have others who whines because they played 10 games in which they could have sustained an injury; COULD HAVE and not did.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Arti
Do you think Manu Ginobili's playing in the Olympics in 2008 affected his 2009 season?
Ginobili has always been injury prone. This season he only played 9 games and already injured himself. In 8 seasons he never player 82 games once.

As for his Olympics performance, he had already injured his ankle during the playoffs. Knowing that, he still went to the Olympics and aggravated the injury. But you know what? You can't fault him for trying and he's not whining about it either.
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Old 11-27-2009, 09:20 PM   #28
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Default Re: Cuban Agrees; Stop sending NBA players to Olympic Basketball.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bdreason
You're right, the Olympics are every 4 years, and the World Championships are every 4 years... and those years are ALTERNATING. Which means that every 2 years there is an International competition... which means that NBA players will be either competing, or practicing for an International event EVERY SUMMER.
Alternating betwen two competitions held every 4 years will give you one summer completely off every couple of years.

And if your national team isn't part of the elites, you're not even gonna play the whole competition anyway.


Quote:
Originally Posted by bdreason
That's the whole point of this thread. One or the other needs to go (or both). Asking NBA players to compete all year, every year, with no breaks inbetween is ridiculous... and directly effects the quality of the NBA (the real World Championship).
Did you see a drop in performances from all those who played in the 2008 Olympics?

So you don't want NBA players to represent their countries because it could lessen your viewing pleasure?

Last edited by Phong : 11-27-2009 at 09:23 PM.
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Old 11-27-2009, 09:21 PM   #29
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Default Re: Cuban Agrees; Stop sending NBA players to Olympic Basketball.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Phong
Spare you what? That Dirk complains because of 10 measly games he played, and only having 3 months and a half to rest that summer in stead of 4 and a half? If he's not physically and mentally tough enough to play an extra 10 games during the summer he'll never be ready to win it all.

A champ bites more than he can chew, chews it and swallows it like it's nothing. When you have other players who have incredible games while being sick or play injured, you have others who whines because they played 10 games in which they could have sustained an injury; COULD HAVE and not did.
Who said Dirk was complaining? All he said was that he thinks he's playing better this year because of the time he took off from playing for the national team. No one is whining here so don't make this into a "Dirk is a p***y" thread. This is all from a business standpoint. And you're crazy if you don't think something like Dirk's 2008 offseason amounts to being more taxing than a month of the NBA season (all of the international travel is supposedly way more stressful than actually playing). An owner has every right to be against this because he does not stand to profit, the player does not stand to profit, only the greedy Olympic Committee stands to profit while everyone else takes the risks.

Again, don't make this "Players should just suck it up because that's what champions do." This is about owners protecting their assets.

Quote:
Ginobili has always been injury prone. This season he only played 9 games and already injured himself. In 8 seasons he never player 82 games once.

As for his Olympics performance, he had already injured his ankle during the playoffs. Knowing that, he still went to the Olympics and aggravated the injury. But you know what? You can't fault him for trying and he's not whining about it either.
Ok...no one is disputing any of this. Please stop trying to make this a "Player x is a whiner and doesn't have the heart of a champion like player y" because that is not what the discussion is about.

In the case of Ginobili, I don't think it's disputable that the 2008 Olympics took a toll on his body for the 2008-2009 season, and it's not fair that the Spurs organization suffers for it.
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Old 11-27-2009, 10:09 PM   #30
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Default Re: Cuban Agrees; Stop sending NBA players to Olympic Basketball.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Arti
Who said Dirk was complaining? All he said was that he thinks he's playing better this year because of the time he took off from playing for the national team.
And his stats so far are pretty much exactly the same as last year. We'll see at the end of the year if it made a big difference or not.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Arti
And you're crazy if you don't think something like Dirk's 2008 offseason amounts to being more taxing than a month of the NBA season (all of the international travel is supposedly way more stressful than actually playing).
So him traveling to Athens for the FIBA World Olympic Qualifying Tournament and playing 5 games there in July, and then traveling to Beijing for the Olympics and playing 5 games there in August with plenty of rest before and after, is much worse than playing 15 games all across the country in one month (for several months straight)?

And I'm the crazy one?

Have you ever traveled a lot oversea? I have, and not short continental flights, 15+ hours flights all over Europe and Asia (and not sitting in business class with everything handed to me). And even thought it's somewhat tiring, doing it one time a month is nothing to talk about. It's much more tiring to travel all around the country every couple of days and not being able to settle comfortably in one place.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Arti
An owner has every right to be against this because he does not stand to profit, the player does not stand to profit, only the greedy Olympic Committee stands to profit while everyone else takes the risks.
Do you see anybody else complain about it? Kobe, LeBron, Wade and company all went. Do you see their owners whine? Only sleazy Cuban does cause he wants a share of the pie all the time. He doesn't own his players. He pays them to play for him. What they want to do of their free time is up to them.

As for players not profiting from playing for they're country, most if not all countries give monetary rewards to their athletes for their performance. It's not much compared to their NBA salaries but they're not playing for free. And you have some players who just do it out of pride to represent their country.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Arti
Again, don't make this "Players should just suck it up because that's what champions do." This is about owners protecting their assets.
And yet owners of more successful franchises didn't complain as much or at all.

If Cuban wants to protect his assests he could start by finding a girl for Dirk. That's gonna be better than that ghetto-a$$ gold-digger who messed up with Dirk's head.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Arti
Ok...no one is disputing any of this. Please stop trying to make this a "Player x is a whiner and doesn't have the heart of a champion like player y" because that is not what the discussion is about.
You brought Ginobili up as if you thought he sustained his injury in the Olympics.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Arti
In the case of Ginobili, I don't think it's disputable that the 2008 Olympics took a toll on his body for the 2008-2009 season, and it's not fair that the Spurs organization suffers for it.
Yes he injured himself even more. It's part of the game.

He could have went there, uninjured to begin with, and came back uninjured. You know.. like hundreds of other players who played in the Olympics.

Last edited by Phong : 11-27-2009 at 10:17 PM.
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