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Old 11-08-2006, 08:32 AM   #1
RainierBeachPoet
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Default Proposition Q&R fail-lets not jump to conclusions just yet please

Sacramento voters roundly reject Kings arena tax
ROBIN HINDERY
Associated Press

SACRAMENTO - After months of contentious wrangling and bitter public debate, county voters overwhelmingly rejected Tuesday a tax increase that would have partially financed a flashy new Sacramento Kings basketball arena.

Ballot measures Q and R proposed a quarter-cent sales tax boost to help raise public funds for a downtown arena and other projects. With 91 percent of precincts reporting, nearly 72 percent of voters opposed Measure Q and more than 80 percent opposed Measure R.

Local business owners and taxpayers' groups have argued that the billionaire Maloof brothers, who own the team, should not ask county residents to fund the bulk of the project.

"Voters understood that we were being asked to provide a public handout in the form of an arena for a billionaire corporation," said Assemblyman Dave Jones, D-Sacramento, who led the campaign against the measures.

Jones said the strong opposition to the measures was a sign that voters believed they were getting "a bad deal" and were frustrated by the stop-and-go negotiations between the Maloofs and local government officials in recent months.

The measures' supporters tried to convince voters that the Kings must have a new arena to keep pace with the rest of the NBA, both in revenue and reputation. Their current home, Arco Arena, is far behind most other NBA stadiums when it comes to even the most basic amenities.

Officials backing the tax increase split the tax proposal into two measures in an attempt to get around a requirement for a two-thirds vote to approve a tax increase to pay for a specific project or program.


on espn, there was speculation that the maloofs would consider moving to anaheim or perhaps las vegas.

we are in a similiar situation in seattle; voters didnt support the new tax and it would make it difficult in the whole county for a new arena





my comment: at least in seattle, we have other suburbs who it might happen. i am not sure that is the case in sac-town.

the maloofs and our owner bennett do not want to fund these arenas with their own money; the people are saying no to corporate welfare therefore, moving the teams to a place that will build a new arena for the owners is a very real possibility


Last edited by RainierBeachPoet : 11-08-2006 at 08:39 AM.
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Old 11-08-2006, 12:54 PM   #2
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Default Lets's Try to Keep the Kings in Sacramento

I'm an avid Kings fan and desperately want the team to remain in Sacramento. However, I can understand how a team owner might decide to
relocate to get a better buisiness deal. Apparently, there are other cities which are eager to have a professional team and will offer the moon and stars in order to lure a team to their city.

I believe the Maloofs (Kings owners) appreciate the fan base they have here but at the same time they're becoming frustrated with efforts to get a new arena built. (To replace ARCO arena, the second oldest in the NBA.)

A non profit group has already indicated that a new move is underway to explore alternative solutions to the arena problem. It will be interesting to see whether a revived effort can be fruitful.
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Old 11-08-2006, 02:37 PM   #3
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I edited the title because it's not a done deal that they're moving or staying yet...


Anyway, I hope they just try to get the arena in Natomas maybe with some investors or something like that. Maloofs might have tricked Sacto though.

Also I have to say, Dave Jones is a slimey bastard.
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Old 11-08-2006, 02:54 PM   #4
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Speculation is just that....speculation. The Maloofs have said publicly many times that they do not want to move. Fan support is very high and we sell out every game. Would they get that in Anaheim or Las Vegas? I don't think so, there's too much to do in Vegas and LA has two other teams already. We just move on to the next attempt at a deal. If they do move, I'm still a fan of the Kings wherever they go.
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Old 11-08-2006, 06:32 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LAZYBOY
Speculation is just that....speculation. The Maloofs have said publicly many times that they do not want to move. Fan support is very high and we sell out every game. Would they get that in Anaheim or Las Vegas? I don't think so, there's too much to do in Vegas and LA has two other teams already. We just move on to the next attempt at a deal. If they do move, I'm still a fan of the Kings wherever they go.

If you honestly believe that the maloofs will stay because they sell out ARCO, then you have been smoking too much. Yeah, fan support is high, but it's obvious the citizens don't want to make an effort to improve their city, and the Maloofs are losing money every year because they still have the debt on ARCO, +payroll, +ARCO is small. Other cities will bend over backwards to get the kings, and will probably let the kings use their arenas with little to no cost because they realize what a pro team can do to their community, something the people of sacramento failed to learn, and will regret in 10 years.
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Old 11-08-2006, 08:15 PM   #6
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I have no reason to think they're lying. But if they are, I'm a Kings fan regardless. I rode with the Kings before the Maloofs.
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Old 11-08-2006, 08:16 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Showtime
If you honestly believe that the maloofs will stay because they sell out ARCO, then you have been smoking too much. Yeah, fan support is high, but it's obvious the citizens don't want to make an effort to improve their city, and the Maloofs are losing money every year because they still have the debt on ARCO, +payroll, +ARCO is small. Other cities will bend over backwards to get the kings, and will probably let the kings use their arenas with little to no cost because they realize what a pro team can do to their community, something the people of sacramento failed to learn, and will regret in 10 years.
If the kings leave sacramento, another pro sports team will move in ASAP.

But, I doubt the Kings leave sacto. I heard they are already at work at exploring different ways to build an arena including making the city pay without public voting (what memphis did and I believe sac should do)

Lots of people are jumping to conclusions. What city is going to bend over backwards for the Kings? Where will they go?

Las Vegas: LV could not even fill a college arena for the preseason games there and the local buzz for the allstar game is also pretty low. Most people there are tourists and they wouldn't go to the games.

Anaheim:How much support would the kings get when they are competing with not only the Lakers ( ateam thats been in LA forever) and the Clippers? Imagine trying to convince former laker's fans to go to a kings game.

Oklahoma City: The Hornets don't want to leave OKC. New New Orleans can't support a basketball team yet, hell they couldn't support the hornets before Katrina. Remember how the hornet's owners had to try and scam the league to get them to allow them to move in the first place?


The Kings probably will get something done in Sac. Lots of pro owners lose money. If the maloofs were all about money they wouldn't invest in a sports franchise, they would put it into more casinos (the real money maker). Sacramento is a great basketball enviroment. The merchandise sells like crazy and we sellout every game. And we have absolutely ridiculously priced tickets that we are overcharged for every game. The Kings have everything going for them. Good teams don't usually move cities. Crappy teams tend to move more.

The arena might be built by a private business looking to cement itself in Sacramento, like SMUD or PG&E. Or the city might figure out another way to finance it without going through this long voting ordeal.

BTW, how was Arco Arena originally paid for? It outdates me, so I have no clue about the history of it. I know the maloofs are still paying for it or something like that
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Old 11-08-2006, 10:41 PM   #8
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Default sac bee spin

"As the sales tax increase for a new Kings arena in the downtown railyard went down to a crushing defeat Tuesday, the group spearheading the campaign for Measures Q and R said it will continue working to get such a facility built. Measure R, which would have raised the Sacramento County sales tax by a quarter-cent, failed by a 80 percent to 20 percent margin Tuesday night with all precincts reporting. Measure Q, a companion advisory initiative, fared slightly better, going down on a vote of 72 percent to 28 percent." Sacramento Bee

"But while the revelers in Mason's tried to stay upbeat, a high-ranking official in the National Basketball Association offered a more grim assessment of the prospects for getting an arena built here. He noted that there is no alternative arena financing plan at the moment, and several previous attempts to come up with one have failed." Sacramento Bee

"The Maloofs are committed to staying in Sacramento if they possibly can, and there's certainly no interest on the part of the NBA in moving the team. But we can't figure out what to do next," said the NBA's Harvey Benjamin, who participated in ultimately unsuccessful negotiations with the city, county and the railyard developer for an arena." Sacramento Bee




the key is: will the maloofs spend their own money to build an arena? they seem like good guys, but they are astute businessmen first. with a choice of a city offering to build for them and they having to front millions-- what will they choose?

as badly as i feel for the sonic fans, i think you kings fans have it a bit worse because of the lack of options in the sac area

ps-- i didnt appreciate my original title being censored--- there was a question mark after the title las vegas or anaheim kings?
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Old 11-08-2006, 11:21 PM   #9
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So are there other options for the sonics in seattle?

Like I asked in my last post, who are the really willing cities that are potential suitors?
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Old 11-09-2006, 02:52 AM   #10
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Your title was edited because it's jumping to conclusions. We don't know they'll move to Anaheim(although it's looking more likely) and Stern said no team in Vegas unless they do something about the gambling problem. I don't see how they'd move to Anaheim and sell out though, I doubt there are that many displaced Kings fans in SoCal and most NBA fans are Laker/Clipper fans. Laker fans HATE the Kings, there's no way they would go to a kings game and yell "go kings!", they might go if it's kings vs lakers though.


BTW the Bee hates the Kings(except for Breton, Marty McNeil, Mark Kreidler, and Voisin who only hated Webber). You should read some of the bull **** that R.E. Graswich writes.

Bottom line-Arco is old and needs to be replaced. Sacramento needs a state of the art arena. I love Arco but at the same time I hate it because it's old and nasty and jam packed together(as in the seats are too close).
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Old 11-09-2006, 07:50 AM   #11
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Default sonic options?--- how does it compare to sac-town

Quote:
Originally Posted by bigboi_baller
So are there other options for the sonics in seattle?

Like I asked in my last post, who are the really willing cities that are potential suitors?

the two cities that have been mentioned are bellevue and renton

bellevue is an east side suburb where some very wealthy folk live (gate is the most famous) and probably most of the people who would buy a sky box reside. i am not sure where exactly their mayor and city council are at today, but there are some things in the works

renton is the municipality just south of seattle. i had heard that the old boeing plant could be transformed. it is right at the southern most tip of lake washington

it might be just me trying to hang on to a glimmer of hope-- but i know that folks in the area will be trying all they can to keep the sonics. obviously the owners have much to do with this discussion.

i ask bennett the same questions i would ask the maloofs: how much of your own money will you invest for a new arena for YOUR team-- especially if you want a lion's share of the profits
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Old 11-09-2006, 11:44 AM   #12
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There a lot of developing suburbs in sacramento but most of them developed into the last 5-10 years, so people they don't have much history/stability. But you can always move a little farther from sacramento like Stockton, Roseville, or Vallejo. Which are all within 1 hour of sac.
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Old 11-09-2006, 05:16 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bigboi_baller
There a lot of developing suburbs in sacramento but most of them developed into the last 5-10 years, so people they don't have much history/stability. But you can always move a little farther from sacramento like Stockton, Roseville, or Vallejo. Which are all within 1 hour of sac.


Vallejo Kings of Sacramento would be cool
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Old 11-09-2006, 05:44 PM   #14
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Stockton already has an arena, right? Take a shot with that. And if they move, I don't think they should keep the "Sacramento" title. People of Sacramento haven't earned that title if the kings leave.
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Old 11-09-2006, 06:15 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Showtime
Stockton already has an arena, right? Take a shot with that. And if they move, I don't think they should keep the "Sacramento" title. People of Sacramento haven't earned that title if the kings leave.
They wouldn't remove the sacramento title because its already so popular.

Sacramento may be a smalltown/cowtown but its the capital. stockton or vallejo are like meaningless on the national scale.

Don't the Pistons have an arena thats quite abit out of detroit?
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