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Old 06-09-2010, 04:25 PM   #16
juju151111
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Default Re: Where did Jordan rank all-time at age 31

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Originally Posted by jlauber
Since people here are ripping the Kobe-MJ's comparsions...

where do you think MJ ranked, all-time, at age 31? Three rings, three losers, just lost in the playoffs. Very few records.

My guess is somewhere behind Russell, Magic, Kareem, Wilt, Bird, and maybe behind West and Oscar. Of course, Shaq was early on his career, and Duncan had not yet joined the NBA.

Just some food for thought as we ponder Kobe's career up to age 31.
Didn't Mj lose at age 32?? Anyways http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N6og_pOVi2w LMFAO behind West and oscar??? Do you know wat Mj stats were in the playoffs before his old years?? His playoffs stats would of had him in top 5 already.
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Old 06-09-2010, 04:26 PM   #17
jlauber
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Default Re: Where did Jordan rank all-time at age 31

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Originally Posted by Rake2204
Not to jump into either players' camp, but I do recall that, upon Jordan's first retirement, he was considered by many to possibly be the best basketball player of all time. I hesitate to say the majority believed this to be true because I did not conduct a survey, but scientifically speaking, a ton of people felt that way.

Not sure what that would have been based upon. Less rings, less MVPs, more losers, than MULTIPLE players to that point in his career.

And CAREERS have to count for something. To say MJ was better, at age 31, than EVERY other player is being ridiculous.
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Old 06-09-2010, 04:28 PM   #18
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Default Re: Where did Jordan rank all-time at age 31

Quote:
Originally Posted by jlauber
Not sure what that would have been based upon. Less rings, less MVPs, more losers, than MULTIPLE players to that point in his career.

And CAREERS have to count for something. To say MJ was better, at age 31, than EVERY other player is being ridiculous.


No it's not. Magic, Isaiah considered Jordan GOAT before he won his 3rd ring. After his 3rd ring, and the domination he displayed, Jordan was rated above Bird, with a great case as GOAT, having retired at his absolute peak.
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Old 06-09-2010, 04:30 PM   #19
juju151111
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Default Re: Where did Jordan rank all-time at age 31

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Originally Posted by jlauber
Not sure what that would have been based upon. Less rings, less MVPs, more losers, than MULTIPLE players to that point in his career.

And CAREERS have to count for something. To say MJ was better, at age 31, than EVERY other player is being ridiculous.
The losses were based on his team not being ready yet through. Mj had like 3 MVps already along with 3 chips in a row. His playoff stats was out of this world then.
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Old 06-09-2010, 04:34 PM   #20
ShaqAttack3234
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Default Re: Where did Jordan rank all-time at age 31

I remember after the first 3peat, Jordan was regarded by almost everyone in the media as the greatest ever and by his comeback, he was basically bigger than basketball.

As it is, I can't decide between Jordan and Kareem as far as greatest ever, but if you ask me now whose would rank higher, Kareem based on his career or Jordan based on his career up to age 31, I'd say Kareem without hesitation.

Other than Kareem, IMO, only Bird had a legit case against Jordan through 1993. He had just come off 3 legendary finals performances. I mean 31/7/11 with 3 stls per game and 1.4 bpg on 56% shooting while playing great defense on Magic, of course he torched Drexler the following year and then 41/9/6 on 51% shooting vs Phoenix.

Of course I was just a young kid then and I was in awe of Jordan, it's funny I remembered him killing the Knicks that year(probably because of that 54 point game), but when I looked back on the series years later, I found out he did have a few horrific shooting performances that series.
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Old 06-09-2010, 04:34 PM   #21
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Default Re: Where did Jordan rank all-time at age 31

jlauber, how old are you?
Not to be an ass, but I ask because your posts scream that you're like 17. Yes, when MJ retired at 31, he was widely considered the greatest player of all time. This clearly goes against your belief which is why you're so intent to argue the point, but it's just the way it was then and still is now.

Last edited by RapsFan : 06-09-2010 at 04:36 PM.
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Old 06-09-2010, 04:34 PM   #22
jlauber
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Default Re: Where did Jordan rank all-time at age 31

Quote:
Originally Posted by juju151111
The losses were based on his team not being ready yet through. Mj had like 3 MVps already along with 3 chips in a row. His playoff stats was out of this world then.

So three titles and three MVPs were better than Russell's 11 titles and five MVPs? Or Kareem's six rings and six MVPs?

Hell, might as well say he was the GOAT before he joined the NBA.
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Old 06-09-2010, 04:38 PM   #23
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Default Re: Where did Jordan rank all-time at age 31

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Originally Posted by jlauber
So three titles and three MVPs were better than Russell's 11 titles and five MVPs? Or Kareem's six rings and six MVPs?

Hell, might as well say he was the GOAT before he joined the NBA.

3 rings, 3 finals mvps, 3 mvps, 7 scoring titles, 3 steals crowns, a DPOY award, numerous regular season, playoff, and finals records, countless clutch performances, and having just set the all time playoff finals ppg record with 41.3 in 1993.

And all in only 9 seasons!

No wonder Magic, Isaiah, and many others considered Jordan GOAT even before he was 31.
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Old 06-09-2010, 04:38 PM   #24
Rake2204
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Default Re: Where did Jordan rank all-time at age 31

Quote:
Originally Posted by jlauber
Not sure what that would have been based upon. Less rings, less MVPs, more losers, than MULTIPLE players to that point in his career.

And CAREERS have to count for something. To say MJ was better, at age 31, than EVERY other player is being ridiculous.
I can't say what it was based on for sure either, but I'm just saying, the idea that Michael Jordan may be the best player of all-time back in '93 was kind of common knowledge. That doesn't mean he WAS the best of all-time at that point, but a whole lot of people believed that he was.

I'd have to say it was based on the fact that his game was so spectacular, electrifying and overwhelmingly effective. I believe there are a lot of people out there that believe ranking a players' all-time ability in the game of basketball has a whole lot to do with how skilled he was, not just whether his 11 other teammates were good enough to help him win a title.

Further, I think Jordan may have won five MVP's, but I do not believe that means he only deserved it those five times. I'm not convinced Karl Malone, for as good as he may have been, was ever more deserving of that award than MJ. MVP's surely count for a lot, but I do not believe the number of times rewarded truly represents a players' stance/stature within the game.

None of this is to say Kobe somehow lacks in any sort of area (as this seems to be a comparison thread). I just thought I'd throw out how people were feeling about Jordan at that point and why they may have felt that way.
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Old 06-09-2010, 04:38 PM   #25
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Default Re: Where did Jordan rank all-time at age 31

Quote:
Originally Posted by jlauber
Since people here are ripping the Kobe-MJ's comparsions...

where do you think MJ ranked, all-time, at age 31? Three rings, three losers, just lost in the playoffs. Very few records.

My guess is somewhere behind Russell, Magic, Kareem, Wilt, Bird, and maybe behind West and Oscar. Of course, Shaq was early on his career, and Duncan had not yet joined the NBA.

Just some food for thought as we ponder Kobe's career up to age 31.

Since people here are ripping the Kobe-MJ's comparsions...

where do you think MJ ranked, all-time, after his 14th season? Six rings, six finals MVPs, five MVPs.

My guess is, he was considered the greatest of all time by most.

Just some food for thought as we ponder Kobe's career up to his 14th season.
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Old 06-09-2010, 04:39 PM   #26
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Default Re: Where did Jordan rank all-time at age 31

Quote:
Originally Posted by RapsFan
How old are you?

Not to be an ass, but I ask because your posts scream that you're like 17. Yes, when MJ retired at 31, he was widely considered the greatest player of all time. This clearly goes against your belief which is why you're so intent to argue the point, but it's just the way it was then and still is now.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=409Pjtq7jzY

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GOAT QUOTE

"YOU WANT IT TO BE ONE WAY, BUT IT'S THE OTHER WAY""
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Old 06-09-2010, 04:39 PM   #27
juju151111
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Default Re: Where did Jordan rank all-time at age 31

Quote:
Originally Posted by jlauber
So three titles and three MVPs were better than Russell's 11 titles and five MVPs? Or Kareem's six rings and six MVPs?

Hell, might as well say he was the GOAT before he joined the NBA.
I said he was top 5 not #1 yet.West and Oscar wasn't on his level. LOL I have Russell low on my list, so for me he is already better then Russell.
I would say something like this
1.Kareem
2.Wilt
3.Magic
4.MJ
5.Bird

I wouldn't have problem with moving MJ up pass magic or below Bird.
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Old 06-09-2010, 04:44 PM   #28
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Default Re: Where did Jordan rank all-time at age 31

Larry bird called him god in the 86 playoffs.
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Old 06-09-2010, 04:45 PM   #29
jlauber
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Default Re: Where did Jordan rank all-time at age 31

Quote:
Originally Posted by juju151111
I said he was top 5 not #1 yet.West and Oscar wasn't on his level. LOL I have Russell low on my list, so for me he is already better then Russell.
I would say something like this
1.Kareem
2.Wilt
3.Magic
4.MJ
5.Bird

I wouldn't have problem with moving MJ up pass magic or below Bird.

Not a bad list, but certainly Russell would have ranked higher than MJ...and MANY STILL do.
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Old 06-09-2010, 04:54 PM   #30
alexandreben
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Default Re: Where did Jordan rank all-time at age 31

Quote:
Originally Posted by jlauber
Since people here are ripping the Kobe-MJ's comparsions...

where do you think MJ ranked, all-time, at age 31? Three rings, three losers, just lost in the playoffs. Very few records.

My guess is somewhere behind Russell, Magic, Kareem, Wilt, Bird, and maybe behind West and Oscar. Of course, Shaq was early on his career, and Duncan had not yet joined the NBA.

Just some food for thought as we ponder Kobe's career up to age 31.
Jlauber, this is a very interesting topic even if Kobe hasn't have the fifth ring at the age of 31(which I doubt he would). First of all, may I say, we have to consider era issue when we rank GOAT or compare players from different eras, see my post here:http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/sho...d.php?t=176884

For example, Dwight Howard has won two DPOY and a few times of All-NBA First Team and Defense Team as well, but if he played in the 90', it's very safe to say he would never made the first team and DPOY. Hence the era difference issue.

Jordan lost to Magic with a huge mistake but they didn't call him "Tragic Jordan" like "Tragic Magic", the media still loves him with some questions of course, David Stern still treated Jordan like a savior... remember that he was labeled the GOAT even before Bird and Magic retired, say the late 80' and 91'? and he still just 31 years old with three rings as "the man", even if Kobe won the fifth ring in 2010, which I highly doubt it, he still can't compare with Magic or Jordan because of the era issue, the hand-checking elimination and the quality of the defense and quantity and quality of superstars in the league, etc., not to mention he was not "the man" who won the tittle, "the man" was Shaq, Kobe is something like Pippen with 3 rings and Jordan with one ring..

The media and David Stern needed a next generation of Magic and Bird, consider the 31 years old age, Jordan would still be treated like GOAT which's totally a fake GOAT. Even Jordan with 6 rings, I don't consider he is the GOAT because of the era difference, he never proved himself in the 80' and lucky to play in the 90' which's a weak era compare with 80', same thing as Kobe.

Hence, of course, Jordan's definetely behind Russell, Chamberlain, Magic, Bird, etc. (West has a huge value added as the NBA logo, so I would put 31 years old Jordan equal to West, but Jordan should rank over big O)

BTW, In my opinion, the era ranking should be like this:
80's => 60's > 90's => 70's > 00's

What do you think?
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